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Author Topic: HP Pro Satin - Bad 44" roll  (Read 12232 times)
SeanPuckett
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« Reply #20 on: June 14, 2007, 07:39:30 AM »
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Doing testing on the new Red River UltraPro Satin "2.0."  

Colour looks good, very comparable to HP Pro Satin.  
Very rich, deep, wide gamut, etc.  No complaints here.

The texture of this new version is not as subtle as the HP paper, so the specular highlights have a coarser nature than the Pro Satin.  It's easier to tell them apart than the old 1.0.  

Since it's roll media and I haven't done mounting yet, I can't say as to how a flat image will look in typical room lighting.  I'll update after final profile development and some test mounting.
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neil snape
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« Reply #21 on: June 14, 2007, 12:31:14 PM »
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That's too bad to hear about surface problems on shipping product.
I didn't have nay marks on 24 or 36" rolls, or I didn't have in image areas that you may have seen them.
Could you send a jpg or describe where so I can look on my samples?
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dkeyes
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« Reply #22 on: June 15, 2007, 01:00:21 AM »
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Neil,
I haven't had any problems with the 24" rolls just the newer 44" rolls. It's hard to describe the defect but the closest thing is a slightly wavy roller mark. It's like the coating was put on with a different thickness than the rest of the sheet. It's always located right in the middle of the 44" roll and runs in the direction of the roll (length wise). There are two wider marks/lines about 6-8" apart plus many smaller various sized marks/lines. When on lightly inked or light colored areas, the defect shows up as a slight gloss differential, looks like it's smoother there. On darker areas the effect is more pronounced.
Haven't heard back from my HP media group contact, so must be a major problem.
- Doug
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Jim Cole
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« Reply #23 on: June 21, 2007, 12:51:43 PM »
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Just got my two replacement rolls of 44" HP Pro Satin paper from HP Media Services and they appear fine after visually inspecting and running a few prints. All signs of streaking are gone.

HP must have just gotten a bad first run.

Jim
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Jim Cole
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dkeyes
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« Reply #24 on: June 22, 2007, 01:19:23 AM »
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Recieved my replacement roll as well. All seems fine but I asked the HP media person where I could get reliable paper from now on and he said he didn't know yet. I'll have to ration this roll until I get confirmation on where to order good stock.

- Doug
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dkeyes
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« Reply #25 on: November 05, 2007, 12:01:46 AM »
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Finally ordered new rolls of the Pro Satin 44" and found the same flaws as previous rolls. In fact, the only good roll I've had came from HP media directly (they contacted me and replaced my roll).
Anyone found a reliable source for this? So far I've had bad rolls purchased from my HP printer vendor (JVH technical), HP directly, and A Matter of Fax.
- Doug
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Bob Walters
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« Reply #26 on: November 05, 2007, 05:48:13 AM »
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I personally am appalled by the notion of bad rolls of paper.  I have had a few "yellow spots" that could be scraped off with a fingernail on my 24" rolls of HP Prof Satin.  While not costing me any customer reprints due to being found on profiling and proofing runs, this still do not make me thrilled about paying the premium for first party media.

Perhaps we could all lean on Red River to release their UltraPro satin in 36" and 44" rolls.  (Currently offered in 24" rolls only.)  It's a very close match to HP Pro Satin in weight, gamut and lustre but at less than half the price.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=121776\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

My Z3100 is a 24" model, so I'm a happy camper with the RR UltraPro satin paper.  I'm not prepared to say if it's better, worse, or the same as HP Prof Satin, but it's darn close.  I AM prepared to say that, for me at least, HP's paper is not worth twice as much.

I too have had some QC problems with HP papers, occasionally finding odd marks and stains and in one case I discovered a 10" piece of masking tape in the middle of a roll.

Nothing but good results with RR papers so far.

