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Author Topic: Phase P30 at High ISO ??  (Read 4485 times)
erikhillard
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« on: October 25, 2006, 08:54:54 PM »
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A client of mine would like to use the Phase One P30 back at high iso on an upcoming job.  ie ISO 400 and/or 800.  Has anyone been using this back at such high isos?  How is the noise level?  

Thanks in advance..

Best,
Erik Hillard
« Last Edit: October 26, 2006, 08:00:21 AM by erikhillard » Logged


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william
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« Reply #1 on: October 26, 2006, 08:43:14 AM »
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I shot one test frame with the P30 the other night at ISO 400 in natural light just to see fo rmyself.  I'd say ISO 400 is barely acceptable in terms of noise.  I wouldn't want to use ISO 800 unless absolutley necessary.  Noise reduction software can help, of course, but I'm talking about the unprocessed file.  (I should note that the image I shot was also underexposed a bit, so that contributed to the noise, but still...)  The comparable image shot with my Canon 5D at ISO 800 shows little noise straight out of the camera (no noise reduction).  I'm really hoping that Phase can get the high ISO noise under control in the Plus series backs.  I should note that, at low ISO, the P30 is amazingly clean (and produces incredible images generally), while the 5D can actually shows some noise and "muddiness" in the shadows even at low ISOs.

A JPEG of the P30 shot (with 1 stop of exposure compensation in Capture One) is below.  (It's small; I dont know what the size limitations are for attachments here)




Quote
A client of mine would like to use the Phase One P30 back at high iso on an upcoming job. ie ISO 400 and/or 800. Has anyone been using this back at such high isos? How is the noise level?

Thanks in advance..

Best,
Erik Hillard
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« Last Edit: October 26, 2006, 08:44:16 AM by william » Logged
damien
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« Reply #2 on: October 30, 2006, 11:28:15 AM »
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I shot loads of pictures at 800 iso on the P30 and it was amazing. It was as good as my P25 at 400. It has far less noise than 400 iso 120 film. It just depends what you want in your images.

Damien.
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william
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« Reply #3 on: October 30, 2006, 11:55:04 AM »
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Very nice work on your site, Damien.

Are you saying that your find ISO 800 on the P30 "amazing" prior to any noise reduction, i.e., straight out of the camera?  I really found even 400 to have quite a bit of noise.  Again, I'll test again under better conditions, but I wasn't impressed with the high ISO performance at all.

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I shot loads of pictures at 800 iso on the P30 and it was amazing. It was as good as my P25 at 400. It has far less noise than 400 iso 120 film. It just depends what you want in your images.

Damien.
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Willow Photography
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« Reply #4 on: October 30, 2006, 01:48:05 PM »
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I shot loads of pictures at 800 iso on the P30 and it was amazing. It was as good as my P25 at 400. It has far less noise than 400 iso 120 film. It just depends what you want in your images.

Damien.
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This realy shows how important it is to test one self before buying.
Someones amazing 800 ISO is another mans useless 800 ISO.

I bought a P30 myself a week ago, and it was absolutly not because of great 800 ISO.
To be honest I didnt even test 800 ISO, only 400 ISO.
I think even 400 ISO is too noisy. But I am coming from
Canon 5D and are probably spoiled with that performance.

Willow

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awofinden
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« Reply #5 on: October 31, 2006, 08:12:45 AM »
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Are you happy with skin tones from the P30 at normal iso's?
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william
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« Reply #6 on: October 31, 2006, 08:37:41 AM »
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Yes, mostly.  Skin tones are a bit too saturated for my taste, but otherwise seem very natural (using the "portrait natural" setting in C1).


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Are you happy with skin tones from the P30 at normal iso's?
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paul_jones
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« Reply #7 on: October 31, 2006, 01:14:46 PM »
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Yes, mostly.  Skin tones are a bit too saturated for my taste, but otherwise seem very natural (using the "portrait natural" setting in C1).
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i use the "no- colour corection" profile, i find the color a lot nicer.

paul
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damien
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« Reply #8 on: October 31, 2006, 01:18:14 PM »
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Noise on a 5D is far far lower than a P30, but the 5D file looks a bit plastic wrapped when compared to P30 side by side. I like the quality of the noise on the P30 not the fact there isn't any. I used to shoot 1600 Neopan on 35mm just to get some noise into my pictures. I also used to shoot TriXpan or HP5 to get the right look. The P30 does it for me at 800 with noise supression at minimum or step 1 (depending upon shot). I'd swap my P25 for a P30 if it was a straight swap just for the 800 look.

I hope this helps. Damien.
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www.lovegroveportraits.com
www.lovegroveweddings.com
www.lovegroveconsulting.com
H1/P25 -35mm,80mm,100mm,210mm
Nikon D200 - 17-35,28-70,70-200VR all at f2.8
Canon 5D - 16-35,24-70,70-200IS all at f2.8
Ex Rollei 6008 kit, Hass V kit, Mamiya 645 pro TL kit.
william
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« Reply #9 on: November 02, 2006, 08:41:10 AM »
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Thanks for the clarification of your experiences. What you describe is close to my view of the noise with the Nikon D200 up to a reasoable point; the noise is there, but it's less obtrusive noise than with some other cameras.  With regard to the P30, however, I personally find the high-ISO noise obtrusive from my admittedly limited experience thus far.  I'll keep testing.

Quote
Noise on a 5D is far far lower than a P30, but the 5D file looks a bit plastic wrapped when compared to P30 side by side. I like the quality of the noise on the P30 not the fact there isn't any. I used to shoot 1600 Neopan on 35mm just to get some noise into my pictures. I also used to shoot TriXpan or HP5 to get the right look. The P30 does it for me at 800 with noise supression at minimum or step 1 (depending upon shot). I'd swap my P25 for a P30 if it was a straight swap just for the 800 look.

I hope this helps. Damien.
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« Last Edit: November 02, 2006, 08:43:43 AM by william » Logged
Morgan_Moore
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« Reply #10 on: November 02, 2006, 02:33:01 PM »
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We see in this thread different comments on noise from the same cameras.

While I have not used the p30 I have experience of digital since the D1

It is my experience that histogram exposed right gives good performance with all

A bit like a thin TMax 3200 film was really noisy but well exposed it was not

Often I have noise in dark aread of my captures  areas that are further darkened in the PP process making the noise less obtrusive

So as ever - try before you buy - so much is down to style, techique and personal subject matter

Most Digicams have difficulty 'seeing in the dark' but where high ISO is required say to freeze daylight action or gain DOF the result will be good

Where High ISO is required to see in the 'dark a longer' exposeure at a lower ISO may be better

SMM
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John Sheehy
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« Reply #11 on: November 02, 2006, 04:28:07 PM »
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(I should note that the image I shot was also underexposed a bit, so that contributed to the noise, but still...)
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A full stop of under-exposure will always lead to disappointment at high ISOs.

It is like shooting at double the ISO at best (if the camera does the higher ISO by mathematical push), or far worse.
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