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Author Topic: IPF5000 Wiki Now Has Quicktime Movies of 3D Gamut  (Read 2010 times)
John Hollenberg
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« on: December 13, 2006, 07:58:18 AM »
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Recent addition to the Wiki:

Downloadable Quicktime movies comparing gamut of Canon IPF5000 through the Photoshop plugin with Epson 4800 for Innova F-Type Gloss.  Movies are high resolution (20 MB each) and can be stopped or moved back to any point.  Created with Colorthink Pro.

Note: Downloads may be slow/hard to access due to the limitations of the free file sharing service Rapid Share.  Please be patient.

http://www.canonipf5000.wikispaces.com

--John
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digitaldog
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« Reply #1 on: December 13, 2006, 08:29:57 AM »
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Recent addition to the Wiki:

Downloadable Quicktime movies comparing gamut of Canon IPF5000 through the Photoshop plugin with Epson 4800 for Innova F-Type Gloss.  Movies are high resolution (20 MB each) and can be stopped or moved back to any point.  Created with Colorthink Pro.

And other than the fact that both have larger gamuts in some areas than others, what's the point?
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Andrew Rodney
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John Hollenberg
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« Reply #2 on: December 13, 2006, 08:40:40 AM »
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And other than the fact that both have larger gamuts in some areas than others, what's the point?

The point is to provide information on color gamuts for those who don't own Colorthink.  Analyzing the information and deciding how significant it is will be up to the individual.  Looking at the 3D plots, it looks like images with some blues may be printed significantly better on the Canon.  Everyone can make the determination for themselves.

--John
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digitaldog
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« Reply #3 on: December 13, 2006, 08:52:29 AM »
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The point is to provide information on color gamuts for those who don't own Colorthink.  Analyzing the information and deciding how significant it is will be up to the individual.  Looking at the 3D plots, it looks like images with some blues may be printed significantly better on the Canon.  Everyone can make the determination for themselves.

--John
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I think it's important for some lurkers not to put too much into the gamut size if they are trying to evaluate output quality. I think too many are putting too much on gamut size (I'll take a smaller gamut with better gray balance any day). Let's put it this way, if I had a dozen criteria for picking a printer, the gamut size, especially between two such large gamut devices would be last on the list in deciding which to buy. It's useful to see but only mildly so, especially for newer users who may not fully understand what they are seeing. Gamut size isn't a quality indicator.

I can make the Epson gamut look much smaller while producing a much more linear output. Which is more important?
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Andrew Rodney
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John Hollenberg
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« Reply #4 on: December 13, 2006, 09:06:39 AM »
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I think it's important for some lurkers not to put too much into the gamut size if they are trying to evaluate output quality. I think too many are putting too much on gamut size (I'll take a smaller gamut with better gray balance any day). Let's put it this way, if I had a dozen criteria for picking a printer, the gamut size, especially between two such large gamut devices would be last on the list in deciding which to buy. It's useful to see but only mildly so, especially for newer users who may not fully understand what they are seeing. Gamut size isn't a quality indicator.

I can make the Epson gamut look much smaller while producing a much more linear output. Which is more important?

I agree with all of this.  However, the gamut plots do show a pretty significant advantage in the blues.  Since I do run into situations where blues are out of the printer gamut this could be significant.  Have to evaluate specific images to see if it translates into better/truer output in this area.

--John
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NikosR
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« Reply #5 on: December 13, 2006, 09:13:26 AM »
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  Looking at the 3D plots, it looks like images with some blues may be printed significantly better on the Canon. 
--John
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I'll second digitaldog's comments above. A large gamut by itself says very little for actual output quality. I'll also note that John's statement quoted is open to gross misinterpretation.

I also note that the particular icc profiles whose gamut plots are presented have, apparently, not been produced by the same process which leaves a big questionmark IMHO about the validity of such a strict comparison. (EDIT: this statement looks to be not true for the QT movie presented, but seems true for the gamut plot screens on the wiki site).

This is not to argue that the Canon seems to have a larger gamut in some saturated blues and the Epson in some greens and yellows. Many observers have noticed that. The effect of this for real life images is debatable.
« Last Edit: December 13, 2006, 09:20:40 AM by NikosR » Logged

Nikos
John Hollenberg
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« Reply #6 on: December 13, 2006, 11:11:25 AM »
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I'll second digitaldog's comments above. A large gamut by itself says very little for actual output quality. I'll also note that John's statement quoted is open to gross misinterpretation.

Well it may be OPEN to gross misinterpretation, but the statement I made suggests that based on the gamut plots there MAY be an advantage in the blues.  

This topic came up about a year ago in regards to the Designjet 130, where I noted a lack of the DJ 130 in the blues looking at gamut plots compared to the Epson 2400.  Neil Snape had maintained that the DJ had a perfectly good color gamut.  A friend sent me an image to print on the DJ 130 compared to the Epson 2400.  The image happened to have some pretty saturated blues from water in the Bahamas or somewhere.  Well guess what--the Designjet fell short (not horribly, but immediately noticeable), the Epson print matched the screen quite well.  Both were printed through their respective printer drivers with custom profiles I had made with Profilemaker Pro.

So, my statement stands that the Canon MAY have an advantage in some saturated blues in real world images compared to the Epson, based on looking at the 3D gamut.   The gamut maps are pretty close in most other colors, so you aren't likely to see much of a real world difference.  That's really all I am saying.  I wanted the data to be available for others to see.

--John
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