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Author Topic: Canon 5D Vs 1Ds,Again!!  (Read 25583 times)
Photon-hunter
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« on: October 23, 2006, 11:57:09 AM »
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Hi

Last week I posted regarding the purchase of a second body (currently own 20D) for fine art BW printing.Nearly everybody pointed out the 5D way and I was about to proceed when a fantastic,very new 1Ds (MK I, not the 16Mp MK II) at a superb price came my way...Ah, temptation!!

I think FF would be a fantastic companion for my 20 with which I´ve been very happy.

I am not interested in a faster camera, I shoot slowly and mainly(very) long exposures, slow review and a smaller LCD are no problem for me.

Robust build and 100% viewfinder coverage atract me most from the 1DS.

Battery compatibility(20D),similar menus and weight/size atract me from 5D

I am most interested in the ISO 50 capability of this cameras and would love to hear your opinions.

I will hardly ever shoot above ISO 200, so any noise advantage of the 5D wont matter to me.Advantages at 50 or 100 ISO (Long exposures) would REALLY mater to me.

All my pictures are turned into BW so any opinions in DR or tonallity would be most appreciated.

The MP difference between this cameras means nothing to me.

Please help me out as I seem to have decision-paralysis right now!!

Thanks in advance, Erik.
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K.C.
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« Reply #1 on: October 24, 2006, 02:14:56 AM »
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I shoot with a 1Ds MKI at 100 ISO, occasionally at 200, and get great images. I did some comparison shots with the 1Ds MKII and a 5D and saw no reason to make a change. I shoot a lot of fashion and people, clients love the quality.

Now compared to a 20D, well that's another story. You'll be glad you upgraded no matter which camera you choose. The 20D/30D is amazing for what it cost and when it hit the market, but it's nothing like the real pro cameras, neither is the 5D in my opinion.

Quality is a personal perception, mine's based on 30 years of shooting with Hasselblad, Lecia, SINAR and Arca Swiss.
« Last Edit: October 24, 2006, 02:17:23 AM by K.C. » Logged
Ben Rubinstein
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« Reply #2 on: October 24, 2006, 06:33:13 AM »
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Iso 50 in both cameras is a software dodge, it is not a real iso 50 and you lose a stop of DR in the highlights. Far better to use an ND filter if you need a lower shutter speed. The noise of my 1Ds when using 1 sec + shutter speeds is about 2 iso speeds worse than my 5D AT LEAST, personally I believe that the 1Ds is noiser by a significant amount at iso 100 not only the higher iso's.
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geesbert
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« Reply #3 on: October 24, 2006, 06:43:08 AM »
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although the built quality of the 1 series is superb, the user inerface is a royal pain. after 2 years of 1ds MK1 i got rid of it, i never really got used to it.  the images are fantastic, but things like changing focus points is much better implemented in the 5d. i cannot eever recall cganging a setting accidentially with my 5d, but i can recall many times fumbling with the 1ds (especially in darkness) not finding the right setting.

if you're used to the 20d, switching to the 5d easy.
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Photon-hunter
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« Reply #4 on: October 24, 2006, 12:52:43 PM »
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I thank you all for your kind replies, though I must tell you people you are making my decision quite tough...  

Curiously enough, In Mr. Reichman´s initial review of the 1Ds he did state that the camera had virtually NO NOISE,(NADA,ZERO,ZIP,NONE) at low ISOs (100,200,400) and very aceptable-usable at 800 and even 1600...

A lot of discussion happened during the years the 1Ds was Canon´s flag-ship regarding noise and banding and very oposed opinions could be read elsewhere..a lot of people claming it was just "noise in the web" and other people claming they were real issues...

Truth is plenty of pros. worked and earned a living with it(and still do) with great success and superb imaginery, which only makes my decision tougher!!

Again I thank you all for your time and kindness.

All the best, Erik.
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Ben Rubinstein
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« Reply #5 on: October 24, 2006, 01:24:22 PM »
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Erik, the majority of pro's who used one didn't like to have to go over iso 400 it was so noisy, my 10D beats the 1Ds hands down without a question for noise at iso 100. My 5D thrashes it. I shoot weddings/events/portraiture for a living with some landscape stuff on the side (as a hobby) so I've used these cameras in many arenas. As I mentioned, any long exposures start to look really ugly noise wise even at iso 100. As far as banding is concerned at anything worse than a stop of underexposure there is purple/green banding in the frame, large bars of it. I rented another 1Ds to see if it was just mine but it was in that one as well and was confirmed by many who owned and shot with one.