 
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Bob
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« Reply #27 on: November 05, 2007, 07:00:13 AM »
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Finally ordered new rolls of the Pro Satin 44" and found the same flaws as previous rolls. In fact, the only good roll I've had came from HP media directly (they contacted me and replaced my roll).
Anyone found a reliable source for this? So far I've had bad rolls purchased from my HP printer vendor (JVH technical), HP directly, and A Matter of Fax.
- Doug
[{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


[a href=\"http://www.atlex.com/hp_designjet/printer_paper_rolls.htm]Atlex[/url]  has just started carrying a larger selection of HP papers.  I've had great service from them over the years.
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[span style='font-size:14pt;line-height:100%'][span style='font-family:Arial'][span style='font-family:Geneva'][span style='font-size:8pt;line-height:100%']Regards,
Ron[/span][/span][/span][/span]
dkeyes
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« Reply #28 on: November 10, 2007, 05:18:57 PM »
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Well, after 6 rolls in 6 months, I have yet to purchase a usable roll of 44" HP Pro satin. Thanks to my contact at HP media, I've recieved three rolls to date that are good. He informed me they know there is a manufacturing problem and that it is being addressed. Not sure why HP continues to sell defective paper, they should recall it until they get it worked out. It looks like for now, there isn't any reliable source for this media in 44". I know the bad and good lot numbers but no one is able to track that information to find a reliable source. Not sure where HP media is getting the good rolls, probably directly from the manufacturer as they work on this problem. This is a shame since I am printing all my work on this and really need a steady supply. The pro satin is still the best performing paper in the z3100.
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Colorwave
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« Reply #29 on: November 10, 2007, 08:19:53 PM »
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dkeyes-

Does the photo below show the problem you have experienced with HP Professional Satin?  The lines are imperceptible to me before the paper runs through the machine, but look like indentations with a slight sheen differential from the surrounding paper surface.  Now that I've seen both, I now know that these are not starwheel marks.

I've run 600 square feet of the stuff through my 3100 and never once had a tech support person acknowledge that there were know manufacturing defects with this paper.  Because of the intermittent nature of the problem, it has been really difficult to pinpoint the exact problem for me.  I had HP replace my starwheels and the paper outfeed platen, to no avail.  I thought that a tech support suggestion to pull additional media off of the roll in back to lessen the tension on the drive wheels was solving the problem, but now think that it was an unfortunate coincidence that my problem went away because of a good batch of paper, not a change in the printing process.

If this is indeed a known problem to HP, we can only surmise that they are continuing to sell the paper because not enough people are complaining to make it worth it to them to pull it off the shelf.  I find it extremely disappointing that HP would stonewall me about this, but also take a little solace in the thought that it is fixable with better quality control over the paper manufacturing.

-Ron H.

(The shot is taken with on camera flash pointing straight into the print to try to show the texture.  This isn't an easy thing to photograph.)
[attachment=3792:attachment]
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dkeyes
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« Reply #30 on: November 10, 2007, 11:00:24 PM »
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Ron-
Your image shows exactly what I've been getting due to the paper defects. If you pull out the roll and hang it over the top of the printer, in just the right angle of light you can see the paper defects. That is how I determined it wasn't my printer causing this. It drove me crazy for a week until I noticed it on an unprinted area, that's when I checked the roll and found the defects. Unless customers aren't that picky (which I doubt) people must be noticing this defect. I'm sure many think it is the printer causing it. I have even noticed it once on a 24" roll right on the edge. I thought the printer was at fault but again, found the paper defect.
Glad to know I'm not the only one who has noticed. You should send back your paper.
I'm curious to know what your lot number is, the bad rolls I had were 02905570, 02905566.
- Doug
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Colorwave
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« Reply #31 on: November 10, 2007, 11:23:56 PM »
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I'm curious to know what your lot number is, the bad rolls I had were 02905570, 02905566.
- Doug
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=151857\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
I'll let you know on Monday, Doug.  Were you just dealing with people through the main HP sales number, or is there a different department to contact?
-Ron H.
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dkeyes
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« Reply #32 on: November 11, 2007, 03:22:11 PM »
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I'll let you know on Monday, Doug. Were you just dealing with people through the main HP sales number, or is there a different department to contact?
-Ron H.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=151862\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
I returned most of my paper through the place I purchased it from here in the Seattle area. The online stores want you to deal directly with HP, and I have yet to reach somone at HP to get that figured out. I was contacted directly through this post by somone at HP media and he sent me some replacement rolls. So far, these are the only good rolls I have used. Have you actually purchased any good 44" rolls?
- Doug
« Last Edit: November 11, 2007, 03:25:09 PM by dkeyes » Logged

