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Author Topic: Weird Color Issues with Mac G5  (Read 18009 times)
Photolandscape
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« on: February 21, 2007, 01:15:17 PM »
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I've been in the tombs of color management hell for the better part of six months. Here is my story:

I have an old Mac G5 1.6Ghz tower with its original nVidia 5200 video card (bought used six months ago) connected to an HP 2335 monitor. I am using the latest OSX Tiger, Adobe CS2. When I look at my images, that once looked terrific on the screen, they look horrible--for lack of a better description, somewhat posterized in the denser color areas, oversaturated, pinkish in the highlights. My monitor is profiled, using the latest Eye One tool.

If I plug the HP 2335 directly into my Mac G4 12" Powerbook, and look at a file of an image, it looks fine. But if I view the same file through the G5 1.6 Ghz, I get the awful color.

I believe the monitor is properly calibrated. I thought that the video card might be acting up, but I replaced it with two identical cards, and both displayed the identical color issues. So I've ruled out the video card.

Can anyone out there in digital photo land suggest what to do, what is wrong? How could the computer itself adversely affect the colors I'm seeing? Is my computer dying? Any suggestions on what to replace it with? Would it make sense to try out an iMac 24" screen? As you can see, I am floundering around and have no idea what to think or do.

Any help would be appreciated.
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JBillings
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« Reply #1 on: February 22, 2007, 08:20:03 PM »
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I've been in the tombs of color management hell for the better part of six months. Here is my story:

I have an old Mac G5 1.6Ghz tower with its original nVidia 5200 video card (bought used six months ago) connected to an HP 2335 monitor. I am using the latest OSX Tiger, Adobe CS2. When I look at my images, that once looked terrific on the screen, they look horrible--for lack of a better description, somewhat posterized in the denser color areas, oversaturated, pinkish in the highlights. My monitor is profiled, using the latest Eye One tool.

If I plug the HP 2335 directly into my Mac G4 12" Powerbook, and look at a file of an image, it looks fine. But if I view the same file through the G5 1.6 Ghz, I get the awful color.

I believe the monitor is properly calibrated. I thought that the video card might be acting up, but I replaced it with two identical cards, and both displayed the identical color issues. So I've ruled out the video card.

Can anyone out there in digital photo land suggest what to do, what is wrong? How could the computer itself adversely affect the colors I'm seeing? Is my computer dying? Any suggestions on what to replace it with? Would it make sense to try out an iMac 24" screen? As you can see, I am floundering around and have no idea what to think or do.

Any help would be appreciated.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=102178\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

When you say that you think your monitor is properly calibrated on the G5.. did you do hardware calibration or software calibration with the Apple utilities?
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Paul Sumi
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« Reply #2 on: February 22, 2007, 09:12:21 PM »
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I am wondering if your Mac G5 monitor is properly calibrated.

Posting a sample photo here which exhibits the problems you see on your Mac G5 may help us "see" if other people's monitors show this same problem.

It would also help if you could tell us the settings to which your desktop monitor is calibrated (color temperature, gamma and luminance (cd/m2)).

Paul
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Tim Lookingbill
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« Reply #3 on: February 22, 2007, 11:50:10 PM »
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Sounds like a corrupted i1 monitor profile. Does it display the same if loading one of the generic monitor profiles as part of the OS install like sRGB, Mac Standard Display, etc.?
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Photolandscape
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« Reply #4 on: February 25, 2007, 05:10:20 PM »
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I am wondering if your Mac G5 monitor is properly calibrated.

Posting a sample photo here which exhibits the problems you see on your Mac G5 may help us "see" if other people's monitors show this same problem.

It would also help if you could tell us the settings to which your desktop monitor is calibrated (color temperature, gamma and luminance (cd/m2)).

Paul
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=102504\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


Paul, sorry for taking a few days to get back in touch. Been away. But thanks for the questions. Answers are: Gamma 2.2, luminance 140, color temp 6500K. Interestingly, when I try gamma at 1.8, or luminance at let's say 100, and/or color temp @ 5000K, I still get the same phenomenon.

I am going to try to attach two files--one showing what it should look like, and the second showing the actual on screen.

Thanks again.
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Photolandscape
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« Reply #5 on: February 25, 2007, 05:34:23 PM »
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When you say that you think your monitor is properly calibrated on the G5.. did you do hardware calibration or software calibration with the Apple utilities?
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=102500\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I am not entirely sure I know the difference. When I saw properly calibrated, I mean I used my Eye-One Monitor Calibration tool, advanced settings, followed every step carefully, zeroed out the monitor before starting, and everything else I can think of that one is supposed to do.

