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Author Topic: MFDB and Nikkors  (Read 8905 times)
Morgan_Moore
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« on: October 30, 2006, 03:20:57 PM »
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Ok

We know all about Horseman, ALPA etc

Super tripple expensive for jobalong grubby snappers such as myself

Not so much the cameras but the lenses and thier special mountings

I have played with Nikkor glass infront of my chip and the image circle seems about 15MP worth of a 22MP

Plenty for a DPS in a Mag or probably anything really

So has anyone tried the cambo miniwide or any other way of sticking such glass in front of a MFDB

DOes it work ?

Does anyone know a dealer that sells the miniwide who actually returns calls?

Are there other products with copal 3 shutters that allow the full coverage of the glass

(ps not the Horseman digiflex as the 35mm shutter crops the image to a strcit 11mp(/22))

ps I currently have an H1 mount

SMM
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Sam Morgan Moore Cornwall
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« Reply #1 on: October 30, 2006, 03:28:58 PM »
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Quote
So has anyone tried the cambo miniwide or any other way of sticking such glass in front of a MFDB

DOes it work ?

Does anyone know a dealer that sells the miniwide who actually returns calls?

Are there other products with copal 3 shutters that allow the full coverage of the glass

SMM
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=82943\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


Sam,

Call Calumet on 0207-380-4508 and ask for Sue Jacobs or Andy Johnson. If you are having problems let me know and I'll ask them to contact you.

Yair
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digitalguy
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« Reply #2 on: October 30, 2006, 03:44:38 PM »
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Ok

We know all about Horseman, ALPA etc

Super tripple expensive for jobalong grubby snappers such as myself

Not so much the cameras but the lenses and thier special mountings

I have played with Nikkor glass infront of my chip and the image circle seems about 15MP worth of a 22MP

Plenty for a DPS in a Mag or probably anything really

So has anyone tried the cambo miniwide or any other way of sticking such glass in front of a MFDB

DOes it work ?

Does anyone know a dealer that sells the miniwide who actually returns calls?

Are there other products with copal 3 shutters that allow the full coverage of the glass

(ps not the Horseman digiflex as the 35mm shutter crops the image to a strcit 11mp(/22))

ps I currently have an H1 mount

SMM
[{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

You could try kapturegroups truewide solution:
[a href=\"http://www.kapturegroup.com/]http://www.kapturegroup.com/[/url]


Dg
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Dustbak
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« Reply #3 on: October 30, 2006, 03:57:16 PM »
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I have both a miniwide as well as the true-wide made by Kapturegroup. I am currently selling the miniwide BTW. The true-wide I only obtained recently and this I will be using with an Aptus17. Before that I used Cantare, C-Most and Valeo.

Next to these I also use a Digiflex II.

I have been very happy with these combinations especially when you carefully pick your lenses.

This is a shot I made quite casually with the Digiflex:

http://www.peperkamp.com/samples/lowres/ka...ton002small.jpg

I have also a link to the high res version which is:

http://www.peperkamp.com/samples/highres/karperton002.jpg

These have been made with a Valeo/DigiflexII/Zeis50/1.4 planar. When carefully used this will give any larger system a good run for its money. I stitch when I need really large pictures. This was a test I ran to see what would be possible with that system. With a bit more patience and a bit more careful work more quality should be possible. I expect to get more out of the true-wide (I used the Mini a couple of times but expect that thing to be obsolete now I have the true-wide).

Downside of these systems is that no DB vendor is willing to continue to create a 24x36 sensor which I believe is a pity since it is such a nice niche. However a 43x33 sensor like my aptus will also cover about 11/12MP on a Copal1 (MiniWide) and about 15 on a Copal3 (True-Wide).

The MiniWide is a nice piece of work however does not have the same built quality as the True-Wide. In a Copal1 version the Miniwide can cover about a 36x36 sensor. The true-wide supposedly can cover more. I can let you know this as soon as my Aptus is in (which should be tomorrow).
« Last Edit: October 31, 2006, 02:02:08 AM by Dustbak » Logged
Morgan_Moore
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« Reply #4 on: October 30, 2006, 04:26:10 PM »
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I am a bit confused

You used a 50mm lense for that shot

Surely then you must have spun the body on the tripod

I cant see the point of doing that when you could do the same thing with an 80 and a 645 camera (if you have such a thing-I do)

