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Author Topic: Backs for architecture/commercial photography  (Read 83160 times)
Danijela D. Karic
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« Reply #260 on: February 24, 2007, 11:50:53 AM »
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i have two amazon rimova alu hardcases in maximum allowed size for handbaggage.
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Hi Ranier,

Would you provide me with the Model# and perhaps the link? I would appreciate it.

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using both i can take all my camera equipement with me which i need on locations,- i take all in handluggage which i could not replace, if the normal luggage would not arrive in the right airport ( happened one time to me ).
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I am not sure how much I can carry in weight but would certainly try my best to avoid delays and damages.

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further i have a big loewe suitcase with wheels which i take for longer or big jobs with me,  i remove here the internal separations and transport a calibrated 19" lacie monitor for hotel-room-editing. i use the loewe suitcase than  on location  for carryiong around all my equipement on location, hopefully my assistant does that   
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I would highly appreciate if you could let me know the Model#, it will help. With regards to assistants, I usually hire locally. Actually, I rent the equipment/computers also, but now I'm thinking perhaps it would be more convenient and in the same regard cheaper to get a full time assistant and potentially hire extras if required.

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if i want to travel with little equipement i use one of the rimovas and my laptop bag.

right now at this moment  i am sitting in an airport in faro/portugal beeing logged in the airport internet....
i already have checked in and have  in my hand-luggage:

1 crumpler bag with g4 laptop and three 100gb harddiscs and also one charged spare battery for having something to do meanwhile waiting.

1 rimova box contains today:

1 contax 645 with 4 lenses ( 35/45/80/140)  and mounted e75 back.
1 gottschalt camera with sinar/rodenstock 28/35/60HR lenses and 45mm digital lens
1 e75 back
accessories: 10x10 grey transparent plexi/ 3 batteries for e75 / charger for them / batterie grip for contax / prism + waistlevel finder for contax / sliding back for gottschalt.

the gottschalt becomes 3 centimeters thick, incl. the sliding back,  if i remove the back and the lens and the loupe bellow. put the gottschalt at the bottom of the case, over it fits the contax with one lens attached, i can use in this way the space of one camera for taking two.
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Any idea how heavy is your hand-luggage? Because with that much equipment I better put Schwarzenegger on hold. What about the insurance when traveling?

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my experience is as more you take with you as faster the controls at airports .....
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Interesting approach.

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never have had problems with too extensive controls, but usually they check if the camera really works as a camera, so better to have a battery in the back and in the camera to switch it on one time.
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Practical, I agree.

Regards
Danijela
« Last Edit: February 24, 2007, 11:51:38 AM by Danijela D. Karic » Logged
rainer_v
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« Reply #261 on: February 24, 2007, 03:01:35 PM »
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no idea about the exact type number. the rimovas are from their aluminium amazon serial, and they have exactly the allowed size for handluggage. i take them with app. 10 kilo weight with me if full.
the loewe bag is the biggest they have, with wheels.... pretty expensive.
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rainer viertlbŲck
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Danijela D. Karic
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« Reply #262 on: February 24, 2007, 03:12:17 PM »
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Hi Danijela,

I just read this whole thread, and it has been an interesting 'ride'. I hope you have learned from it, and others too.
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It certainly build my confidence making the decision about purchasing ALPA Cameras & LF Digital Lenses but as far as Digital Back is concerned, unfortunately it doesnít lead anywhere but to severe layers of Typhlosis. So, I highly hope that will change.

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I recently bought a Sinar e22 back, and was really drawn to this system because of the adapters. I love the fact that I could put the back on a Rollei 6008 one day, and something like a Hasselblad SWC the next. Not to mention various view camera options, or upcoming bodies like the Hy6. I feel quite free to choose my platform.
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Considering that you do Commercial work/Fashion/etc. I am a bit surprised that you purchased e22. However, I must admit, adapters are their good selling point, but as I said before, unless they change the gear and move forward in to the right direction this year 2007, who ever is at the top deciding will turn SINAR in to DINAR, worthless coin these days.

