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Author Topic: LEAF AFI IN THE HANDS OF...  (Read 16601 times)
hcubell
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« Reply #60 on: June 26, 2007, 04:45:18 PM »
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Imagine seeing this through the finder:


...which is what 1000s of photographers have been seeing on RZs, RBs, 680s, all V-series and all LF cameras for the last 9 years or so (when the first rectangle 6MP Philips chip came out.

Is that clear enough now? Still bizarre?

Yair
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Yes, I can imagine it. But looking at your diagram, this would not be my preferred way of looking through a viewfinder. It's a kludge that I would not choose, just like watching a 16:9 aspect ratio DVD on a 4:3 TV in letterboxed format. What I would prefer is to use a finder configured for the aspect ratio of the sensor, with a "full" view out to the edges of what will be captured.
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BernardLanguillier
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« Reply #61 on: June 26, 2007, 06:17:59 PM »
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1. "My" L bracket? I have two, one for a Pentax 67II and one for an H series Hasselblad. Which of the two would YOU use on a Hy6?
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What's surprising about having to buy a new L bracket for a new camera?

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4. Square is sometimes good, but the sensor is NOT square. The sensor that the camera is being sold with is 645. The Hy6 just seems to be a round hole trying to meet a square peg. A 6x6 camera masquerading as a 645. The camera should have been built from the ground up to make the most effective use of the sensors that exist today in commercial quantities at price points that work in the marketplace. My sense is that people buy based upon what works today and don't fork over $35K for features on the come.
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I am not that sure. Many shooters liked the square format and investing into a system that will give them the opportunity to use square sensors in one year from now does appear to make sense to me.

Overall I personnally feel that the Hy6 is a good solution with more options and flexibility that competing platforms. More options means that a selection is required from the user, but seasoned pros should have no problem dealing with this kind of power.

The killing part for me is the lack of interoperability with Phaseone backs. Today this leaves Mamiya as the only credible platform I could consider investing in.

Regards,
Bernard
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A few images online here!
Let Biogons be Biogons
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« Reply #62 on: June 26, 2007, 07:26:28 PM »
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As far as ergonomics go, the Contax continues to look like the best of the bunch IMO.
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Indeed.
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pss
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« Reply #63 on: June 26, 2007, 07:32:49 PM »
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1. "My" L bracket? I have two, one for a Pentax 67II and one for an H series Hasselblad. Which of the two would YOU use on a Hy6?
2.You are right. I dislike distractions, inefficient use of finder real estate, kludges, etc. I like WYSIWYG.
3. Same as above. Plus, as a landscape photographer, the only objects approaching from outside the frame that I need to concern myself with are people walking into my field of view. That does not strike me as a reason to make such inefficient use of the finder real estate.
4. Square is sometimes good, but the sensor is NOT square. The sensor that the camera is being sold with is 645. The Hy6 just seems to be a round hole trying to meet a square peg. A 6x6 camera masquerading as a 645. The camera should have been built from the ground up to make the most effective use of the sensors that exist today in commercial quantities at price points that work in the marketplace. My sense is that people buy based upon what works today and don't fork over $35K for features on the come.
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you don't need a bracket...not sure why that won't get into your head....by the time the camera actually ships, there will be a adapter that makes rotation possible...

put a loupe on your finder and you will only see the center, whatever you are shooting with now, this will be a lot brighter and bigger.....

not getting your points about the round hole/square peg...i think everything has been explained over and over here (and in other threads before...).....i understand that there is something you don't get about the 6x6 and a 645 sensor....but if you don't get it yet, the only way is to see for yourself....IF you even want to give this camera a chance.....from the way you are talking you just won't give it a chance....

especially for shooting landscape the schneider lenses are so absolutely amazing with their detail and contrast...

none of us know how the camera will ACTUALLY work in every day handling...we are all talking about pics, experiences with similar cameras,....in a few months we will know more....i will definitely try and get a demo with one....

if you just don't get the idea behind it and won't give it a chance.....the camera isn't for you....and anyway...why bother writing about it?
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eronald
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« Reply #64 on: June 26, 2007, 08:18:40 PM »
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BTW, if you fork over $35K today you will have a system that works today and is as easy to handle as any MF camera of the competition.
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How can you say this ? Have you used it extensively for photographic tests ? Have you tested the AF in real life ? Have you used the prism finder ? Does everybody share your tastes for the strange hand position caused by the grip of th Hy6 HuhHuhHuhHuh

This hype is getting out of hand. There is no reason to say bad things about the Hy6 as no one here has been to perform real-world functional tests.

