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Author Topic: Pentax Digital 645  (Read 17147 times)
dng88
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« on: February 28, 2006, 05:34:46 AM »
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Any opinion yet?  It seems all news are 2005 except some mentioned 2006 PMA
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michael
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« Reply #1 on: February 28, 2006, 06:07:54 AM »
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This won't be a real product until the fall of this year at the earliest.

They had a mockup under glass at PMA this week.

It will have an 18 Megapixel sensor from Kodak.

The design is big and chunky.

If someone owns Pentax 645 lenses it could make sense for some shooting situations. But frankly, unless the price is right I have to wonder at who else its for.

Michael
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BernardLanguillier
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« Reply #2 on: February 28, 2006, 07:03:23 AM »
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Michael,

I feel that it is very much directed at the Japanese market where the 645 has a cult status among landscape shooters.

The fact that it was presented last year at the PIE in Tokyo is not a coincidence.

For most of these elderly guys, whatever you and the rest of the World says, a landscape camera has to be medium or large format, and it is much better if it is a Pentax!

Regards,
Bernard
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David Mantripp
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« Reply #3 on: February 28, 2006, 08:55:22 AM »
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Michael,

I feel that it is very much directed at the Japanese market where the 645 has a cult status among landscape shooters.

The fact that it was presented last year at the PIE in Tokyo is not a coincidence.

For most of these elderly guys, whatever you and the rest of the World says, a landscape camera has to be medium or large format, and it is much better if it is a Pentax!

Regards,
Bernard
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=59191\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Well I'm not Japanese, although I am one year older today.... but I'm quite interested in this. If it follows the film Pentax 645 as being "affordable MF", it could well appeal to the more financially challenged amateur market.
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David Mantripp
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« Reply #4 on: February 28, 2006, 06:37:21 PM »
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If it follows the film Pentax 645 as being "affordable MF", it could well appeal to the more financially challenged amateur market.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=59196\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Maybe their choice of the slightly smaller 33x44mm format (compared to 36x48, 37x49) is intended to give them a price edge for that market.
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David Mantripp
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« Reply #5 on: March 01, 2006, 07:22:57 AM »
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Maybe their choice of the slightly smaller 33x44mm format (compared to 36x48, 37x49) is intended to give them a price edge for that market.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=59251\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Spooky..... 44x33 - sounds like 4/3rds :-)

Some correlation here ?
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tsjanik
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« Reply #6 on: March 01, 2006, 07:27:35 AM »
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Greetings:

I for one would buy the camera; although it is largely due to my collection of 67 and 645 lenses (as Michael noted).  However beyond that, I am not correct in assuming that the Pentax should yield cleaner images vis-à-vis the 1Ds MkII based on the larger sensor size?   If so, would not the Pentax be a better choice for landscapes, or most static photographs where fps and autofocus speed are not significant factors, but dynamic range and noise are?  

Regards,

Thomas
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BJL
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« Reply #7 on: March 01, 2006, 05:42:06 PM »
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Spooky..... 44x33 - sounds like 4/3rds :-)

Some correlation here ?
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=59287\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Not really: outside of 35mm film format and its descendents, the 4:3 aspect ratio is widespred, even dominant, in photography (and in artist's drawing paper and in canvasses for painting):
- 645 medium format and all recent CCD's for use in MF and LF cameras
- almost all digital cameras in formats up to and including 4/3", which is to say about 95% of all digital cameras.

But MF probably came to 4:3 aspect ratio independently.

The mainstream digital cameras got it from computer monitors, which got it from TV screens, which got it from the early 35mm movie format of 24x18mm (before the arrival of "wide-screen", Cinemascope etc..)

Medium format probably got the 56x42.5mm, 4:3 shape of 645 format by using 120 roll film with its width of 56mm and length enough for 12 square frames, and cutting down to an oblong that fits closely to print formats like 8"x10" and 11"x14", getting 16 frames of 56x42.5mm. I wonder why they did not instead go for 15 frames per roll of 56x44mm, a slightly better fit to 8"x10" and a perfect fit for 11"x14"?


P. S. the 33x44mm dimensions do give a 55mm diagonal, fitting neatly with the existing Pentax 55/2.8 MF lens as the new "normal". And an autofocus update of that 55mm lens has just been announced this week: that is probably not a coincidence!
« Last Edit: March 01, 2006, 05:54:16 PM by BJL » Logged
pdstromberg
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« Reply #8 on: April 01, 2006, 02:24:06 AM »
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Hello,

As a newly registered one, I'm among those following the Pentax digital 645 saga because of a set of 645 lenses (including a pristine f5.6 600mm) that are crying to be used.  They are not AF, but I'm hoping a) that the story actually results in a product;  that if it does I can afford the camera; c) that my lenses will prove useful.  They are excellent pieces of glass.  The idea of 18 megs of output from that large a chip takes me back to images of large format resolution and smoothness.  Is that unrealistic?

Also finding it very difficult to find current information about what is happening on this topic.   This has been one of the best informed discussions around.

Don
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Dennishh
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« Reply #9 on: April 04, 2006, 09:53:48 PM »
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I hate to say this, but I called Pentax the other day about there not being anymore 35 FA lenses available and guess what. I was told that Pentax is discontinuing all production of 21/4 equipment and not coming out with the new digital 645 as publicized. I hope this isn't true, but that was what I was told.
Dennis
 
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William_Good
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« Reply #10 on: April 05, 2006, 08:51:33 AM »
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"The idea of 18 megs of output from that large a chip takes me back to images of large format resolution and smoothness.  Is that unrealistic?"

