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Author Topic: Old Prosumer VS Consumer: Which Canon is better?  (Read 3473 times)
Cottonsworth
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« on: November 24, 2006, 11:50:11 PM »
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I have a Canon EOS 10D DSLR and I came across a great deal for a Canon Rebel XTi.  Granted, I know that the XTi's 10 mega-pixels kicks the 10D's paltry 6.3 mega-pixels' butt, I'm wondering if there is going to be a noticable difference in image quality since the 10D was a prosumer camera versus the consumer targeted XTi.  I dislike the XTi's build and physical feel but I'm willing to overlook that if I can get much better image quality.  I like to take landscape and portrait shots.  Any advice/opinion would be greatly appreciated.
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Jonathan Wienke
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« Reply #1 on: November 25, 2006, 01:17:20 AM »
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As long as you have manual and aperture priority shooting (with easily adjusted exposure compensation) and RAW support, you're OK. Canon DSLRs have uniformly good per-pixel quality across their pro, prosumer, and consumer models; what you're giving up is stuff like build quality (body ruggedness, shutter durability, weather sealing, etc.), AF speed and performance, buffer size, card writing speed, maximum X-sync shutter speed, etc. Because the XTi's sensor is a few generations newer than that of the 10D, the per-pixel image quality is better than that of the 10D. I'd recommend reading DPReview's writeup.
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boku
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« Reply #2 on: November 25, 2006, 07:35:04 AM »
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Agree entirely with Jonathan. Another point to consider...

The newer Xti is quite tiny in the hands compared to the 10D, especially on the left hand side. For me, there is nothing to grab on to. This, of course, is a personal ergonomic factor that may or may not matter to you.

I avoid the Rebel series for a silly reason really: I love the rear compensation adjustment wheel on the prosumer and pro series of cameras. I must. The price difference is significant for no change in image quality. Gotta have that wheel!
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Bob Kulon

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s3c
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« Reply #3 on: November 25, 2006, 11:05:31 AM »
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I recently got an XTi...I guess I would consider myself an "advanced amateur"; I shoot the kid's sporting events, family gatherings, and occasionally landscapes, nature, etc. when the creative juices are flowing.  If I shoot 3-4,000 pictures a year, it's a lot.  But I don't use photography to put bread on the table.

Back in the day, my first Canon was an FTb; the second an A-1 in 1980.  I didn't buy another Canon until the 10d a few years back.  Since then, I've had the 20d and just recently got the XTi.  I sold the previous digital each time I got a new one - my usage doesn't merit having more than one body.  And cameras are now little more than computers - instead of the film bodies that lasted me 30 years, the usable life span of a digital is far shorter, a few years at best, IMO.  So why spend more than you need to?

If you don't need "pro" durability, save your money, since you'll most likely want another new body in a couple years (or better yet, invest in good glass).  Prosumer/consumer/whatever, the various Rebels' durability seems to have been fine for "average" use.  The new anti-dust thing really seems to work, too.  I was starting to get specks in skies more often than I liked with the 20d - none of that now.

One thing I would suggest - go to a well stocked "superstore" and hold both the 30d and XTi.  Both are smaller than your 10d, but the XTI is a lot smaller, as many have mentioned.  In the larger stores, they often have display models with the same kit lens on them, so you can compare heft and viewfinder size/brightness on the spot.  You may not like the small size; I quickly got used to it.

As far as that grip goes, I've never seen so much ado about nothing (pun intended).  I tend to support the camera via my lens hand, so all the grip does for me is help align my other hand to the shutter release.  Look at old film SLR's - they didn't need no stinkin' grips!  There is something to be said for the XTi's lighter weight too - easier to lug around.

If you're using the camera for a living, consider the 30d, or wait for its replacement; it's not a 1 series, but feels like a tank compared to the XTi.  If it's not your livelihood, go for the Rebel.

