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Author Topic: any news on the HDV 90x?  (Read 7214 times)
paul_jones
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« on: October 19, 2006, 02:33:38 AM »
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will this work on the H1 and H2?


cheers paul
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paul_jones
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« Reply #1 on: October 19, 2006, 01:59:54 PM »
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i have just got an email from hasselblad, and it wont work.

the software reasoning for the 28mm not working on other backs is one thing, but why do they have to make the view finders incompatible as well?

paul
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Steve Kerman
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« Reply #2 on: October 19, 2006, 05:02:19 PM »
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Something people have talked around, but haven't gotten to directly that I've seen, is this:  Imacon bought Hasselblad for the purpose of improving the market for Imacon backs.  It was not Hasselblad that bought Imacon for the purpose of increasing the market for Hasselblad cameras.

The actions of the new "Hasselblad" reflect exactly that:  Hasselblad is now a vehicle that exists solely for the purpose of selling Imacon backs.  Any action or feature that might serve to support any other back detracts from that goal, and one would expect them to avoid any such actions or features.
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damien
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« Reply #3 on: October 19, 2006, 05:08:39 PM »
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This then implies, that because Imacon backs are a long way off market leading quality,  this must surely mean the end of the road for Hasselblad. What a way to go, strangled by a lack of compatability. Am I missing something?

Damien.
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rethmeier
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« Reply #4 on: October 19, 2006, 05:21:28 PM »
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I'm curious about some people disliking the Imacon backs?
Hasn't anybody tested these backs?
Also I would assume that anybody that would fork out $ for an H3D would certainly take it for a test
drive ,before signing that cheque!

Just a thought!


Willem.
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Willem Rethmeier
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damien
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« Reply #5 on: October 19, 2006, 05:31:47 PM »
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Great Idea. Where can I get hold of one to test drive? The P45+ will be out first I expect and it will be the H4D before Imacon catch up with that. Of course this is only speculation. It is in none of our interests to see the Imacon perform less well than the P45+ but what is the chance of it being the better?
Damien.
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H1/P25 -35mm,80mm,100mm,210mm
Nikon D200 - 17-35,28-70,70-200VR all at f2.8
Canon 5D - 16-35,24-70,70-200IS all at f2.8
Ex Rollei 6008 kit, Hass V kit, Mamiya 645 pro TL kit.
Nick_T
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« Reply #6 on: October 19, 2006, 05:33:29 PM »
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This then implies, that because Imacon backs are a long way off market leading quality,  this must surely mean the end of the road for Hasselblad. What a way to go, strangled by a lack of compatability. Am I missing something?

Damien.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=81229\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Hi Damien
First off the H2 continues to support ANY back out there and will continue to do so, rumours notwithstanding.

Second what exactly do you mean by "Imacon backs are a long way off market leading quality"?
All the side by sides I have seen put them on a par with all the other backs.

Nick_T
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yaya
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« Reply #7 on: October 19, 2006, 05:38:43 PM »
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Something people have talked around, but haven't gotten to directly that I've seen, is this:  Imacon bought Hasselblad for the purpose of improving the market for Imacon backs.  It was not Hasselblad that bought Imacon for the purpose of increasing the market for Hasselblad cameras.

Just the facts on who's bought who:

http://www.grafixgear.com/index.php?option...&id=34&Itemid=2
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hcubell
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« Reply #8 on: October 19, 2006, 06:06:38 PM »
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Hi Damien
Second what exactly do you mean by "Imacon backs are a long way off market leading quality"?
All the side by sides I have seen put them on a par with all the other backs.

Nick_T
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=81234\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

This is not a topic that seems to generate much interest or at least knowledge on the part of those that may really know the answers from side by side testing in real world applications. It seems much more satisfying to express anger about Hasselblad's approach with the H3.
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damien
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« Reply #9 on: October 19, 2006, 06:17:36 PM »
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Hi Nick,

I do hope you are right. I heared somewhere on this forum that the H2 was dropped. I hope it isn't, and that Hasselblad continue to develop a "universal" body, for their sake.