Kapture group dont list a compatability with the H1 mount

Interested in the coverage of the true wide (copal 3 no?) over a big chip

Maybe you could do a snap and leave the dak edeges on - dont worry about high res

----

I am looking to make wide interior shots with a minimum of fuss corrected if possible

Basically I see the 14 as a get out of jail free card where ultra wide is required in a hurry and on a budget - and Im always in a hurry and on a budget

I also feel that my SLRn camera has a limited lifespan and will proably be repaced with a D2x unless nikon pull something out of thier hat

That will leave me totally stuffed for wideness

----

I might consider alpa if there were a way to focus it - maybe thats what Leica could bring to the MF party now they have bought someone up - I cant remeber who and dont really care until product is on the street
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Sam Morgan Moore Cornwall
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Dustbak
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« Reply #5 on: October 30, 2006, 04:39:23 PM »
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The true-wide indeed has a copal No3.

The reason I used this was fairly simple. I used to work with 35mm Nikon gear and was looking for something better. This way I started to use the Cantare, etc..

I just had the lenses already and now use multiple systems with the same glass. I use a D200 as a backup.

This system provides a lot of quality for very little although you can end up having to choose for a larger format eventually anyway.
« Last Edit: October 30, 2006, 04:42:21 PM by Dustbak » Logged
Morgan_Moore
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« Reply #6 on: October 30, 2006, 04:43:38 PM »
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. I used to work with 35mm Nikon gear and was looking for something better.


Makes sense - you didnt have 645
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Sam Morgan Moore Cornwall
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Graham Mitchell
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« Reply #7 on: October 30, 2006, 05:32:07 PM »
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Doesn't the Sinar modular system do just this?
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Morgan_Moore
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« Reply #8 on: October 30, 2006, 05:43:57 PM »
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Doesn't the Sinar modular system do just this?
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=82971\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Maybe it does - but Id prefer a couple of 5ds and a couple of 24 TSEs for the money..

£1618.00 for the mirror box

£899.00 for the prism and

 £4158.00  for the body (!)

And I bet it crops the image back to 11mp

All with a bullet stopping 60th flash synch (not)

I think they got the name wrong - Sinar Millionair System morelike - I supose at least you can see through it

Who conceptualises these things - who buys them ??

SMM

(Off topic I know - but have these people (sinar) forgotten that all we are trying to do is align a chip with a bit of glass and maybe a mirror that gets out of the way - the electronics on that thing are nuts - I dont even need a meter I can chimp)
« Last Edit: October 30, 2006, 05:49:13 PM by Morgan_Moore » Logged

Sam Morgan Moore Cornwall
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Morgan_Moore
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« Reply #9 on: October 30, 2006, 06:06:09 PM »
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Doesn't the Sinar modular system do just this?
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=82971\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Of I forgot you might also want..

cable release.. £82.00

power bit for the bottom £705.00

Sinar back adapter plate £211.00

Tripod adapter  £27.00


AND it dont go on my H1 mount so I need the

Other mirror box £2338.00  and a new 80mm lense, £2316.00 and maybe the NON SHIFTING 40mm,  £4474.00 and for portraits .. a Sinaron Digital AF Sonnar 4.0 - 180 at £3654.00

A bargain really - maybe they'll give me a good trade in price on my one year old soon to be compatible with nothing Hasselburg - if the front elements dont fall out before I can get to the shop
« Last Edit: October 30, 2006, 06:11:22 PM by Morgan_Moore » Logged

Sam Morgan Moore Cornwall
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Dustbak
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« Reply #10 on: October 31, 2006, 01:33:58 AM »
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Sinar M is ridiculously priced. It is heavy, it has disappointing spec's (considering price).

It will be obsolete and fade away fairly soon this way.
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Morgan_Moore
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« Reply #11 on: October 31, 2006, 01:58:02 AM »
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It will be obsolete and fade away fairly soon this way.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=83000\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Now Sinar are backing the hy6 too  - even they see this ??