I kind of wish that Boku hadn't mentioned that rear compensation adjustment wheel though; now I miss it...
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gadget
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« Reply #4 on: November 25, 2006, 02:10:17 PM »
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I understand you dilemma. I currently own a 10D, and while I love the camera, I need to get up to megapixel speed, so to speak. I'm looking at the XTi, or taking the big plunge for the 5D. You might laugh at the camera choice, but I face the common problem of need and desire for the better camera, but $$ for the cheaper one. (I don't think the megapixel jump from the 10D to the 30D is worth it. There are probably other factors to consider, though.)

I've handled the XTi and I find the body to be like the cheap 35mm cameras used to be, that is to say, cheap. I don't like the grip, though it's a minor fator, I don't like the double button setup for aperture adjustment, and I don't like the smaller viewfinder (much smaller than the 30D, the D80). But it's affordable, and I imagine the image quality is not that far off from the 5D (I have yet to make comparisons over at DP Review, however).

Anyway, back to your question of 10D vs XTi: The build is definitely better with the 10D, but, if you're like me, you don't bang cameras around. The kind of shooting I do, and I am a professional, is mild mannered, often in the studio. The body will hold up just fine for me. The ergonomics are another thing, though. The smaller viewfinder is a hindrance, especially for accurate alignment in the composition (though I have yet to shoot with an XTi). And, I hate to admit it, my eyes are getting older (not the rest of me, no, no
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NLund
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« Reply #5 on: November 25, 2006, 02:29:51 PM »
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The viewfinder thing would be a big hangup for me. My 30D is my first high quality camera, so I admittedly speak with less experience than others but I'm not an idiot.

I went to a tech store recently to compare viewfinders, between an XTi, 30D, and 5D. Being used to my 30D's viewfinder, the XTi's was pitiful, like looking at a small screen through a tunnel. The 5D was a pleasure to look through, I had to take off my glasses and look around, lots of space to use.

I also must agree with Boku about the jog wheel on the back. It and more intuitive controls have now become a must for me. I have normal size hands for a 6 foot male, XTi living space is cramped for me.

If any of you <i>can</i> afford it, snag the 5D, it would seem that you don't suffer from GAS (Gear Acquisition Syndrome) having held onto your 10D 's for so long, the 5D would likely last you a few years at least.
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gadget
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« Reply #6 on: November 25, 2006, 04:22:18 PM »
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Quote
If any of you <i>can</i> afford it, snag the 5D, [a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=87038\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

'afford it' being the critical words......anyone want to lend me some $$
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Cottonsworth
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« Reply #7 on: November 25, 2006, 05:41:55 PM »
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Thanks to the people that chimed in about this.  I didn't even consider the viewfinder as an impediment but I would hate to take pictures as if I was shooting through a tunnel.  Seems like I'm going to have to sacrifice a lot of convenience to get a better image.  I'll continue to mull this over.  If anyone else has any thoughts, please continue posting.  Thanks!
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s3c
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« Reply #8 on: November 25, 2006, 06:41:10 PM »
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I'll be the first to agree that the 5D (or just about any full frame slr's ) viewfinder is far superior to any of the 1.6 crop cameras, but personally I just don't see all that much difference between the viewfinders of the XTi and the 30d.  I compared both in a store, with the same kit lens on each camera prefocused on the same subjects, and then swapped the cameras rapidly back and forth.  Maybe it was my 50-ish eyes playing tricks, but to me the XTi's view finder image was only very slightly smaller than the 30d, and just very slightly dimmer; if one's a tunnel, they're both tunnels.  I'd try a side by side test yourself and see how it looks to you.  Like the other posters, I'd love a 5D's view, but I can't justify the cost for what I do.

Some other things to muddy the water for you: the newer Canons have virtually instant start up, and much better autofocus than the 10d did, both significant reasons to consider a change, if the price is right.  On the other hand, while the 10MP sensor of the XTi is a step up over your 6MP, it's also been my experience that ISO 800 & 1600 with the XTi need more "cleaning up" that my old 8MP 20d (essentially the same as the 30d) images did.

Why can't these choices ever be easy?

PS, NLund, thanks for the "GAS" acronym; I hadn't heard that one before, and I laughed so hard, I almost wiped out the keyboard with my coffee!  After using the same old equipment for many years, I freely admit to being guilty of this syndrome (at least with the new digital bodies); eBay makes them too easy to sell...
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