I was excited about a Pentax 645 18mp when the concept was first floated.
By the time it goes into production (a year?), I wonder how its 12bit, 18mp image will stand up to the competition of a new 22mp Canon, MF backs & what else?
William
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tsjanik
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« Reply #11 on: April 06, 2006, 11:15:49 AM »
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I hate to say this, but I called Pentax the other day about there not being anymore 35 FA lenses available and guess what. I was told that Pentax is discontinuing all production of 21/4 equipment and not coming out with the new digital 645 as publicized. I hope this isn't true, but that was what I was told.
Dennis
 
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Dennis:

Which Pentax office did you speak to?  The MF film cameras will no longer be imported to Europe, but Pentax is clearly intent on producing a 645D.  See recent (3/22/06)announcement on the Japan website:

[a href=\"http://www.pentax.co.jp/english/news/2006/200615.html]http://www.pentax.co.jp/english/news/2006/200615.html[/url]
« Last Edit: April 06, 2006, 11:17:09 AM by tsjanik » Logged
Let Biogons be Biogons
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« Reply #12 on: April 06, 2006, 06:50:59 PM »
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I wonder how its 12bit, 18mp image will stand up to the competition of a new 22mp Canon, MF backs & what else?
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=61876\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Again, the vestiges of this of heard, yet unsubstatiated rumor.  Didn't you hear, the MP race is over.  If the next DLSR Canon puts out is 22mp, I'll run up and down the street naked.  There is absolutely NO incentive for can to do this.  They have no competition at 16mp, and their lenses can barely handle 16mp. All the extra 6mp would get you is high cost, more engineering challenges, and bigger file sizes (without much increase in resolution since you're at the lenses limits).  This has oft been discussed, but the generall people think that Canon would be better off if they improved the image quality of the 16mp they have.

Then you could really ask yourself the question whether Pentax's 18mp really noticably better than Canon's 16mp -- that is a valid question and one that will no doubt be discussed.
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tsjanik
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« Reply #13 on: April 07, 2006, 02:50:49 PM »
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Then you could really ask yourself the question whether Pentax's 18mp really noticably better than Canon's 16mp -- that is a valid question and one that will no doubt be discussed.
[{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Apparently that is Pentax's thought as well

Ned Bunnell, Pentax's director of marketing doesn’t not want to give away all the details and calls the camera "important for studio, landscape and fashion photographers.” He continues by saying that the Kodak CCD “will deliver incredible dynamic range and clarity of image that will not be possible with smaller sensors” seems indirectly targeted at the 16 mega pixel Canon EOS 1Ds Mark II.” No word on pricing but it may just be the perfect camera for those who don't want to spend $20,000 on a medium format camera.

From: [a href=\"http://www.image-acquire.com/pentax/pentax_645d_review.html]http://www.image-acquire.com/pentax/pentax_645d_review.html[/url]
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Dennishh
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« Reply #14 on: April 07, 2006, 08:17:46 PM »
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The USA office and had the local rep call me back with the news. I guess Pentax doesn't know whats going on in Japan. I would like to see this new camera before Canon comes out with the 22mp. Also why did Pentax discontinue the 35FA 645 lens? All this news doesn't add up.
Dennis
« Last Edit: April 07, 2006, 08:19:57 PM by Dennishh » Logged
tsjanik
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« Reply #15 on: April 07, 2006, 09:16:01 PM »
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Dennis:

Regarding the 35mm FA: that’s a good question, given the reputation of the lens and the apparent number of people adapting it for use on a Canon digital.  I can only guess that lenses are made in batches and Pentax has decided not to start another production run.  Perhaps the lens doesn’t have a high profit margin and they feel the 35mm will not be a very popular focal length with a crop factor on the 645D.  This a company that named a camera *ist after all.
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Dennishh
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« Reply #16 on: April 07, 2006, 09:40:09 PM »
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Another reason could be that they are coming out with a new line of f2.8 lenses including a wider angle. All I wish is they would stop the we don't know why stuff.
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BJL
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« Reply #17 on: April 10, 2006, 02:34:20 PM »
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Also why did Pentax discontinue the 35FA 645 lens?
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=62127\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Here is a guess: the Pentax MF bodies will use a 33x44mm format sensor, 55mm diagonal, at least in the initial model, quite a bit smaller than the 42x46mm, 70mm diagonal of 645 film format.
So like any wide-angle lenses, the 35mm loses a lot of interest with the smaller format, costing far more than a 35mm lens designed purely for the 55mm image circle diameter of that sensor, or the 61mm of the largest MF sensors, Kodak's 37x49mm.

So maybe Pentax is planning new digital specific lenses like
1) A 35mm designed for the 55mm image circle diameter of that 33x44mm sensor, or the 61mm that seems likely to be the maximum image circle diameter in digital. Such a smaller image circle lens could be significantly lighter and less expensive.
2) Shorter focal length smaller image circle lenses like a 28mm, which would give the same angular FOV with 33x44m format as the 35mm did with 645 film format, or a 30mm which would give that same FOV when used with Kodak 37x49mm and Dalsa 36x48mm sensors.
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tsjanik
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« Reply #18 on: September 20, 2006, 09:13:49 PM »
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Announced:

http://www.pentax.co.jp/english/news/2006/200646.html
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heinrichvoelkel
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« Reply #19 on: September 21, 2006, 02:05:17 AM »
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Announced:

http://www.pentax.co.jp/english/news/2006/200646.html
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=77116\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


These guys from pentax are a funny bunch. Offer a 18 MP camera with a release date to be announced later and an upway path up to 30 MP to be announced later.

They should do it right away, offering a 22 MP model and a 30 MP model. if they keep the price of 8 grand for the small one or a little more, they would sell alot of those.
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