Many pros used it when it was the best in the marketplace, the only in the marketplace. That doesn't mean that in any way it was perfect or lacking in serious issues which were fixed with the next generation of cameras. The 1Ds was the first DSLR that could convince pros to give up on film. However much it was an icon in the advance of digital photography and earned a deserved place in the future history books and museums, it was anything but flawless.

The only pros I've ever heard of still using this camera instead of the 5D or 1Ds mkII are studio photographers working exclusively at iso 100 with controlled lighting. They like it for it's skin tones, colour and the nature of the AA filter compared to next generation. They are not using it because the buffer, speed, etc is 'good enough'.

My advice would be to get hold on one and try it out, don't rely on what others say...
« Last Edit: October 24, 2006, 01:25:44 PM by pom » Logged

bing
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« Reply #6 on: October 24, 2006, 01:49:33 PM »
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wait a few months and buy1Ds Mk2s as they are handed in for trade ins
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K.C.
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« Reply #7 on: October 24, 2006, 04:00:44 PM »
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Quote
my 10D beats the 1Ds hands down without a question for noise at iso 100. My 5D thrashes it.

You've got a bad 1Ds if that's the case. I've shot side by side with a pair of 10Ds I used to have and a rented 5D, the 1Ds was better than the 10Ds and essentially the same as the 5D.

And of course it's all about the rest of the chain, light, contrast and subject.
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K.C.
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« Reply #8 on: October 24, 2006, 04:10:36 PM »
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« Last Edit: October 26, 2006, 02:15:35 AM by K.C. » Logged
pobrien3
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« Reply #9 on: October 24, 2006, 07:27:14 PM »
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Ben, I'm amazed that your 10D beats the 1D for noise.  I too have the 10D and shoot a lot of stage events, so use high ISO / low speeds all the time, and my 1Ds2 performs far, far better than the 10D.
Peter
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framah
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« Reply #10 on: October 25, 2006, 04:37:10 PM »
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My main camera is the 1Ds and I have shot exposures of as much as 25 seconds and have NEVER seen any banding of any sort from this camera. I also then printed these shots at 18x24 and have no problems with them.
 If I had ever seen any banding, I would have sent it to Canon the next day as there would obviously be something wrong with it.

All of the talk about user interface depends on how much you want the camera to do for you.  Pretty much all digital cameras seem to have way too many buttons and wheels on them. Best to sit down and memorize them till they are second nature.  There are a boatload of custom functions you can set on this thing but in my opinion, they are just fluff for the person who likes to watch the technology at work.

I have my camera set for auto shutter speed and I set my aperture for how much I want in focus. I was a long time user of a Nikon F3 and I always loved the fact that it did as little as possible and still gave me great shots.

This stuff of having numerous focusing points and such is not really necessary. Set it for center weighting and shoot.
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cescx
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« Reply #11 on: October 26, 2006, 01:30:17 AM »
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I do not know the 1ds... I shoot with the 5D and 1ds MK2, the 24x36 CMOS is a very reason to purchase any, more detail, more lens coverage, and, the 5D, is a great tool, see the image atached at 50 ISo 100% corp is virtualy noise free and super detailed.
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Francesc Costa
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« Reply #12 on: October 26, 2006, 04:37:12 AM »
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Ben, I'm amazed that your 10D beats the 1D for noise.  I too have the 10D and shoot a lot of stage events, so use high ISO / low speeds all the time, and my 1Ds2 performs far, far better than the 10D.
Peter
Peter, the 1Ds MkII is well-known for performing far, far better than the 1Ds, too.
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Jan
Julian Love
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« Reply #13 on: October 30, 2006, 02:07:35 PM »
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I tried a 5D when it came out last year, and was using a 1Ds at the time. My thoughts, and some comparison photos at idfferent ISOs are here at my website:

The 5D appeared to have about a 1.5 stop noise advantage, but you could really only notice it at ISO 400+ and in prints at 800+.....the 1Ds produces wonderful images, but you have to get the exposure accurate. If you alter the exposure in post porocessing then articfacts and noise quickly appear.

FWIW, I upgraded to a 1Ds2. Couldn't go back to the "prosumer" layout. Wish the 1Ds2 was the size of the 5D though...

Julian
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