I hope SIANR keeps their eyes & ears open and letís hope for the best.

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By comparison, a friend of mine bought a new P30 in Sweden with Mamiya mount and then wanted to change to a Hass H mount only two months later. He was charged around $4k to swap the mount, and now he is still stuck with one mount.
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Iím surprised he didnít get the deal they offered me which entitles me to change the mount during the period of 12 months. However, you canít beat Sinarís & Hasselbladís convenience of interchangeable adapters and that alone is a huge +. Therefore, In my opinion Hasselblad along with Sinar are in the best position to balance the market gap between the performance & convenience and ultimately Sinar with multiple systems will lead the market. So far, I can only vote based on their convenience and that alone Iím afraid is not enough.

Will it happen? Iím not sure.

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I shoot people mainly, so I can't be of much help with specialised architectural applications. However, I can add a few comments in reply to some of your posts:
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Your comments are more then welcome and highly appreciated.

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The upcoming Hy6 is not a brand new body. The name is new but it is in effect a Rollei 6008 AF 'D'. It is important to realise that this camera is built on a proven platform and should not be regarded as a higher risk than a Hass H3, for example. For some reason people feel secure in the Hass H platform because many others are using it, but that is very flawed logic (think sheep!) You should also be aware that Hass H has some problems with the camera locking up. You need to remove the battery to reset the camera and continue shooting. You will find various threads on this. Also, there are many reports of the 50-110mm zoom lens falling apart.
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I am in favor of Rollei and therefore have high hopes for Hy6. Having said that, I simply donít have any religious interest comparing products like H1/H2/H3 and product like Hy6 that didnít surf yet.

We can certainly compare Rollei vs. Hasselblad/Mamiya, other then that, letís wait a while and see what happens.

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I am not trying to start a brand-war, but just pointing out that the assumption that Hass H is proven and totally reliable and that the Hy6 is a complete unknown is quite FALSE.
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Hasselblad is of course not proven, but I canít deny that it is getting better and better. Hy6 is not unknown you are right, but more among the enthusiasts then anywhere else. Majority of working photographers couldnít care less and Iíll believe that until it gets in action. The question is, will it be proven when it gets on the street? Certainly not. So, how far away is really Hy6 and how good is the Hasselblad/Mamiya Now, Today, This Very Hour? Of course there will always be space for improvement, regardless of platform/model we decide to purchase.

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The Hy6 will also offer a rotating back (great feature which I already enjoy on the 6008), faster lenses, faster flash sync, and a wider array of lenses and accessories, and of course you can start using the system today with a 6008 body, as I do.
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I donít think anybody can complain in that regard. Remember, I like Rollei and with ALPA Cameras I can use their lenses, their Hy6 would be IDEAL as a MF AF platform. So basically, I canít ask for more. However, the fact remains Hy6 is not to surf next week or next month, etc.

So, letís wait and see what happens and of course, hope for the BEST.


[span style=\'font-size:13pt;line-height:100%\']To be continued
[/span]

Regards
Danijela
« Last Edit: February 24, 2007, 04:56:12 PM by Danijela D. Karic » Logged
Danijela D. Karic
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« Reply #263 on: February 24, 2007, 03:13:39 PM »
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As for the Capture One and Brumbaer tools, you are free to download them both and play with some raw files before buying. Both these tools are very simple to use. I had to email Thierry once about an undocumented feature (revealing hidden menus), but apart from that I felt comfortable about the workflow in one hour. I had been using Capture One Pro for years but the transition was pretty painless.
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Yes, I agree.  Ranier and Thierry are very helpful and although Thierry never failed to deliver, I have to give the edge to Ranier, he basically provided requested details in no time.

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You are also free to use Brumbaer DNG converter and Lightroom, without using Capture Shop. Using a Macbook Pro I was taking about 5 seconds per raw file to convert to DNG. Pretty quick. Would be a little longer for the e75 files, of course.
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Thatís a relief.

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It will be interesting to see what Exposure bring to the table. It was scheduled to be released by about now, so I hope it's not far away.
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Yes, I was particularly interested if Brumbear tools are part of Exposure or not?

