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Author Topic: Free lightroom version for RSP users  (Read 9718 times)
DarkPenguin
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« on: July 12, 2006, 01:01:56 PM »
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http://photoshopnews.com/2006/07/11/adobe-...e-of-pixmantic/

Q: Will there be special pricing for those who have invested in RawShooter | Premium?

A: We have listened closely to the opinions shared by customers on the Pixmantec forums and although Lightroom will provide a much broader range of functionality than RawShooter | Premium and will be offered at a higher price point, we will be offering a free downloadable version of Lightroom 1.0 to all customers who have purchased RawShooter | Premium.
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Eric Myrvaagnes
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« Reply #1 on: July 12, 2006, 08:43:47 PM »
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Ha! So take that, you Mac users. We PC guys get our reward for waiting while you all get the bugs out of it in the beta versions, and then you get to pay to upgrade to the Real Thing, while we (at least those of us who paid for RSP) get it free! Nyah-nyah!    

But we still have to wait for summer  

Eric
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katemann
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« Reply #2 on: July 12, 2006, 09:48:05 PM »
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"a free downloadable version of Lightroom 1.0"

Does this actually mean that Lightroom 1.0 in its entirety will be available as a downloaded upgrade for owners of Rawshooter Premium? Or is it "Lightroom 1.0 Light"?

Don't mean to split hairs, but my initial reading of the announcement was that the first version of Lightroom would be free to owners of RSPremium. And then I read the statement again and noted some possible ambiguity.

Anyone?
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DarkPenguin
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« Reply #3 on: July 12, 2006, 10:03:28 PM »
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I figured the "catch" would be that it would be a version that wouldn't count for cheap upgrades.  (Kind of like an educational version of photoshop can't be upgraded.)
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Richowens
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« Reply #4 on: July 12, 2006, 10:06:04 PM »
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Per Michael Tapes of Pixmantic it will be the fully functional, full version of Lightroom, the same as retail.
The difference will be that it is download only, no CD, no box, and no printed manual.

Rich
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Schewe
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« Reply #5 on: July 12, 2006, 10:59:04 PM »
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Not only will it be a free complete (download only) license, Adobe Camera Raw/Lighroom engineers are working on a way to transfer (to the best of their ability) RawShooter stored settings over to Lightroom and in the interim until Lightroom ships, doing one last camera compatibility rev of Raw-Shooter to include promised new cameras such as the Canon 30D.

Read what John Nack has to say on his blog: Adobe's Acquisition of Pixmantic: an FAQ.

BTW, Michael Jonsson's first few days at Adobe in San Jose were meetings with Zalman Stern and Thomas Knoll as well as others from the Camera Raw and Lightroom teams...I expect that to have been an interesting series of meetings. Maybe worth a Jardine Podcast?

:~)
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katemann
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« Reply #6 on: July 13, 2006, 07:28:20 AM »
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Thank you all, I noted, on Adobe's forum, that it not only will be a free downloadable version 1.0 but the upgrade path to version 2.0 will be the same as it will be for purchasers. Thank you Adobe. That was a honourable and generous solution for those of us who are happy with Pixmantec's software.

I am looking forward to Lightroom - it seems to be a wonderful solution to bring together all the various applications in my workflow.

I presently own iMatch - I expect that it will become redundant.
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DarkPenguin
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« Reply #7 on: July 13, 2006, 11:23:14 AM »
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Seriously cool.

Now get busy and make sure that auto ca correction from RSP gets into lightroom.
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alfin
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« Reply #8 on: July 13, 2006, 01:34:06 PM »
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Seriously cool.

Now get busy and make sure that auto ca correction from RSP gets into lightroom.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=70584\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Start with detail extraction first! Please Adobe, Detail Extraction first! We already have CA correction in ARC/LR.
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BernardLanguillier
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« Reply #9 on: July 13, 2006, 05:44:03 PM »
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This is good news, now it is still unclear to me what happens to these users that are mostly interested in the DMA part of Lightroom, but do not want to use one RAW converter only (ACR or RSP Adobe).

There were talks about a plug in approach where other vendors would be able to inegrate their converters into Lightroom. Does anyone know where we are on this?

Regards,
Bernard
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Schewe
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« Reply #10 on: July 13, 2006, 07:29:31 PM »
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That ain't gonna happen...3rd party modules will be for added functionality, not to replace the Camera Raw/Lightroom raw processing pipeline. And the SDK for 3rd parties won't be published until after version 1.0 ships...
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Ronny Nilsen
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« Reply #11 on: July 14, 2006, 01:27:26 AM »
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That ain't gonna happen...3rd party modules will be for added functionality, not to replace the Camera Raw/Lightroom raw processing pipeline. And the SDK for 3rd parties won't be published until after version 1.0 ships...
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=70620\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

No 3rd party RAW processing plugin is both good an bad news I think.  