I haven't done anything with Apple utilities--is that something I should look into, and if so, any suggestions on what steps to take?
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Photolandscape
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« Reply #6 on: February 25, 2007, 05:38:46 PM »
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Sounds like a corrupted i1 monitor profile. Does it display the same if loading one of the generic monitor profiles as part of the OS install like sRGB, Mac Standard Display, etc.?
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=102518\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I appreciate the suggestion. However, the problem is the same regardless of monitor profile selected. I have tried several, but always get the same plugged-up, polarized colors on the screen on my G5. Using a different computer--like my G4 Powerbook--the problem goes away. Considering the fact that I have tried two other video cards for the G5, I am thinking more and more that it is some sort of operating system glitch, or a hardware glitch (motherboard, for example). I do have 2.5GB of RAM, and early on wondered whether it could be RAM issue, but removed the two 1GB RAM chips I'd added, but it made no difference.

Thanks for the suggestions!
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61Dynamic
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« Reply #7 on: February 25, 2007, 06:48:46 PM »
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I haven't done anything with Apple utilities--is that something I should look into, and if so, any suggestions on what steps to take?
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=103104\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
No, he was just verifying. You should stay away from the Apple software utilities.


1. Did you calibrate the display with the EyeOne when you connected it to the laptop?

2. Of the different profiles you've tried were they all made with the EyeOne?

2. You only mentioned removing ram you added. Also try removing the original ram that shipped with the computer and test it with the newer ram in it's place.
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Photolandscape
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« Reply #8 on: February 25, 2007, 07:39:41 PM »
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No, he was just verifying. You should stay away from the Apple software utilities.
1. Did you calibrate the display with the EyeOne when you connected it to the laptop?

2. Of the different profiles you've tried were they all made with the EyeOne?

2. You only mentioned removing ram you added. Also try removing the original ram that shipped with the computer and test it with the newer ram in it's place.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=103124\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Thanks, 61Dynamic. I calibrated my laptop and my G5 separately, both with the Eye One.

All the profiles I have at this point are made with the EyeOne. Had some older profiles made with an older Spyder, but got rid of those several months ago.

Just tried what you suggested re: ram, but no difference at this point.

I'm wondering whether there could be some other program or profile conflicting with each  other and causing the problem?

TX, SP
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61Dynamic
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« Reply #9 on: February 26, 2007, 10:36:43 AM »
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I'm wondering whether there could be some other program or profile conflicting with each  other and causing the problem?

TX, SP
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There could be. Make sure nothing like Adobe Gamma is loading at startup (System Preferences > Account Pref > Login Items).

You could also try a different monitor cable. If you have another display in the house, connect it and see if the issue persists.

If that doesn't take care of it I'd take it in to Apple and see what they can do.
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dcp
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« Reply #10 on: February 26, 2007, 11:22:42 AM »
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.....for lack of a better description, somewhat posterized in the denser color areas, oversaturated, pinkish in the highlights. My monitor is profiled, using the latest Eye One tool.

[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=102178\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I've had this problem with the lcd on my powerbook before. I'm not quite sure why either but it eventually went away. It happened after a routine lcd calibration. Images on safari would look crap esp the greens.. neonish dirty green and the posterisation you described but on FIrefox was fine.

What I did then was sent the monitor through several recalibration stages from calibrating with the lower lcd brightness and with its max. Then shut down the machine, allowed the lcd to cool.. started it until the colors seemed stable (at this point, the issue was still there), set the recalibration.. and it went away. I do remember that the whole issue started when I set the calibration to use LUT instead of the Matrix. This time I remembered to set it back to Matrix (which worked fine before this). Now its back to normal but it took a fair bit of time before it did. I've got a feeling the spectrometer somehow altered the GPU hardware settings itself. Maybe you can try to flash the pram before. Oh, I tried that too a few times before doing the calibration.