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The suggestion by someone in this forum of a quick-release system for the Sinarback was inspired. Changing adapters now is doable in a few minutes but it makes me a little nervous. Perhaps Sinar could think about this, and take an already useful feature (back adaptibility) to the next level. We can then leave the adapters permanently on the camera bodies, and move the back around in seconds.
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An excellent idea but will Sinar open their eyes & ears and more importantly, will they change the gear and move forward?

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Good luck with your decision!
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Thank you,

PS: Deciding on Digital Back is far more difficult then I thought.

Regards
Danijela
« Last Edit: February 24, 2007, 03:17:09 PM by Danijela D. Karic » Logged
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« Reply #264 on: February 24, 2007, 08:42:43 PM »
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... but as I said before, unless they change the gear and move forward in to the right direction this year 2007, who ever is at the top deciding will turn SINAR in to DINAR, worthless coin these days.

Regards
Danijela
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=102851\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


hi Danijela,

With all due respect, I have to ask you why you keep on saying and repeating the same over and over again: what makes you have such a bad opinion about Sinar and in which way does Sinar not move in the right direction, for you?

I bet if you would vist the factory and speak with its "top deciding" you would change your mind.

Best regards,
Thierry
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Thierry Hagenauer
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« Reply #265 on: February 24, 2007, 08:51:30 PM »
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Dear Danijela,

what could I improve to be at the same edge as Rainer?

I believe I have answered each and any single of your questions addressed to myself, as well as your PM. If I  have forgotten something, kindly let me know and I shall answer you. If I was not fast eough, kindly accept my apology, but I am here because I am passionated by photography, not because being asked by Sinar, thus my work not allows me to be 7/7 & 24/24 online answering and checking. Kindly let me know.

Brumbaer Tools and Exposure: yes, this will be part of it, of course.

Thanks and best regards,
Thierry

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Yes, I agree.  Ranier and Thierry are very helpful and although Thierry never failed to deliver, I have to give the edge to Ranier, he basically provided requested details in no time.
Thatís a relief.
Yes, I was particularly interested if Brumbear tools are part of Exposure or not?
An excellent idea but will Sinar open their eyes & ears and more importantly, will they change the gear and move forward?
Thank you,

PS: Deciding on Digital Back is far more difficult then I thought.

Regards
Danijela
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Thierry Hagenauer
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« Reply #266 on: February 24, 2007, 09:16:29 PM »
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Dear Danijela,

Although Hasselblad has promoted the H3D since Photokina '06, it starts to hit the streets only NOW, slowly and NOT in all countries.

You will see the Sinar Hy6 actively promoted when it will be available, not before. But this won't be so far away, since I have informed here and since before Christmas that we shall be ready shipping the first units by June. the "0-Series" with my demo unit is due to me end of March/begin of April. It would not be serious, IMO, to promote something interested photographers cannot see and hold in their hand: it has proven to be wrong to do so.

Yes, as Foto-Z put it rightly, the Hy6 builts-up on the 6008 and 6008 AF, and is fully compatible (lenses and accessories). Those wishing to work now have the 6008 AF, and will be able to use lenses and accessories on the Hy6, if they wish so. Is this possible with other systems? IMO the Hy6 is as proven a camera as the H3D when hitting the streets, not more but also not less.

Best regards,
Thiery

Quote
I am in favor of Rollei and therefore have high hopes for Hy6. Having said that, I simply donít have any religious interest comparing products like H1/H2/H3 and product like Hy6 that didnít surf yet.

We can certainly compare Rollei vs. Hasselblad/Mamiya, other then that, letís wait a while and see what happens.
Hasselblad is of course not proven, but I canít deny that it is getting better and better. Hy6 is not unknown you are right, but more among the enthusiasts then anywhere else. Majority of working photographers couldnít care less and Iíll believe that until it gets in action. The question is, will it be proven when it gets on the street? Certainly not. So, how far away is really Hy6 and how good is the Hasselblad/Mamiya Now, Today, This Very Hour? Of course there will always be space for improvement, regardless of platform/model we decide to purchase.
I donít think anybody can complain in that regard. Remember, I like Rollei and with ALPA Cameras I can use their lenses, their Hy6 would be IDEAL as a MF AF platform. So basically, I canít ask for more. However, the fact remains Hy6 is not to surf next week or next month, etc.