And there are no reaons to think it will solve everyone's problems, because let's face it - the Rollei had an adoption problem too, most considered the Hassy, the Contax and Mamiya superior designs *for their tastes and purposes*. And now there are two more competitors, the new Hassy, and the ZD which is basically an oversized SLR.

Last not least, there is this strange word "today". When a magazine wants pictures "today" it means TODAY. When Sinar/Leaf/Rollei promise you a working Hy6 system they say "not before 4 months, we hope". They are being honest here, you are damaging them by hyping  a roduct saying you "get it today if you fork over the money". Really ? Then go ahead, fork over the loney and see whether you can take images with what you get, for the  next 4 or six months.

Edmund
« Last Edit: June 26, 2007, 08:23:54 PM by eronald » Logged

Edmund Ronald, Ph.D. 
hcubell
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« Reply #65 on: June 26, 2007, 09:11:28 PM »
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What's surprising about having to buy a new L bracket for a new camera?
I am not that sure. Many shooters liked the square format and investing into a system that will give them the opportunity to use square sensors in one year from now does appear to make sense to me.

Overall I personnally feel that the Hy6 is a good solution with more options and flexibility that competing platforms. More options means that a selection is required from the user, but seasoned pros should have no problem dealing with this kind of power.

The killing part for me is the lack of interoperability with Phaseone backs. Today this leaves Mamiya as the only credible platform I could consider investing in.

Regards,
Bernard
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I was kidding about the L bracket. EPd has apparently never seen one as he seems to think you just take any old L bracket and stick it on a Hy6. Not so. These brackets are custom configured for each specific camera and would not fit on another camera.
Everyone has different needs and prioritizes them differently. I don't move around taking thousands of photos of scantily clad women in 30 minutes(much as I might like to).
My least significant need is to be ready for the possibility of a bigger sensor in the future. We will see how the Hy6 shakes out in the rough and tumble marketplace of MFDB wars  and whether others agree with me that it represents a flawed set of design choices. The verdict will be written by photographers voting with their wallets, not by forum debates.
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Khun_K
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« Reply #66 on: June 27, 2007, 02:49:35 AM »
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I second the comment except I am quite certain I did not use the camera long enough. But, having been in photography for over 20 years and handled so many cameras, and as being an industrial designer as well, I do able to tell what is a superior design than another. The Hy6 is both simple and sophisticate and very comfortable to operate. Of course, each one has to adapt himself to each photography tool to make the most out of it. The Hy6 can be quiute natural to get to use instantly.
I, for one, started to use P25 on Contax 645 since its introduction and also invested a H3D system, all along I was asking my dealer to find a solution to put the back on a modern system to make use of the Rollei lenses. We must say the Hy6 offer a wonderful solution to those who needed. Here in the world we have a wonderful Contax 645 system that no longer in production. We do need a strong alternative to the H3D and I think Hy6 offer a strong alternative to people in adverting and fine art works, and perhaps also for fashion works. The endeavor to bring Hy6 to the market needed support from us, the users, and every camera needs little time to evolve, and we shall judge it by using it, not guessing it.
« Last Edit: June 27, 2007, 02:51:29 AM by Khun_K » Logged
eronald
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« Reply #67 on: June 27, 2007, 11:32:46 AM »
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Edmund, to each his own of course.

 If you don't think you'll like it, fine. But give it a chance, at least for others who are not as negatively prejudiced, to see for themselves. I am just trying to point at things/features that most probably aren't yet familiar with, so they can decide if they want to look into it in the first place.
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Why should I be negatively prejudiced ? It's a nice followup design to the Rollei 600x; F&H have basically met their production timetable. The camera will probably make some users very happy once the initial shakedown is done. What I really hold against this thing is that it feels like a Rollei. Hidden features don't determine love at first sight

Edmund
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Edmund Ronald, Ph.D. 
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