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Author Topic: pentax  (Read 56991 times)
pss
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« on: February 21, 2007, 06:40:53 PM »
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i guess there is a new/old player...this looks more serious then the ZD....has the sensor of the P30/hassD31....interesting..
« Last Edit: February 21, 2007, 06:41:09 PM by pss » Logged

DarkPenguin
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« Reply #1 on: February 21, 2007, 06:44:38 PM »
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I wonder how many megapixels it will be up to by the time it ships.
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BernardLanguillier
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« Reply #2 on: February 21, 2007, 06:53:15 PM »
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i guess there is a new/old player...this looks more serious then the ZD....has the sensor of the P30/hassD31....interesting..
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=102219\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

And what exactly is not serious about the ZD?

I have seen you bashing this camera repeatedely in the past few weeks, but have never heard any concrete information justifying the criticism...

Those who own one are very happy about it, so why do you keep hammering on it?

Cheers,
Bernard
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pss
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« Reply #3 on: February 21, 2007, 07:37:20 PM »
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And what exactly is not serious about the ZD?

I have seen you bashing this camera repeatedely in the past few weeks, but have never heard any concrete information justifying the criticism...

Those who own one are very happy about it, so why do you keep hammering on it?

Cheers,
Bernard
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=102226\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

sorry bernard...i really don't mean to bash the ZD at all....i have repeatedly stated that the camera has a place in the market , and that for certain applications it is a good deal for the money....
a lot of people have unrealistic expectations when it comes down to it....they think that the ZD will give them the same quality as a 22mipx phase or leaf back, which it won't....
i reported on the ZD back coming to the states at a good price and i think(hope) it will mix up the market a bit....
when i wrote serious i meant this camera will be in a different priceclass as the ZD....i read another clip where the price was quoted as being in the same range as the hassH3D 31, makes sense, it has the same chip....so this is not competition for the ZD, but for the P30 and H3D31...both of which are a step up from the ZD (i think we both agree on that)....that is why i called it more serious....

in a way the ZD reminds me of the kodak 14n (which i owned and liked a lot)...with a little work the files really were amazing....the camera had it's limitations but the price was great.....
hope this explains my thinking a bit....
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david o
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« Reply #4 on: February 21, 2007, 07:43:16 PM »
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it says : " Kodak-developed extra-large CCD image sensor with 31.6 total megapixels"
what extra large ccd could be?
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John_Black
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« Reply #5 on: February 21, 2007, 08:52:02 PM »
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I think "extra large" is a marketing jockey comparing apples & oranges - it's extra large compared to the dSLRs (ie K10D, etc).  I'd expect a price closer to $18k (Mamiya AFD II body is ~$2400 + Phase P30 is $16,990 - $1,000 Mamiya Discount = $18,390).  And if that sensor is not replaceable, then it's a throw-away body, so I'd knock off another $2k because of that.  And if it's 12 or 14 bits like the ZD, then minus another $2k.  $13,999 sounds about right.
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paul_jones
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« Reply #6 on: February 21, 2007, 09:16:13 PM »
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i dont get it, doesnt anyone want a removable finder and a vertical grip anymore? it wouldnt cost much to add these things in the development scheme of things. its like theres a point and shoot design team working on it.

have any of the designers ever had to hold a camera vertical for 9 hours, or needed to shoot at ground level all day (those 90 degree adaptors are a joke). the changable finder and vertical grip was a good selling point years ago with film cameras, why do they think we dont want them now?  its not like we are shooting differently.

im impressed by the 2.8 35mm, but why is it so differcult to make a faster std lens?

its a pity, its hard to get exicited about new cameras nowadays.

paul
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tsjanik
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« Reply #7 on: February 21, 2007, 09:34:28 PM »
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Perhaps it is hype, but I notice that the 55mm DFA lens announced for the 645D is listed as usable with film 645 cameras, which implies a large image circle.
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david o
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« Reply #8 on: February 21, 2007, 09:40:55 PM »
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your right about the viewfinder.
the grip is not really my concern because I'm on tripod most of the time, but i got your point.
Like your work BTW
« Last Edit: February 21, 2007, 09:41:32 PM by david olivier » Logged
paul_jones
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« Reply #9 on: February 21, 2007, 10:32:11 PM »
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your right about the viewfinder.
the grip is not really my concern because I'm on tripod most of the time, but i got your point.
Like your work BTW
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=102253\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

i dont know if the vertical grip isnt going to happen, but it seems an easy thing to add , and sell- even a canon 20d has one, if you want it. im sure they are money for jam.
the mamiya afd dosnt even have the contacts to give it the possiblity for a grip. just seems dumb to me. that was a great selling point about the contax, and also works really well with a canon. they didnt even bother putting on a vertical button on the zd.

paul
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BernardLanguillier
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« Reply #10 on: February 21, 2007, 11:21:31 PM »
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sorry bernard...i really don't mean to bash the ZD at all....i have repeatedly stated that the camera has a place in the market , and that for certain applications it is a good deal for the money....
a lot of people have unrealistic expectations when it comes down to it....they think that the ZD will give them the same quality as a 22mipx phase or leaf back, which it won't....
i reported on the ZD back coming to the states at a good price and i think(hope) it will mix up the market a bit....
when i wrote serious i meant this camera will be in a different priceclass as the ZD....i read another clip where the price was quoted as being in the same range as the hassH3D 31, makes sense, it has the same chip....so this is not competition for the ZD, but for the P30 and H3D31...both of which are a step up from the ZD (i think we both agree on that)....that is why i called it more serious....

in a way the ZD reminds me of the kodak 14n (which i owned and liked a lot)...with a little work the files really were amazing....the camera had it's limitations but the price was great.....
hope this explains my thinking a bit....
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=102236\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Yep, that's clear thanks. Sorry about the confusion.