So, letís wait and see what happens and of course, hope for the BEST.
[span style=\'font-size:13pt;line-height:100%\']To be continued
[/span]

Regards
Danijela
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« Last Edit: February 24, 2007, 10:28:54 PM by thsinar » Logged

Thierry Hagenauer
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« Reply #267 on: February 25, 2007, 12:52:34 AM »
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Euh. Not sure who had them first but Imacon has the same adapter plate idea (as well as stuff like 4 and 16 shot, where with Imacon this module can be bought seperately for some backs).

Quick releases would be an enormous asset. I certainly hope Phase as well as Leaf (particularly Leaf) will also come with an adapterplate system.
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Oops. I'm glad you pointed out my oversight.

I extend the question to whomever's lurking here for Hasselblad: how about going to quick-release adaptors?


-H.
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« Reply #268 on: February 25, 2007, 08:06:44 AM »
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Dear Danijela,

Although Hasselblad has promoted the H3D since Photokina '06, it starts to hit the streets only NOW, slowly and NOT in all countries.

You will see the Sinar Hy6 actively promoted when it will be available, not before. But this won't be so far away, since I have informed here and since before Christmas that we shall be ready shipping the first units by June. the "0-Series" with my demo unit is due to me end of March/begin of April. It would not be serious, IMO, to promote something interested photographers cannot see and hold in their hand: it has proven to be wrong to do so.

Yes, as Foto-Z put it rightly, the Hy6 builts-up on the 6008 and 6008 AF, and is fully compatible (lenses and accessories). Those wishing to work now have the 6008 AF, and will be able to use lenses and accessories on the Hy6, if they wish so. Is this possible with other systems? IMO the Hy6 is as proven a camera as the H3D when hitting the streets, not more but also not less.

Best regards,
Thiery
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=102892\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Thierry:

In the USA, at least, that is not quite accurate your statement on H3D availability. We have been ordering and selling H3D's for over 3 months now, and have not experienced any particular delays.

But to be sure, in my experience Sinar has generally announced and shipped product that is ready to go fairly simultaneously. Although I did have a customer wait months last year for a 120mm lens for their Sinar M. But that was an exception. I can say that Sinar generally doesn't announce false ship dates.

And we certainly hope that the Hy6 is as ready to go as the H3D currently is. Hasselblad stumbled with their integration path from H1D to H3D. However, in our experience they now have a truly capable product that performs very well. What many people also forget about the H3D, is that Hasselblad CF lenses can also be used on the H3D with the CF Adapter, so yes, it is possible to use additional lenses, as the Hy6 will from the 6008 lineage.

We would not categorize the Hy6 as "proven" however until it actually hits the streets and we see how it does. As an authorized Sinar dealer (for over 20 years), we certainly anticipate it and we hope that it does indeed arrive hitting on all cylinders. We look forward to it.

Steve Hendrix
PPR Digital
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Danijela D. Karic
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« Reply #269 on: February 25, 2007, 08:07:00 AM »
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hi Danijela,

With all due respect, I have to ask you why you keep on saying and repeating the same over and over again:
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If you respect the truth, then there is no other more honest way to put it, possible altered versions are considered but the conversation will last longer Iím sure and it will turn in to never ending discussion/clichť, which as far as I am concerned is counterproductive.

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what makes you have such a bad opinion about Sinar
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If you replace in your question two words [span style=\'font-size:14pt;line-height:100%\']bad opinion[/span] with one [span style=\'font-size:14pt;line-height:100%\']concerns[/span], you will get close to my answer.

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and in which way does Sinar not move in the right direction, for you?
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Answer your self few simple questions: What is SINARS most successful selling product.