Colorwave
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« Reply #33 on: November 11, 2007, 05:48:51 PM »
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Have you actually purchased any good 44" rolls?
- Doug
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=151988\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
I'm currently working on a roll that started out fine, but now shows problems.  Before the current roll, I've had one roll with it throughout and the rest of the rolls have had intermittent marks.  By intermittent, I mean mostly marked, but with a few sections that show no imperfections.
-Ron H.
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Colorwave
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« Reply #34 on: November 12, 2007, 06:38:38 PM »
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I'm curious to know what your lot number is, the bad rolls I had were 02905570, 02905566.
- Doug
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=151857\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Doug-
I took a look at the lot number for the one remaining box of Pro Satin that I have, the one that was good at the beginning of the roll.  The lot number for that roll is 02905570, the same as the first lot number you referenced above.  Still looking for the lot number that shows good paper from end to end.
Good paper/bad quality control (although they haven't managed to roll the paper on the core backwards, like one manufacturer did recently!)
-Ron H.
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dkeyes
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« Reply #35 on: November 13, 2007, 02:07:35 AM »
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The good rolls I've recieved are lot number: 06109211
No way to specify numbers when ordering though since no one will look for that info. Seems like a simple fix, remove all the bad material and keep all the good material. Or just don't sell any until they get good stock. I guess HP doesn't care until they get enough returns/complaints. That said, no company has ever contacted me to fix a problem like HP has through this forum.
- Doug
« Last Edit: November 13, 2007, 02:09:17 AM by dkeyes » Logged

Colorwave
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« Reply #36 on: November 13, 2007, 02:28:32 AM »
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That said, no company has ever contacted me to fix a problem like HP has through this forum.
- Doug
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=152329\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Doug-

You've run multiple rolls from that lot number with no issues?  Do their lot numbers vary that much, typically, or do the good and bad lot numbers seem rather far apart to you?

Regarding your comment, although nobody has contacted me, I'm pleased to see that HP monitors this site from time to time.  I have yet to see any signs that they ever glance at their own forums.  I think they missed a perfect opportunity with their forums to interact with their customers and share information that could have brought value to both company and customer.  They could share fixes for common issues with users much more readily and lighten the load on their phone support at the same time.  As it is now, it is pretty much a ghost town.

-Ron H.
« Last Edit: November 13, 2007, 02:29:43 AM by Colorwave » Logged

Jim Cole
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« Reply #37 on: November 13, 2007, 08:33:42 AM »
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The two replacement rolls of 44" Pro Satin that I received from HP Media were also lot #06109211.

Jim


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The good rolls I've recieved are lot number: 06109211

- Doug
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=152329\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
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Jim Cole
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dkeyes
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« Reply #38 on: November 16, 2007, 12:41:32 PM »
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You've run multiple rolls from that lot number with no issues?  Do their lot numbers vary that much, typically, or do the good and bad lot numbers seem rather far apart to you?


-Ron H.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=152335\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

So far, the lot numbers have only been the three I have mentioned, with the 06109211 being the only good rolls (no bad rolls).

I also agree that HP could have used their website better. I started posting there early on and got no replies from either users or HP. In contrast, LL has been very helpful.
- Doug
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dkeyes
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« Reply #39 on: September 17, 2009, 02:03:38 PM »
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I'm posting this in hopes that someone from HP is reading this as they have in the past.

Sorry to revive this old thread but I and at least one other person on this forum have had issues again. (only the 44" rolls) Amazing it's been over two years since I first noticed the problem (may 2007) and yet there is still bad inventory out there with no recall of that inventory. I think I've had 8 bad rolls in two years, not good odds since that accounts for almost half of my 44" roll purchases. Not to mention I've purchased these rolls from at least 5 different vendors across the US. It's been almost a year since the last bad roll so I thought this issue was solved, I guess not. The worst part is that HP hasn't communicated to and dealt with this problem at the vendor level and within their own customer service.

HP, please solve this issue. The paper is great (when it's not flawed) and my workflow (and clients) is dialed in with the paper. I don't want to change but may be forced to soon.
« Last Edit: September 17, 2009, 02:14:08 PM by dkeyes » Logged

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