Regards,
Bernard
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John_Black
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« Reply #11 on: February 22, 2007, 01:05:07 AM »
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I'm 99.95% sure that 35/2.8 is for the k10D, not the 645D.  The "DA" lenses are akin to Nikon's DX and Canon's EF-S lenses.
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John_Black
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« Reply #12 on: February 22, 2007, 01:15:40 AM »
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In regards to the grip and viewfinder, if I were holding a ZD or 645D 9 hours a day, I'm sure my opinions would be radically different.   To me the ZD and 645D are a "bridge" product - like a psuedo medium format cameras in a dSLR format.  It's smaller, easier to pack while on vacation, etc.  In this regard I think Mamiya did an excellent job with the ZD.  And if Pentax and Mamiya are targetting the enthusiasts, semi-pro's, etc., then price is key.  When Pentax pulled the 18 MP version, and they the Hoya announcement... I thought the 645D was dead.  So, I'm quite happy to see it's still happening.  The more choices, the better.
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paul_jones
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« Reply #13 on: February 22, 2007, 02:08:11 AM »
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In regards to the grip and viewfinder, if I were holding a ZD or 645D 9 hours a day, I'm sure my opinions would be radically different.   To me the ZD and 645D are a "bridge" product - like a psuedo medium format cameras in a dSLR format.  It's smaller, easier to pack while on vacation, etc.  In this regard I think Mamiya did an excellent job with the ZD.  And if Pentax and Mamiya are targetting the enthusiasts, semi-pro's, etc., then price is key.  When Pentax pulled the 18 MP version, and they the Hoya announcement... I thought the 645D was dead.  So, I'm quite happy to see it's still happening.  The more choices, the better.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=102297\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


hi, what was the hoya anouncement?

what seems nice about the pentax, it looks really light.

paul
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John_Black
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« Reply #14 on: February 22, 2007, 02:16:31 AM »
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Here's the link for the Hoya / Pentax for "management integration" -

DPreview Announcement
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BJL
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« Reply #15 on: February 22, 2007, 12:57:00 PM »
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it says : " Kodak-developed extra-large CCD image sensor with 31.6 total megapixels"
what extra large ccd could be?
[{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
The [a href=\"http://www.kodak.com/US/en/dpq/site/SENSORS/name/KAF-31600_product]KAF-31600[/url] 55mm diagonal, 33x44mm. That is the same size as the 18MP sensor that Pentax originally planned to use, and the same sensor as in the H3D-31, but I guess at under half the price; maybe the magic $9,999.99.

I hope they drop "645" from the product naming.
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david o
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« Reply #16 on: February 22, 2007, 01:08:30 PM »
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The KAF-31600 55mm diagonal, 33x44mm. That is the same size as the 18MP sensor that Pentax originally planned to use, and the same sensor as in the H3D-31, but I guess at under half the price; maybe the magic $9,999.99.

I hope they drop "645" from the product naming.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=102408\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

ok, so just large for MF. No extra at all. Marketing....
doesn't really matter, if it's a FF  
« Last Edit: February 22, 2007, 01:11:11 PM by david olivier » Logged
BJL
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« Reply #17 on: February 22, 2007, 03:39:53 PM »
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doesn't really matter, if it's a FF
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=102411\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
What do you mean by "FF" here?
If you mean Full Frame type CCD, then it is, as are all "medium format" sensors.
If you mean 24x36mm, clearly it is not: it is 70% larger than that.
If you mean "the same size as some obsolescent film format", then no again.
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BJL
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« Reply #18 on: February 22, 2007, 03:48:04 PM »
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$13,999 sounds about right.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=102245\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
I expect this to cost several thousand less than the Mamiya ZD, wich costs less than that, because
1) The sensor is smaller. (Hasselblad charges several thousand less for the H3D-31 with the same chip as this Pentax than it does for the H3D-22 with the same chip as the Mamiya ZD: sensor size trumps pixel count for cost, it seems.)
2) It's a Pentax, and Pentax has always been the "low price leader" in medium format.

My guess: $9,999.99.
« Last Edit: February 22, 2007, 03:48:15 PM by BJL » Logged
pss
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« Reply #19 on: February 22, 2007, 03:48:44 PM »
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What do you mean by "FF" here?
If you mean Full Frame type CCD, then it is, as are all "medium format" sensors.
If you mean 24x36mm, clearly it is not: it is 70% larger than that.
If you mean "the same size as some obsolescent film format", then no again.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=102446\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
maybe we should all go the hasselblad way and call this one FF 44......just like their H3D39 is FF48....makes things sooooo much easier:)
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