Annual turn over of Sinar products/Cameras?
Annual turn over of Sinar products/Lenses?
Annual turn over of Sinar products/Digital Backs?
Annual turn over of Sinar products/etc.?

Ask your self, how would you surpass and at least in this instance compare your,
Annual turnover with regards to Hasselblad?
Annual turnover with regards to Mamiya?
Annual turnover with regards to Phase?
Annual turnover with regards to Leaf?
Annual turnover with regards to etc.?

The right direction for improvement that I am talking about becomes a little more apparent, isnít it?

Now, answer your self a simple question: What is SINARS future most successful selling product?

Now, based on the numbers above, my answer becomes transparent and more evident. As I always say, [span style=\'font-size:14pt;line-height:100%\']Letís hope for the best![/span] I hope itís OK if I repeat myself in that regard.

[span style=\'font-size:14pt;line-height:100%\']To be continuedÖ[/span] in time of the official arrival of Hy6

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I bet if you would vist the factory and speak with its "top deciding" you would change your mind.

Best regards,
Thierry
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I would love to visit SINAR Factory.

Regards
Danijela
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thsinar
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« Reply #270 on: February 25, 2007, 08:15:05 AM »
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Alright Steve,

thanks for the precisions about H3D delivery. In this case it seems to be different in my region here in Asia: there are still many countries where it still doesn't deliver yet, or jsu starting slowly.

Thanks for your experience and statement about Sinar's product delivery accuracy: we try in the limit of the possible not to give wrong expectations.

Best regards,
Thierry

Quote
Thierry:

In the USA, at least, that is not quite accurate your statement on H3D availability. We have been ordering and selling H3D's for over 3 months now, and have not experienced any particular delays.

But to be sure, in my experience Sinar has generally announced and shipped product that is ready to go fairly simultaneously. Although I did have a customer wait months last year for a 120mm lens for their Sinar M. But that was an exception. I can say that Sinar generally doesn't announce false ship dates.

And we certainly hope that the Hy6 is as ready to go as the H3D currently is. Hasselblad stumbled with their integration path from H1D to H3D. However, in our experience they now have a truly capable product that performs very well. What many people also forget about the H3D, is that Hasselblad CF lenses can also be used on the H3D with the CF Adapter, so yes, it is possible to use additional lenses, as the Hy6 will from the 6008 lineage.

We would not categorize the Hy6 as "proven" however until it actually hits the streets and we see how it does. As an authorized Sinar dealer (for over 20 years), we certainly anticipate it and we hope that it does indeed arrive hitting on all cylinders. We look forward to it.

Steve Hendrix
PPR Digital
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Thierry Hagenauer
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« Reply #271 on: February 25, 2007, 08:32:52 AM »
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Alright Danijela, got your CONCERNS. Everything is fine and OK.

You are certainly right and be sure that these are questions we have put on the table long ago, when we jumped into the digital age, 15 years ago, and are still dealing with on a daily basis: it is the essence of survival of a serious company to deal with such constantly.

Do not hesitate to visit us, should you be nearby Switzerland.

All the best,
Thierry

Quote
If you respect the truth, then there is no other more honest way to put it, possible altered versions are considered but the conversation will last longer Iím sure and it will turn in to never ending discussion/clichť, which as far as I am concerned is counterproductive.
If you replace in your question two words [span style=\'font-size:14pt;line-height:100%\']bad opinion[/span] with one [span style=\'font-size:14pt;line-height:100%\']concerns[/span], you will get close to my answer.
Answer your self few simple questions: What is SINARS most successful selling product.

Annual turn over of Sinar products/Cameras?
Annual turn over of Sinar products/Lenses?
Annual turn over of Sinar products/Digital Backs?
Annual turn over of Sinar products/etc.?

Ask your self, how would you surpass and at least in this instance compare your,
Annual turnover with regards to Hasselblad?
Annual turnover with regards to Mamiya?
Annual turnover with regards to Phase?
Annual turnover with regards to Leaf?
Annual turnover with regards to etc.?