I read here about a lack of quality parity and about skin tones in particular. I must admit I'd like to try an H3D for myself to see how it stacks up. Have you seen any files from the H3D? As C1 is becoming DNG compatible I should be able to keep my workflow and use Imacon if the quality is spot on. I already have the HC lenses I need, and in a years time I'll be ready for upgrade from my well used P25 to something faster and more sensitive. An H3 (non integrated) would be good.

Damien.
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www.lovegroveconsulting.com
H1/P25 -35mm,80mm,100mm,210mm
Nikon D200 - 17-35,28-70,70-200VR all at f2.8
Canon 5D - 16-35,24-70,70-200IS all at f2.8
Ex Rollei 6008 kit, Hass V kit, Mamiya 645 pro TL kit.
Nick_T
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« Reply #10 on: October 19, 2006, 06:30:51 PM »
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Hi Nick,

I do hope you are right. I heared somewhere on this forum that the H2 was dropped. I hope it isn't, and that Hasselblad continue to develop a "universal" body, for their sake.

I read here about a lack of quality parity and about skin tones in particular. I must admit I'd like to try an H3D for myself to see how it stacks up. Have you seen any files from the H3D? As C1 is becoming DNG compatible I should be able to keep my workflow and use Imacon if the quality is spot on. I already have the HC lenses I need, and in a years time I'll be ready for upgrade from my well used P25 to something faster and more sensitive. An H3 (non integrated) would be good.

Damien.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=81241\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Hi Damien
I can assure you that the H1(H2) has NOT been dropped, far from it.

The skin tone thing is old news, certainly the old Imacon back/software combo gave pretty lousy skintones but that was probably 18 months ago. The new stuff is very good. I'll contact you off-line to get an H3D39 file to you.
Georgeous work on your site BTW.
Nick_T
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BJL
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« Reply #11 on: October 20, 2006, 01:54:25 PM »
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why do they have to make the view finders incompatible as well?

paul
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=81205\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
If you want viewfinder backward compatability, use the HV 90x, which is for the 42.4x56mm frame size of 645 film format and will continue to be avaiable for users of 645 film backs wiht the H3D.

The HVD 90x instead covers the slightly smaller roughly 37x49mm frame of the H3D's digital back, with higher enlargement so that the VF image is the same size as with the HV 90x and 645 film. The D version presumably also does light metering only over that "48mm" frame, rather than also measuring spurious light from outside that frame but within the "56mm" frame of 645 format.
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damien
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« Reply #12 on: October 20, 2006, 03:01:30 PM »
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Hi Nick,

Thanks for your kind words about my pictures. I'm glad Hasselblad are continuing the H2 series as well. When I bought my P25, Imacon were not part of Hasselblad and they only had a tethered to a 'brick' option. A year later I saw the files from the first Hasselblad CF card 22mp and was not impressed. I am sure they have got better as you say. I'll be interested to see how the H3D compares with the P45+ on an H1 / H2.

I am interested in seeing an 800 iso file or failing that a 400 iso file. I rarely shoot below 400.

Regards,

Damien.
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www.lovegroveconsulting.com
H1/P25 -35mm,80mm,100mm,210mm
Nikon D200 - 17-35,28-70,70-200VR all at f2.8
Canon 5D - 16-35,24-70,70-200IS all at f2.8
Ex Rollei 6008 kit, Hass V kit, Mamiya 645 pro TL kit.
Gary Ferguson
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« Reply #13 on: October 20, 2006, 03:18:57 PM »
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Something people have talked around, but haven't gotten to directly that I've seen, is this: Imacon bought Hasselblad for the purpose of improving the market for Imacon backs. It was not Hasselblad that bought Imacon for the purpose of increasing the market for Hasselblad cameras.
The actions of the new "Hasselblad" reflect exactly that: Hasselblad is now a vehicle that exists solely for the purpose of selling Imacon backs. Any action or feature that might serve to support any other back detracts from that goal, and one would expect them to avoid any such actions or features.

