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Author Topic: Canon Ipf5000 problem  (Read 2727 times)
Waterford_photographer
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« on: December 20, 2006, 12:15:52 PM »
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I've owned the IPF since August and have had generally a problem free experience, making my own profiles and experimenting with different papers. Well my good luck has had torun out and I've a problem that I can't solve. Print mono with profiles produces good neutral results with some papers better then others, accepted, so to get good monochrome results I've tried using the Auto Monochrome setting and the prints are perfectly mono but the dark areas print way too light although black prints perfect so its a dark grey problem (same photo printed with selected profile is fine). I've scanned forums for weeks now to find this problem but with no success. I've installed the printer on a new computer and the same problems happens. I hope this is a Driver issue, any help out there?
Keith
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John Hollenberg
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« Reply #1 on: December 20, 2006, 03:10:06 PM »
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Monochrome is always a problem for these printers.  Perhaps more so for the Canon than the Epson.  CD Tobie posted somewhere that Auto Color (and by extension, I think Auto Monochrome) use the wrong gamma.  I noted that prints I made using Auto color had the tonality wrong.  My solution, for both Epson and Canon (although haven't tried with the Canon yet) is to profile the Auto Monochrome mode using Eye-One photo and step-wedge + software from Quadtone Rip.  To read about how to do this, see this link on Outback Photo on Softproofing for B&W Images

http://www.outbackphoto.com/artof_b_w/bw_09/essay.html

This provided an improvement with Epson 2400 over choosing Light or Normal in monochrome mode.  I assume it will work for the Canon also.

--John
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Waterford_photographer
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« Reply #2 on: December 21, 2006, 02:42:52 AM »
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Thanks John, having a look at your suggestions and will let you know how I get on.
Regards
Keith
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Monochrome is always a problem for these printers.  Perhaps more so for the Canon than the Epson.  CD Tobie posted somewhere that Auto Color (and by extension, I think Auto Monochrome) use the wrong gamma.  I noted that prints I made using Auto color had the tonality wrong.  My solution, for both Epson and Canon (although haven't tried with the Canon yet) is to profile the Auto Monochrome mode using Eye-One photo and step-wedge + software from Quadtone Rip.  To read about how to do this, see this link on Outback Photo on Softproofing for B&W Images

http://www.outbackphoto.com/artof_b_w/bw_09/essay.html

This provided an improvement with Epson 2400 over choosing Light or Normal in monochrome mode.  I assume it will work for the Canon also.

--John
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Waterford_photographer
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« Reply #3 on: December 21, 2006, 02:12:45 PM »
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Still struggling. Something is definitely amiss when it comes to using the Auto Monochrome. I did a gradient square and printed it Auto Monochrome and then using the selected profile, result is a huge difference with the dark tones - one step from black the problem area. At this stage Auto Monochrome is unuseable. I know certain colour inks cause more problems when it comes to delivering good monochrome results and a RIP uses these less to achieve their well respected results, so even using a custom built profile from a million patches  is still not going to be as good a clever RIP. Colorbyte's Imageprint (when it arrives) may be the answer...
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John Hollenberg
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« Reply #4 on: December 21, 2006, 02:31:51 PM »
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Did you try the method I suggested?  One other thought--if the wrong media type is selected and too much ink is being laid down for that particular paper there may be a lack of differentiation in the darkest tones that even the QTR B&W profiling won't solve.

--John
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Waterford_photographer
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« Reply #5 on: December 21, 2006, 03:00:46 PM »
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Hi John,
I'm currently doing a variation test with different media types, same problem is recurring, I understand the media types or the rough art of guessing, but I use the same media types when profiling and colour work and the results are perfect. I'm going to try your suggestion when I better understand the process - I'm reading the http://www.outbackphoto.com/artof_b_w/bw_09/essay.html at the moment. I'm also in touch with Velmex UK trying to solve the problem and they're preplexed but very helpful. Curiously this problem I'm having might be related to another which happens rarely but is a nuisance when it does, very occasionally print comes out with strong banding, then if another image is sent to print the problem get worse till its just a ghost of an image on horribly expensive paper! Quick solution to this problem was to change media type, print on a cheap paper, turn off printer and turn on again after a few minutes and then the printer is back to normal. I've check for clogged ink heads and they are perfect every time so I think this is a driver problem. I had to do about 1500 mono prints last month at that problem occurred after every 30 - 50 prints
I can achieve good results with custom profiles but this printer is capable of better and consistancy is important.
Kind Regards
Keith


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Did you try the method I suggested?  One other thought--if the wrong media type is selected and too much ink is being laid down for that particular paper there may be a lack of differentiation in the darkest tones that even the QTR B&W profiling won't solve.

--John
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John Hollenberg
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« Reply #6 on: December 21, 2006, 04:02:30 PM »
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If there is a driver problem (and I don't for a minute doubt that there is), definitely report it to Canon.  Rumor has it that they will be releasing updated drivers in USA soon.  Updates are already on Canon Europe site, I assume you are using those now.  Not sure if the U.S. ones will be exactly the same, and if they will be, why they aren't posted at Canon USA now.  Also rumored that updated firmware will be out in a month or so.

--John
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Waterford_photographer
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« Reply #7 on: December 21, 2006, 06:30:36 PM »
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Has anyone else experienced unusual problems with this printer? I really do feel alone and as the saying going a problem shared is a problem halved or something along those lines. I love the colour output, I have seen glimpses of what the printer can do in mono, where is the perfect solution? I dont know anyone else in person who owns an IPF5000 so this is my only link to the outsde world. My feeling is at the moment is that a really good RIP is required to make this machine run like she should.
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John Hollenberg
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« Reply #8 on: December 21, 2006, 06:47:10 PM »
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Has anyone else experienced unusual problems with this printer? I really do feel alone and as the saying going a problem shared is a problem halved or something along those lines. I love the colour output, I have seen glimpses of what the printer can do in mono, where is the perfect solution? I dont know anyone else in person who owns an IPF5000 so this is my only link to the outsde world.

The main place IPF5000 owners hang out (besides this forum, of course) is at:

http://www.canonipf5000.wikispaces.com

If you haven't posted there (and it is hard for me to keep track of what is posted where), you should definitely do so.

--John
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Waterford_photographer
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« Reply #9 on: December 21, 2006, 07:15:05 PM »
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I admire your work John, and I will post on wiki from now on aswell. But Canon IPF 5000 users share your problems...the solutions are to are benefit. Daniel Barrett from Colorbyte said their RIP should be available this month, still waiting.

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The main place IPF5000 owners hang out (besides this forum, of course) is at:

http://www.canonipf5000.wikispaces.com

If you haven't posted there (and it is hard for me to keep track of what is posted where), you should definitely do so.

--John
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