The right direction for improvement that I am talking about becomes a little more apparent, isnít it?

Now, answer your self a simple question: What is SINARS future most successful selling product?

Now, based on the numbers above, my answer becomes transparent and more evident. As I always say, [span style=\'font-size:14pt;line-height:100%\']Letís hope for the best![/span] I hope itís OK if I repeat myself in that regard.

[span style=\'font-size:14pt;line-height:100%\']To be continuedÖ[/span] in time of the official arrival of Hy6
I would love to visit SINAR Factory.

Regards
Danijela
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« Reply #272 on: February 25, 2007, 08:38:15 AM »
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But to be sure, in my experience Sinar has generally announced and shipped product that is ready to go fairly simultaneously. Although I did have a customer wait months last year for a 120mm lens for their Sinar M. But that was an exception. I can say that Sinar generally doesn't announce false ship dates.
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Another VOTE!

[span style=\'font-size:12pt;line-height:100%\']Way to go SINAR!!![/span]

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And we certainly hope that the Hy6 is as ready to go as the H3D currently is. Hasselblad stumbled with their integration path from H1D to H3D. However, in our experience they now have a truly capable product that performs very well. What many people also forget about the H3D, is that Hasselblad CF lenses can also be used on the H3D with the CF Adapter, so yes, it is possible to use additional lenses, as the Hy6 will from the 6008 lineage.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=102952\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
I didnít think of that, but itís nice to hear it is available.

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We would not categorize the Hy6 as "proven" however until it actually hits the streets and we see how it does. As an authorized Sinar dealer (for over 20 years), we certainly anticipate it and we hope that it does indeed arrive hitting on all cylinders. We look forward to it.

Steve Hendrix
PPR Digital
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=102952\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Wouldnít that be something. That is exactly how I feel, perhaps I have high hopes for Hy6 because of the integration abilities, so Iím concerned a bit.

ALPA Ľ Hy6 Ľ Beautiful Lenses, I canít go wrong with that.

Regards
Danijela
« Last Edit: February 25, 2007, 08:40:02 AM by Danijela D. Karic » Logged
Danijela D. Karic
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« Reply #273 on: February 25, 2007, 08:55:19 AM »
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Alright Danijela, got your CONCERNS. Everything is fine and OK.
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This is where we disagree, but we will wait and see what happens and when it happens.

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You are certainly right and be sure that these are questions we have put on the table long ago, when we jumped into the digital age, 15 years ago, and are still dealing with on a daily basis: it is the essence of survival of a serious company to deal with such constantly.
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That is exactly my concern. If SINAR uses the same Logic and the same Tempo that they used over a period of 15years, my question is, how would the next 15y look? my intuition tells me, not bright enough.

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Do not hesitate to visit us, should you be nearby Switzerland.

All the best,
Thierry
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I will be in Switzerland during the month of May.

Regards
Danijela
« Last Edit: February 25, 2007, 12:39:02 PM by Danijela D. Karic » Logged
mkravit
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« Reply #274 on: February 25, 2007, 08:55:27 AM »
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Anybody using Ľ [span style=\'font-size:12pt;line-height:100%\']Arca-Swiss C1 Cube Geared Head [span style=\'font-size:11pt;line-height:100%\']with Arca-Type Flip-Lock Quick Release[/span][/span][span style=\'font-size:14pt;line-height:100%\']?[/span]

Apart from the obvious one `Expensive` All critiques are welcome !!!

Regards
Danijela
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=102424\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

D.

I have been using the Arca C1 Cube for a bout 2 years now.  Great asset, makes fast work of setting up and is very flexible. One thing did was remove the quick release lever clamp and replace it with a Really Right Suff screw style clamp. The lever clamp is now much more secure. I did this after almost losing my camera and back when the clamp lever failed to positively snap into the locked position.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2007, 08:55:48 AM by mkravit » Logged
Dustbak
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« Reply #275 on: February 25, 2007, 09:57:17 AM »
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If you respect the truth, then there is no other more honest way to put it, possible altered versions are considered but the conversation will last longer I’m sure and it will turn in to never ending discussion/clichť, which as far as I am concerned is counterproductive.
If you replace in your question two words [span style=\'font-size:14pt;line-height:100%\']bad opinion[/span] with one [span style=\'font-size:14pt;line-height:100%\']concerns[/span], you will get close to my answer.
Answer your self few simple questions: What is SINARS most successful selling product.