It means that there will be a market for 3rd party RAW sw from other vendors even after LR ships (bibble etc.). But it also means that LR may not become an industry platform for RAW conversion the way PS is for image editing.

But on the other hand, if the RAW engine in LR becomes as good, or better, than all other programs, it may become the norm anyway, but I would have liked to be able to buy a RAW converter plugin from a 3rd party.
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BernardLanguillier
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« Reply #12 on: July 14, 2006, 09:55:27 AM »
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That ain't gonna happen...3rd party modules will be for added functionality, not to replace the Camera Raw/Lightroom raw processing pipeline. And the SDK for 3rd parties won't be published until after version 1.0 ships...
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=70620\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Hi Jeff,

Thanks for the reply.

If that means that raw files managed by Lightroom will have to be converted with the native Lightroom raw engine, then that's probably the end of the Lightroom story as far as I am concerned.

What I would personnally like to see is a DB with most of lightroom capabilities for file searching, sorting, slide shows, web albums creation... but with the possibility to use any compatible raw converter:

1. For browsing (RSP is probably best),
2. For actual conversion whose output would be stored back in the DB with links to the original RAW file (Capture NX being best for Nikon files).

I would be willing to forgive many shortcomings if this basic capability were available.

Cheers,
Bernard
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Schewe
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« Reply #13 on: July 14, 2006, 10:26:48 AM »
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If that means that raw files managed by Lightroom will have to be converted with the native Lightroom raw engine, then that's probably the end of the Lightroom story as far as I am concerned.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=70676\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Then that's the end of the story...it ain't gonna happen.
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bjanes
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« Reply #14 on: July 14, 2006, 10:40:55 AM »
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Not only will it be a free complete (download only) license, Adobe Camera Raw/Lighroom engineers are working on a way to transfer (to the best of their ability) RawShooter stored settings over to Lightroom and in the interim until Lightroom ships, doing one last camera compatibility rev of Raw-Shooter to include promised new cameras such as the Canon 30D.

BTW, Michael Jonsson's first few days at Adobe in San Jose were meetings with Zalman Stern and Thomas Knoll as well as others from the Camera Raw and Lightroom teams...I expect that to have been an interesting series of meetings. Maybe worth a Jardine Podcast?

:~)
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=70534\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

While the ability of Lightroom to access the RawShooter settings would be helpful to former users of RawShooter and probably not that difficult to accomplish, I would think that incorporating the best features of the RawShooter engine into ACR would be a bit more difficult. Do you think that these features will be present in the 1.0 release of Lightroom?
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Schewe
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« Reply #15 on: July 14, 2006, 03:50:06 PM »
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Do you think that these features will be present in the 1.0 release of Lightroom?
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=70681\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Way too early to tell-particulalry for "1.0". But, I do know that "stuff" -WILL- be incorporated from RawShooter "in the future". Whether than means 1.0 or future revs of Lightroom and Camera Raw, I can't say. But cool things are happening according to my sources...

:~)
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Mark D Segal
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« Reply #16 on: July 14, 2006, 08:42:34 PM »
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Way too early to tell-particulalry for "1.0". But, I do know that "stuff" -WILL- be incorporated from RawShooter "in the future". Whether than means 1.0 or future revs of Lightroom and Camera Raw, I can't say. But cool things are happening according to my sources...

:~)
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=70714\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

The only cool thing I would like to see happen is a bit of honesty in the Corporate Boardroom. I recently bought a license for RawShooter Premium because it has some neat features that may help some images and I am not sure whether they will be taken into Lightroom (for Windows). They sent me a license key that is completely disfunctional. Try to communicate with Pixmantec to get it fixed - impossible - they simply don't respond. All you get is auto-response signed by Kenneth Laerke, Pixmantec CEO.

