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Author Topic: Eos 5D  (Read 10728 times)
drh681
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« on: August 22, 2005, 04:18:18 PM »
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1/200 instead of 1/250 because of the larger shutter.

they did not have those extra millimeters of curtain travel to play with.

no pop-up?  there has not been one on a single digit series camera in that many years!

mirror lock button? is there one of those on the 1 series cameras?
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anpluto
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« Reply #1 on: August 22, 2005, 06:01:13 PM »
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Flash and the picture mode is the one reason I don't know if I want to replace my 20D... I will probably end up getting the 5D in addition to my 20D.

I use my camera at my friends party or family hang out, and I usually don't carry my heavy flash around. Also the different picture mode comes in handy when your handing the camera to somebody to take a pictures.

I do agree with the print button. Specially for a camera that is missing the simple point and shoot modes I mentioned above.

Mirror lockup... yes, it would be nice to have, but I don't think its much of a trouble. I've gotten used to the function menu. Its easer then changing out my lens.

One think I wish they would have added is more focusing points. I know there are invisible ones, but more focusing point would have been nice.

I will have to put some serious thoughts on the camera though... between the 5D and the 1DM2n...
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jd1566
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« Reply #2 on: August 22, 2005, 12:05:58 PM »
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In what has become a sport of mine, I like picking apart new camera models, working out their strenghts and weaknesses.. Each maker has their own approach, and Canon, bless their sole (sic), has a very peculiar but reasoned approach.

You want it all? Buy a series one camera
Can't afford it? Buy one of a number of other competent but non complete cameras..

Enter the scene the 5D, a pretty impressive camera just from the stats.  For the record, I will be trading my 20D in for this camera as it is (almost) everything I want...

However, why did canon leave all this stuff out?:
-Flash sync of 1/250th? Why only 1/200
-No pop-up flash (the original film Eos 5 had one)
-No A-DEP (one of Canon's better inventions)
-NO MIRROR LOCK UP BUTTON (in the pre-release photos I was hoping what turned out to be the printing button would be the Mirror Lock up button.. now WHO THE H...l NEEDS A PRINTING BUTTON ON A $3300 CAMERA?!?!!?!?!?!!#$#$%$%$^#^&

(Sorry to the administrators for my rant.. I normally abhor strong keystrokes!)

What Canon gives, Canon also taketh away... However, there is reason behind their madness.  Why else take all this stuff out unless they want you to upgrade to a 3D further down the track.. (except for the flash.. sorry folks, please fork out $200 for an external bulky unit, even if all you need is a little fill)...

So, what else is missing? Well too late to write to Canon now.. they don;'t listen to us "poor" consumers (this is a $3300 Camera!) Let's hope its quiet at least..
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ThePhotoOp
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« Reply #3 on: August 22, 2005, 04:19:48 PM »
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I believe Canon's current line up of cameras is excellent.

There is something for everyone and at a wide price margin also. (But there is room in the price chart for one more mid-to high level pro camera...)

I personally love the 1.3 crop of my 1DM2 and will be sorry to see it leave the camera line in the future.

But the reasoning to kill it is sound.

Full frame chips are the future, now that manufactoring capabilites have improved.

The buget minded folks will still have the Digital Rebel and all of it's furture offsrping.

And the truely budget minded folks, who just want a snap shot of little Johnny with birthday cake on his face can purchase one of canons excellent al-in-one point and shooters.

If I did not already have an excellent 14mm lens, then the 5D would be perfect for me.

But for any one who shoot ultra wide, or just wants to stop worring if there 24mm lens is wide enought anymore, than the 5D is a great camera that can do it all, nearly.

For me, the resilution of the 5D isn't high enought to warrent the purchase.

I'm waiting for the full frame 16 or 22 MP that will come out eventually for around $5K. ( I nearly bought the 1dsM2, but I find the 8FPS more useful than more pixels right now)

That mid to high level camera is the only thing left for Canon to produce for the pro market. (IMO)

What  a great time to be a photographer!


Peace,
Jim
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Jim Bianchi
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sjprg
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« Reply #4 on: August 22, 2005, 06:06:44 PM »
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They left out the 16 bit A/D!!! I want more resolution on the shadow end!!
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Paul
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« Reply #5 on: September 19, 2005, 04:53:15 PM »
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-Flash sync of 1/250th? Why only 1/200
I agree with drh681 that it's probably the shutter size.