Annual turn over of Sinar products/Cameras?
Annual turn over of Sinar products/Lenses?
Annual turn over of Sinar products/Digital Backs?
Annual turn over of Sinar products/etc.?

Ask your self, how would you surpass and at least in this instance compare your,
Annual turnover with regards to Hasselblad?
Annual turnover with regards to Mamiya?
Annual turnover with regards to Phase?
Annual turnover with regards to Leaf?
Annual turnover with regards to etc.?

The right direction for improvement that I am talking about becomes a little more apparent, isn’t it?

Now, answer your self a simple question: What is SINARS future most successful selling product?

Now, based on the numbers above, my answer becomes transparent and more evident. As I always say, [span style=\'font-size:14pt;line-height:100%\']Let’s hope for the best![/span] I hope it’s OK if I repeat myself in that regard.

[span style=\'font-size:14pt;line-height:100%\']To be continued…[/span] in time of the official arrival of Hy6
I would love to visit SINAR Factory.

Regards
Danijela
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You are not making a lot of sense with these comparisons. Annual turnover just one but certainly not the best indication of a companies well being. If you would have a look at net profit or profitability ratio it would be a different story.

Furthermore when this would be really important to you, there is only one company you should buy your photographic products from:


[span style=\'font-size:30pt;line-height:100%\']CANON[/span]

I have seen you grow more sceptical or concerned towards Sinar during this thread but sofar I have not heard one valid good argument. When you do have concerns other than turnover comparisons I would love to hear them as well and at least you will give Thierry the possibility to address these concerns.

Concerns about turnover, profitability, dividend, ROI, etc.. should be vented on the annual shareholders meeting or during analist updates.

I do not believe the Sinar products suffer, if they do, because of pending insolvability.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2007, 10:02:51 AM by Dustbak » Logged
Danijela D. Karic
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« Reply #276 on: February 25, 2007, 11:23:16 AM »
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You are not making a lot of sense with these comparisons.
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It is rather obvious that my perception with regards to the present situation makes a lot of sense. However, the truth is never easy to digest. So in that regard, I canít possibly think that everybody will agree, right?

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Annual turnover just one but certainly not the best indication of a companies well being.
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I agree, but ask your accountant if it is related at all, and respectfully see who doesnít make sense here.

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If you would have a look at net profit or profitability ratio it would be a different story.
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Perhaps, but that doesnít change the fact of the current scenario, thatís all.

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Furthermore when this would be really important to you, there is only one company you should buy your photographic products from:
[span style=\'font-size:17pt;line-height:100%\']CANON[/span]
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Yes, you are right and for your information, I do own CANON.

However, to put it politely, we are talking here about the MF with LF Digital Lenses etc. As far as I know, Canon didnít start shipping MF with LF digital Lenses, but to give you benefit of the doubt, I will try to pretend that you make loads of sense down the road, which is to say perhaps in future Canon may have a solution to our concerns.

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I have seen you grow more sceptical or concerned towards Sinar during this thread but sofar I have not heard one valid good argument.
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[span style=\'font-size:10pt;line-height:100%\']You mean, not a single one that you would like to agree/hear.[/span]

Some individuals need more time, some need less. Pure nature if you ask me, nothing to worry about, or is there a rule that fits all?

On the same note, are we allowed to consider the matter of our preference?

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When you do have concerns other than turnover comparisons I would love to hear them as well and at least you will give Thierry the possibility to address these concerns.
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Am I under impression that you in fact speak with enough authority like you truly care to help. Thierry has already been helpful as many others have, on several matters. However, I do believe that this thread is not about the SINAR alone or am I wrong in saying that?