Any way back on topic.. Nikkors and DBs please..
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Sam Morgan Moore Cornwall
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Graham Mitchell
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« Reply #12 on: October 31, 2006, 02:57:19 AM »
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I agree it's expensive but it does exactly what you asked so it's not off-topic. Here is a snippet from the website:

"Don‘t sell those Nikon lenses yet! By using the 35 mm Mirror Module, the Sinar m camera can easily also be converted into a 35 mm single-lens-reflex camera that can be used with a large variety of Nikon lenses opening up a great range of focal lengths for your Sinarback that extends from extreme wide-angle to super telephoto lenses. Additional advantages of the modular Sinar m System: It features a significantly larger image area than those of many digital small image single-lensreflex cameras and it does not require the annoying focal length multiplying factors that have to be taken into account because of the smaller sensor formats in other cameras. In any case, the full 24 x 36 mm format is at your disposal – even larger, depending on the digital back and the lens that is being used. "
« Last Edit: October 31, 2006, 02:57:45 AM by foto-z » Logged

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Morgan_Moore
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« Reply #13 on: October 31, 2006, 03:54:30 AM »
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so it's not off-topic.[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=83012\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Correct . it was my subsesquent rant that was OT

SMM
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Sam Morgan Moore Cornwall
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« Reply #14 on: October 31, 2006, 04:26:53 AM »
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I'm VERY VERY interested too in how 35mm nikkor lenses can cover 36mm by 36mm or 36mm by 48mm. Is the fall off acceptable ? is it possible to do any shot without stitching or must stitching be factored in ?

cheers
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Morgan_Moore
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« Reply #15 on: October 31, 2006, 08:29:00 AM »
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I'm VERY VERY interested too in how 35mm nikkor lenses can cover 36mm by 36mm or 36mm by 48mm. Is the fall off acceptable ? is it possible to do any shot without stitching or must stitching be factored in ?

cheers
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=83021\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

my basic experience using a lashed together system is that

basically the image circle covers about 17mp worth of a 22mp chip (which is good for me)

Because my test rig was home made I cant really comment on quality

I think lenses like the 28PC have good image circle (unshifted)

My 24 (1970s) has good image circle

17-35 and 20-35 look good

I would imagine that lenses with 'tighter design' (also with internal flare baffles) where they are pushing the optics like the 14 2.8 will not be so good but will still give a 11mp file with full 14 coverage in a way that no kinon can exept the SLRn

I will try and dig out my test shot - it is suprising

The plan would not be to stitch - stitching requires a bigger image circle when done 'flat'

I am trying to get away from stitching which can produce phoenomenal results if you have time - my clients dont have time

SMM
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Sam Morgan Moore Cornwall
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Morgan_Moore
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« Reply #16 on: October 31, 2006, 08:40:26 AM »
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I'm VERY VERY interested too in how 35mm nikkor lenses can cover 36mm by 36mm or 36mm by 48mm. Is the fall off acceptable cheers
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=83021\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

This image is out of focus

But it gives you a feeling of the drop off over the 22mp sensor

Then lens is a chrome barrel 1970s Nikkor 24 2.8

(the second hand price of which will now double)

SMM

(that is my hair in the top right)
« Last Edit: October 31, 2006, 08:41:54 AM by Morgan_Moore » Logged

Sam Morgan Moore Cornwall
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Dustbak
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« Reply #17 on: October 31, 2006, 04:27:00 PM »
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This is the image made by a TrueWide Copal3, Nikkor 85/2.8PC and Aptus17 with a 43x31 sensor.

It is actually better than I expected. It apparently covers the whole sensor area. This is a quick and dirty shot. I will make some others together with the MiniWide tomorrow (it is late over here).

This shot is overexposed, making it a bit hard to judge light fall-of.

http://www.peperkamp.com/samples/TrueWideCopal3.jpg


One other thing I immediately notice is that the Aptus17 suffers from the centerfold issue! It might just be an anomaly. But when you would set the black point in levels of the image above very high you can see a line in the center. Makes me curious whether it will show up under normal circumstances.
« Last Edit: October 31, 2006, 04:36:37 PM by Dustbak » Logged
Morgan_Moore
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« Reply #18 on: October 31, 2006, 04:39:23 PM »
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This is the image made by a TrueWide Copal3
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=83120\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Will be interesting to see if the C1 shutter causes a smaller image circle

That looks very adequate coverage to me

Was slightly confused about the image at first now I see its white (with a bit of centerfold!)
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Sam Morgan Moore Cornwall
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Dustbak
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« Reply #19 on: October 31, 2006, 04:42:43 PM »
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I can understand. I thought this to be the best way to show the copal3 and Nikkor85 cover the complete sensor area.

I thought it was centerfold at first but try doing the level thingy in PS. You will see the image is made-up from 6 parts equally in size.
« Last Edit: October 31, 2006, 04:45:49 PM by Dustbak » Logged
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