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-No pop-up flash (the original film Eos 5 had one)
I used the popup flash a few times at first until I realized that with f2.8 and low noise 800 & 1600 I no longer needed flash.

It's still nice for fill though.

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-No A-DEP (one of Canon's better inventions)
This is something I've never used since there's a dedicated button for it.

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-NO MIRROR LOCK UP BUTTON (in the pre-release photos I was hoping what turned out to be the printing button would be the Mirror Lock up button.. now WHO THE H...l NEEDS A PRINTING BUTTON ON A $3300 CAMERA?!?!!?!?!?!!#$#$%$%$^#^&
I recommend that everybody do as I did and send them an email or letter to request a third option on the mirror lockup custom function that ties it to self timer. If enough people complain then they might just add it.
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AJSJones
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« Reply #6 on: September 19, 2005, 06:39:32 PM »
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I'm hoping that Michael's report will say that the "Custom" mode on the mode dial will indeed remember the  settings that we'd like to be able to access at the spin of a dial - e.g. Av mode, MLU enable & timer drive etc.  If it does, then we have what we want, but apparently not because Canon listened to the MLU pleas :-)

One day, someone will be able to hack the print button into a MLU enable button....

If you had a choice, due to limited volume in the "small" camera, of pop-up flash or full size prism for FF viewfinder, which would you choose???

Andy
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madmanchan
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« Reply #7 on: September 20, 2005, 06:59:23 AM »
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Canon designed the 5D primarily for photojournalists and wedding photographers, most of whom rely on external flash units.  For hiking landscape photographers, a solid, sealed top with no built-in flash has an added plus: better protection against the elements.

Regarding MLU, I'd love to have a dedicated button (or have it built into the 2-second self timer) as Michael repeatedly points out.  I've heard a rumor that they refuse to do it because of a patent infringement issue.  *sigh*

Eric
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jani
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« Reply #8 on: September 20, 2005, 07:39:33 AM »
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Regarding MLU, I'd love to have a dedicated button (or have it built into the 2-second self timer) as Michael repeatedly points out.  I've heard a rumor that they refuse to do it because of a patent infringement issue.  *sigh*
If that's so:

Jeez, Canon, pay the license and be done with it. You know we'll pay for it anyway. If the same goes for in-camera image stabilizer, easier sensor cleaning and anti-dust, displaying ISO value in the viewfinder, more than triple AEB, and all the other software features we've moaned about in this forum, maybe you can get a big rebate?
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Jan
jonr
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« Reply #9 on: September 20, 2005, 10:08:24 AM »
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Canon designed the 5D primarily for photojournalists and wedding photographers, most of whom rely on external flash units.  For hiking landscape photographers, a solid, sealed top with no built-in flash has an added plus: better protection against the elements.

Regarding MLU, I'd love to have a dedicated button (or have it built into the 2-second self timer) as Michael repeatedly points out.  I've heard a rumor that they refuse to do it because of a patent infringement issue.  *sigh*

Eric
Sealed top? What on earth for? The rest of the camera isn't sealed. I am very dissappointed that Canon did not weatherseal this camera, I guess they cut every corner to get the cost down...

/still would like to own one...
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BJL
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« Reply #10 on: September 20, 2005, 11:46:55 AM »
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The rest of the camera isn't sealed. I am very dissappointed that Canon did not weatherseal this camera, I guess they cut every corner to get the cost down...
The fact that Canon's new Film Format (FF) DSLR cuts so many corners on everything except the sensor and still costs US$2,000 more than the 20D indicates how much they are constrained between their relatively low price target and the high cost of the sensor.

The marketing goal of the 5D seems to be expanded market share, not high profit margins. The profits are probably expected to come more from increased sales of lenses that are well suited only to FF, not EF-S mount, like the new 28-105 f/4 L IS.
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madmanchan
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« Reply #11 on: September 21, 2005, 08:48:58 AM »
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My point is that a camera with fewer gaps will be less likely to be affected by falling rain and snow than one that has more gaps.  

Frankly, I'm surprised so many people are concerned about the weather sealing.  I know people who have used Rebel and 20D bodies (neither of which are weather-sealed) in blizzards and pouring rain, and the bodies come through with flying colors.  Obviously if these cameras were dropped in a river and submerged, they'd be in trouble.  Even so, the point is that even the consumer and prosumer bodies are fairly robust, so why the concern over the 5D?