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Concerns about turnover, profitability, dividend, ROI, etc.. should be vented on the annual shareholders meeting or during analist updates
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I agree, perhaps you would like to bring the details forward when available.

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I do not believe the Sinar products suffer, if they do, because of pending insolvability.
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You are more then welcome to believe in your interests. I hope you understand that you canít deny me the same privilege and for your information, you are talking here with the future owner of SINAR Cameras.

Regards
Danijela
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Dustbak
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« Reply #277 on: February 25, 2007, 12:40:00 PM »
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It is rather obvious that my perception with regards to the present situation makes a lot of sense. However, the truth is never easy to digest. So in that regard,

However, to put it politely, we are talking here about the MF with LF Digital Lenses etc. As far as I know, Canon didn’t start shipping MF with LF digital Lenses, but to give you benefit of the doubt, I will try to pretend that you make loads of sense down the road, which is to say perhaps in future Canon may have a solution to our concerns.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=103002\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


Apparently you have patented the truth. Maybe you can be so generous as to share it somewhat with us mere mortals. I am not sure what truth you are talking about and why you have to put it underlined in bold and a larger font?

It also looks like you do agree there is more than annual turnover since you suddenly also make a distinction on who produces what.

None of your text is really polite but I will try not to be offended by that. If you feel that there are concerns regarding a MF back than I would love to read them but I have not read it besides the annual turnover thing which indeed I believe to be a non-issue at this moment (who knows what the future brings even companies perceived a lot more stable have gone down). Just point or link me to the phrases I must have overread or otherwise missed.

Are you saying/implying you believe Sinar products are suffering from cashflow crunch or insolvability?

I truly do not care whether you claim to be the future owner of Sinar or Santa Claus.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2007, 12:41:51 PM by Dustbak » Logged
Danijela D. Karic
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« Reply #278 on: February 25, 2007, 01:47:30 PM »
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Apparently you have patented the truth.
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You have my attention.

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Maybe you can be so generous as to share it somewhat with us mere mortals.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=103037\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Clichť, but considering your effort, you deserve Standing Ovation for this one!!!

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I am not sure what truth you are talking about and why you have to put it underlined in bold and a larger font?
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=103037\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
I guess to you, that will always remain a mystery.  Ľ It is underlined in bold, but not in large font, no need to exaggerate.

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It also looks like you do agree there is more than annual turnover since you suddenly also make a distinction on who produces what.
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Of course I agree. However, a distinction was not made suddenly as you claim, I just didnít find them to be less important, but rather short-cut & easy to comprehend without thoroughly going through a number of different aspects.

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None of your text is really polite but I will try not to be offended by that.
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Am I to believe I found you offended by my disagreements and react further with respect that you deserve better? I donít think so.

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If you feel that there are concerns regarding a MF back than I would love to read them but I have not read it besides the annual turnover thing which indeed I believe to be a non-issue at this moment (who knows what the future brings even companies perceived a lot more stable have gone down). Just point or link me to the phrases I must have overread or otherwise missed.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=103037\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
My concerns are not only & especially regarded towards MF back. However, they are approached with enough attention by Rainer, Thierry an many others, so if you have failed to see them, read again, otherwise whatever you decide is just fine by me.

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Are you saying/implying you believe Sinar products are suffering from cashflow crunch or insolvability?
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I will let you figure that one on your own, or perhaps donít waste time thinking, ask somebody you are more likely to trust.

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I truly do not care whether you claim to be the future owner of Sinar or Santa Claus.
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I know you donít care, should I be impressed?

May I encourage you for the future reference, regardless of  how devoted or help worthy you believe to be, if we are to talk further using the same frequency I suggest we use PM. and leave this thread more productive.

Your assistance is highly valued and appreciated.


Regards
Danijela
« Last Edit: February 25, 2007, 02:28:17 PM by Danijela D. Karic » Logged
ynp
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« Reply #279 on: February 25, 2007, 02:48:42 PM »
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Lets calm down. A lot of the members remember what had happened when some members of the RG MF forum lost temper.
Regards,
Yevgeny
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