You're right. Given that Hasselblad outsource almost all camera manufacturing including the V series 503CW, and they've just delisted the 905 SWC which was pretty much the last "Swedish" camera, they're really just a badge assembler.

Today's medium format profit is all in the backs, not in the cameras. Especially as the replacement cycle for backs (so far at least) is far more frequent than for cameras. And it must grate that even though Hasselblad are almost synonymous with medium format cameras the arriviste Phase One, just over the border in Denmark, is outselling them in profitable backs by three or four to one.

Who'd have thought that Capture One software would have delivered greater leverage for professional hardware sales than the mighty Hasselblad name?
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BJL
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« Reply #14 on: October 20, 2006, 03:54:42 PM »
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... Hasselblad outsource almost all camera manufacturing including the V series 503CW ...
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=81409\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Is that so? I thought that all the older V system stuff like the venerable 503CW was Swedish made, with just the H series being a joint venture dominated by Fujifilm. Then again, maybe that is exactly why the 503CW is the last man standing: models made in Sweden went first, leaving the less expensive out-sourced product as the last commercially viable one.

Where is the 503CW made?

Not that manufacturing location bothers me: high precision manufacturing is not a Teutonic monopoly, and I imagine that Japanese companies in particular can (and do) make cameras and lenses to equally high standards when the intended selling price is high enough to justify the fastidious effort.
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Photomangreg
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« Reply #15 on: October 21, 2006, 03:19:53 PM »
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Great Idea. Where can I get hold of one to test drive? The P45+ will be out first I expect and it will be the H4D before Imacon catch up with that. Of course this is only speculation. It is in none of our interests to see the Imacon perform less well than the P45+ but what is the chance of it being the better?
Damien.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=81233\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


Damien,

The H3D is out and shipping, I had a demo with Steve Hendrix and a Hasselblad rep in Atlanta this past week with the 28mm lens.  The new lens distortion correction is amazing!
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Morgan_Moore
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« Reply #16 on: October 21, 2006, 03:45:36 PM »
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The H3D is out and shipping, I had a demo with Steve Hendrix and a Hasselblad rep in Atlanta this past week with the 28mm lens.  [a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=81547\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Did anyone try the 28 on an H1/2 or try a third party back on the H3d ??
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Sam Morgan Moore Cornwall
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« Reply #17 on: October 21, 2006, 04:16:54 PM »
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Did anyone try the 28 on an H1/2 or try a third party back on the H3d ??
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=81548\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Morgan:

I know we talked about doing that - but frankly we got so caught up in everything else, that I satisfied myself with asking Greg Hollman (one of the Hasselblad guys that was here) what happens in either case, and you basically get a lens error if you put the 28mm on an H1/H2 and you get a magazine error if you put a P25 (or Aptus or Sinar, etc) on an H3D (minus the D).

The distortion correction was pretty amazing - the interesting thing was I had no idea how much images were affected by the distortion until I checked/un-checked the shots we did and looked at the before and after. We shot with the 28mm, the 35mm, the 80mm and the 150mm. All of the lenses displayed distortion (some more than others), and the distortion correction feature instantly corrected each image.

Steve Hendrix
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Steve Hendrix
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« Reply #18 on: October 21, 2006, 04:18:12 PM »
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Did anyone try the 28 on an H1/2 or try a third party back on the H3d ??
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=81548\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Well anyone going to share any samples of the images off of the H3d? What is the delivery timeframe of the 28mm lens?

Dg
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Morgan_Moore
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« Reply #19 on: October 21, 2006, 05:07:09 PM »
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I know we talked about doing that - but frankly we got so caught up in everything else,[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=81549\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Shame maybe next time

See I have a mish mash of different lenses, white screws, black screws, and an H1 some of them - dont know which - start up fine but give lens error when changed while the blad is on

I really want someone to try it - it may start up but crash on changes which would mean a restart a pain but useable

Nice to hear that the distortion dongle works well - shame hassy dont want to flog me some stuff  - I am in the market for a 28 but not a back

----------

(For those who dont know H1 lenses have chrome screws and chipped up to H2 have black screws I think)
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Sam Morgan Moore Cornwall
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