Eric
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jani
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« Reply #12 on: September 21, 2005, 09:25:28 AM »
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My point is that a camera with fewer gaps will be less likely to be affected by falling rain and snow than one that has more gaps.  

Frankly, I'm surprised so many people are concerned about the weather sealing.  I know people who have used Rebel and 20D bodies (neither of which are weather-sealed) in blizzards and pouring rain, and the bodies come through with flying colors.  Obviously if these cameras were dropped in a river and submerged, they'd be in trouble.  Even so, the point is that even the consumer and prosumer bodies are fairly robust, so why the concern over the 5D?
The concern isn't over the immediate damage, but over long-term damage from dust and humidity seeping into lots of places in the camera body. Corrosion is one of those things I'd worry about, for instance, if there was a bit of salt spray here, a sand storm there, and some melted snow there ...
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Jan
digidon
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« Reply #13 on: September 21, 2005, 09:11:59 PM »
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The 5D looks like a market response to the NikonD2X.  What do you think?  It just happens to come in around $400 less but with about .400 mp more.  Then you could argue the FF vs smaller sensor size of the D2X.  Just these three points could make it easier for the salesman to push the 5D over the D2x.  I don't believe the D2X has a pop up flash or MLU button....hmmmm.  I wonder if the development schedule of the 5D started after the D2X.
Don
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jani
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« Reply #14 on: September 22, 2005, 02:43:12 AM »
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The 5D looks like a market response to the NikonD2X.  What do you think?  It just happens to come in around $400 less but with about .400 mp more.  Then you could argue the FF vs smaller sensor size of the D2X.  Just these three points could make it easier for the salesman to push the 5D over the D2x.  I don't believe the D2X has a pop up flash or MLU button....hmmmm.  I wonder if the development schedule of the 5D started after the D2X.
Although it isn't exactly a separate button, the D2X does have MLU functionality on a dial, without having to resort to using an obscure menu:

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/nikond2x/page6.asp
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Jan
madmanchan
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« Reply #15 on: September 22, 2005, 06:36:04 AM »
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The 5D looks like a market response to the NikonD2X.  What do you think?  It just happens to come in around $400 less but with about .400 mp more.  Then you could argue the FF vs smaller sensor size of the D2X.  Just these three points could make it easier for the salesman to push the 5D over the D2x.  I don't believe the D2X has a pop up flash or MLU button....hmmmm.  I wonder if the development schedule of the 5D started after the D2X.
Don
Or you can think of it this way: for photographers who don't shoot action but who wanted high-res, there was previously an enormous gap price-wise between the $1300 20D and the $7500 1Ds Mark II.      Now there is a new body priced somewhere in between, with features somewhere in between, too.

Eric
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LeifG
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« Reply #16 on: September 22, 2005, 07:28:59 AM »
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The 5D looks like a market response to the NikonD2X.  
The Canon 5D and Nikon D2x are chalk and cheese. One is a high speed tough pro-camera, the other is not.
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jrm
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« Reply #17 on: September 22, 2005, 01:01:48 PM »
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If I had that much money to drop on a camera body it'd be the D2x every single time. The full frame sensor, whilst nice, wouldn't compensate for all the goodies you get on a D2x.

Is there room in the Canon lineup for a hypothetical EOS 3D? Take the 5D's sensor but up the feature set a little, or would that cut into the 1DsMkII's market?
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Paul Sumi
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« Reply #18 on: September 22, 2005, 02:45:59 PM »
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Is there room in the Canon lineup for a hypothetical EOS 3D?
Possibly not, if Canon "merges" the 1D/1Ds lines into a single pro high FPS full frame camera as announced.  No official word, but I'd love to have a "Mark III" street price under US$5500.

Paul
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kbolin
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« Reply #19 on: September 22, 2005, 04:41:30 PM »
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I just read Michaels review of the 5D and yes he said pretty much everything I expected from this new camera.  One statement that caught me was:

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destined to be a landmark camera – one which will likely produce a great deal of satisfaction for many photographers, and serve as a price / performance benchmark for the rest of the industry over the next year or two.

Next year or two?  There was a time when my film camera was just as good as the next for several years... today I'm like a kid and look forward to the next new DSLR.  Do I need the newest... you bet... but that is for me to decide and why.
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