Adobe only took them over two weeks ago. Normally there are transition periods for the business of one company to be absorbed into that of the other - as there is in this case because Pixmantec is still selling their current products. Since when do they have the right to evade their corporate responsibilities for customer service simply because they are now owned by Adobe? Of course the new ownership arrangement also makes Adobe Inc. answerable for Pixmantec's corporate irresponsibility. I shall be raising this issue to the senior management level at Adobe, because Pixmantec has extracted 60 dollars from me for nothing and on principle I don't like that.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
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Schewe
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« Reply #17 on: July 14, 2006, 10:24:57 PM »
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The only cool thing I would like to see happen is a bit of honesty in the Corporate Boardroom. I recently bought a license for RawShooter Premium because it has some neat features that may help some images and I am not sure whether they will be taken into Lightroom (for Windows). They sent me a license key that is completely disfunctional. Try to communicate with Pixmantec to get it fixed - impossible - they simply don't respond. All you get is auto-response signed by Kenneth Laerke, Pixmantec CEO.
[{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Then I would suggest asking for help on the Pixmantec forums for help...if you bought your license before the take over announcement, you're certainly entitled to a working license. But I don't know what "Corporate Boardroom" your are talking about and your implication of dishonesty is a real stretch. Have you even tried using the E-Store support offered by element 5 (a Digital River affiliate) that handled Pixmanec's online sales?

Adobe had Pixmantec quit selling RawShooter Premium as soon as the announcement was made. You can still buy the Color Engine and the free version is still available as well. Pixmantec is still hosting the user forums and Michael Tapes is still posting-at least through the end of this month.

The [a href=\"http://www.pixmantec.com/forums/ubbthreads.php]Pixmantec Forums[/url]
element 5 web site
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Mark D Segal
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« Reply #18 on: July 15, 2006, 07:48:46 AM »
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Jeff, please - let me describe several FACTS before you light into me about questioning the integrity of an operation:

(1) I bought the disfunctional license early this week. They were therefore still SELLING PRODUCT well after the take-over. If they continue to sell the product they have a commercial obligation to offer at least a modicum of direct rapid response to make the license key usable. (OPINION: I can't believe I'm the first person to have this problem.)

(2) In the emails that come back after buying the license, the division of labour for support between Element 5 and Pixmantec is stated. They tell you that Pixmantec is responsible for issuing the license keys, amongst other things, and they provide links to both Pixmentec for their issues and Element 5 for their issues. Fine so far. When I need help I first check who is responsible for which aspects and address myself to the appropriate party, which in this case seemed very much to be Pixmantec, so I used that link.

(3) I did go through the process of filling their web support form for assistance and all I got back was an Auto-Response signed by the CEO directing me to an FAQ list that had no posted solution to this issue, so I was caught in a catch-22.

(Turning for a moment from FACT to OPINION: When that kind of thing happens, one is entitled to get concerned about who is up to what. I know companies need to turn a profit and streamlining operations is a good place to start, but not at the expense of something as basic as a workable license key one has paid for. I don't like being given the run-around and I am sure you don't either. It is really not an honest way of doing business; but in light of what is just below, I am quite prepared to consider that it may simply be a customer support design that is prone to confusion rather than a customer support "design-out".)

(4) The free version does not include certain features, such as the Vibrancy control, which is one of the most interesting aspects of this converter. Hence if one wants the "full-monty", one buys it, and the price is truly very reasonable, so why not? (I only got introduced to this piece of software very recently and was impressed enough with some of its features to understand at least one reason why Adobe bought them out.)

Anyhow, Jeff, being pragmatic at heart, I clicked on the link you provided, and lo and behold, that took me into another stimulus-response chain I was not led to the first time around.  I have now engaged it, and I shall be pleased to report back whether it yields a successful outcome.

Final reflection for now: It would have been so easy if like some other companies in this business they simply sent me a fix instead of a wild goose-chase.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
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Mark D Segal
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« Reply #19 on: July 15, 2006, 08:45:57 AM »
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Hi Jeff,

Back again with the response from the chain you recommended to me:

<<Dear Customer,

Thank you for your inquiry regarding technical support.

If the license key you received by e-mail is rejected when you try to
enter it into the system, please check whether the information you entered is
correct.

To avoid errors when entering the information, highlight the entire
license key using your mouse, right-click and select Copy. To paste the key
into the browser's address field, select Paste.  Instead of using the mouse,
you can also copy the link using the keyboard by pressing CTRL + c to copy
and CTRL + v to paste (Windows), or  Command + c and Command + v for
Macintosh.

If the license key is still being rejected, please contact the software
publisher directly. The publisher is responsible for technical or
product related support. You can find the publisher's contact address in your
e-mail order notification, .....................>>

So they've been gracious enough to teach me how to do copy/paste and they sent me back to Pixmantec - where I CORRECTLY started, which then sends me an auto-response that doesn't deal with the matter. So I am back to "square-1".

I'm not going to decorate this experience with any more adjectives, because obviously the adjectives may be controversial and I don't wish to upset my colleagues on this web forum. People can draw their own conclusions. I'm simply going to send a fax to Adobe's Senior Management asking them to rectify the matter, because they own it - for better or for worse.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
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