hope that helps.
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jackbingham
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« Reply #11 on: February 26, 2007, 04:16:33 PM »
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There are only so many things involved here. The monitor, the video card, the calibration software and it's preferences and perhaps the colorsync prefs. I would reset your monitor to srgb in system prefs. Then I would reset the monitor to it's defaults. then I would restart. Problem still there? if not try a fresh calibration. Make note of whether the monitor is being calibrated using ddc. it can all go south here if communication is not complete. if the color goes wacky and the calibration software appears to be using ddc try to turn it off. This does sound very much like the video lut is not being flushed. do you see the screen flash brighter when you start calibration? Confirm that nothing else is in startup items and you might also toss the colorsysnc prefs.
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Jack Bingham
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Photolandscape
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« Reply #12 on: February 27, 2007, 12:04:35 AM »
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There are only so many things involved here. The monitor, the video card, the calibration software and it's preferences and perhaps the colorsync prefs. I would reset your monitor to srgb in system prefs. Then I would reset the monitor to it's defaults. then I would restart. Problem still there? if not try a fresh calibration. Make note of whether the monitor is being calibrated using ddc. it can all go south here if communication is not complete. if the color goes wacky and the calibration software appears to be using ddc try to turn it off. This does sound very much like the video lut is not being flushed. do you see the screen flash brighter when you start calibration? Confirm that nothing else is in startup items and you might also toss the colorsysnc prefs.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=103349\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Thanks, these are all very worthwhile ideas, and I will try them all as soon as possible. Just one question--what is "ddc"? Also, "lut"?
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Photolandscape
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« Reply #13 on: February 27, 2007, 01:37:18 AM »
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There are only so many things involved here. The monitor, the video card, the calibration software and it's preferences and perhaps the colorsync prefs. I would reset your monitor to srgb in system prefs. Then I would reset the monitor to it's defaults. then I would restart. Problem still there? if not try a fresh calibration. Make note of whether the monitor is being calibrated using ddc. it can all go south here if communication is not complete. if the color goes wacky and the calibration software appears to be using ddc try to turn it off. This does sound very much like the video lut is not being flushed. do you see the screen flash brighter when you start calibration? Confirm that nothing else is in startup items and you might also toss the colorsysnc prefs.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=103349\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Here is the latest, live from Color Management Hell:

I reset the monitor to sRGB in System Prefs. Then reset the monitor to its defaults. Restarted the G5. Looked like the problem still existed, so, I tried a fresh calibration. When I selected the device to profile in the Eye-One software, when I selected monitor the screen britened a bit as it moved into the next window ("Monitor Type"). When I moved on to the next window ("Choose Calibration Settings"), the screen got slightly darker. Don't know what that means, if anything. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated. Not sure how to get into startup items or how to get rid of colorsync prefs.
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Photolandscape
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« Reply #14 on: February 27, 2007, 01:40:28 AM »
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There could be. Make sure nothing like Adobe Gamma is loading at startup (System Preferences > Account Pref > Login Items).

You could also try a different monitor cable. If you have another display in the house, connect it and see if the issue persists.

If that doesn't take care of it I'd take it in to Apple and see what they can do.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=103252\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Thanks. One more question--where do I find Adobe Gamma to find out if it is being loaded? I can get to System Prefs., but in 10.4.8, I don't see a file for Acct. Prefs or Log-In Items.
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jackbingham
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« Reply #15 on: February 27, 2007, 06:06:24 AM »
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" when I selected monitor the screen britened a bit as it moved into the next window ("Monitor Type"). When I moved on to the next window ("Choose Calibration Settings"), the screen got slightly darker."
This is actually good news. Match is zeroing out the video lut (lookup table) before starting to make corrections which is why you see it go bright and then start to darken as it adjusts to hit your color and brightness targets.
Colorsync prefs I confess I'm having a hard time finding myself. Startup or login items are under accounts in system prefs. You should confirm that you do not have adobe gamma or another profile loader besides the gretag one in there.
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Jack Bingham
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orangekay
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« Reply #16 on: February 27, 2007, 06:07:17 AM »
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I could be wrong, but I don't think an OS X version of Adobe Gamma ever existed. That was ancient cdev and INIT code from the System 7 days.
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jackbingham
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« Reply #17 on: February 27, 2007, 06:39:57 AM »
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I could be wrong, but I don't think an OS X version of Adobe Gamma ever existed. That was ancient cdev and INIT code from the System 7 days.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=103461\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I am sure you are correct about that. Just wanted to make sure there was no legacy problem hiding here.
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Jack Bingham
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« Reply #18 on: February 27, 2007, 06:42:25 AM »
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One more thing to check. In system preferences/universal access, be sure that the display contrast slider is all the way to the left at normal. This can quickly screw up a calibration.
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Jack Bingham
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61Dynamic
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« Reply #19 on: February 27, 2007, 10:11:33 AM »
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Your startup items are found in User Accounts. Click on your account name and you will see tabs at the top including "Login Items."
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