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Author Topic: Yet another sensor cleaning question  (Read 4447 times)
Robert Spoecker
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« on: August 07, 2007, 11:29:28 AM »
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Hi,

I am thinking about getting a Mamiya ZD. I have had a Canon 5D for a while and sensor cleaning is, as many have noted, a pain.

On the ZD I am assuming the whole back can be swung aside and/or removed to gain free access to the sensor for easy cleaning without having to deal with mirror lock up. The camera chamber itself can then be cleaned as needed. Is this correct?

Thanks,

Robert
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etrump
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« Reply #1 on: August 07, 2007, 11:39:41 AM »
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Hi,

I am thinking about getting a Mamiya ZD. I have had a Canon 5D for a while and sensor cleaning is, as many have noted, a pain.

On the ZD I am assuming the whole back can be swung aside and/or removed to gain free access to the sensor for easy cleaning without having to deal with mirror lock up. The camera chamber itself can then be cleaned as needed. Is this correct?

Thanks,

Robert
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From what I have heard, this is not correct.  If you look at Mamiya's ZD sample photos, they have dust.

If you get the ZD BACK then you CAN remove it from the camera to have direct access to the sensor.
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Mort54
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« Reply #2 on: August 07, 2007, 12:10:08 PM »
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On the ZD I am assuming the whole back can be swung aside and/or removed to gain free access to the sensor for easy cleaning without having to deal with mirror lock up. The camera chamber itself can then be cleaned as needed. Is this correct?
Robert, the Mamiya ZD is a fully integrated body, with the sensor mounted inside. You can't remove the sensor, so in that sense it is just like your 5D.

You may, however, be thinking of the ZD back, which is a different product. The ZD back is used on a Mamiya 645 AFD II body, and I suppose some other, non-Mamiya bodies, as well. Since it's a back, it is removable, and you will have easy access to the sensor surface. But note that the Mamiya ZD and the ZD back are two different products.
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Robert Spoecker
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« Reply #3 on: August 07, 2007, 12:27:15 PM »
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Thanks mort,

I have just become aware of the difference between the Mamiya ZD and the Mamiya ZD back.

I surely would get the back and the 645AFD II. Easier sensor cleaning and both digital and film capabillity and no downsides (except price).

Sound likde a no brainer to me lol

Robert
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Frank Doorhof
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« Reply #4 on: August 07, 2007, 12:53:49 PM »
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Well I have been fighting dust with the ZD digital back and there is no easy solution.
To be honest cleaning my 5D was not easier but more effective.

When they delivered the back to me it was horrible, both backs had enourmous ammounts of dust.

I started with eclipse on the sensor and cleaned the IR cutfilter with pecpads but later also switched to eclipse.

It took me about an hour to get the whole system 95% clean which is more than enough.
The biggest problem is that the IR cut filter is removed from the sensor so while you are cleaning the filter the sensor can get dust again.
Finally I decided to clean the sensor first and lay it face down on a pecpad, now cleaning the cutfilter with eclipse and pecpads.
And as quickly as possible assemble the unit.

The unit is now as mentioned 95% clean so don't think to easy

To be honest looking back, it's MUCH easier than the DSLR, but remember that the whole unit is exposed to the air and not protected by the body/chamber of the DSLR.

So don't move to much air while working.

By the way, when the first batch of dust is gone, maintance is VERY easy, but the first series seems to be VERY sticky on my backs.
Now that they are clean they keep clean very easily with the blower and the brushoff pencil.
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Mort54
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« Reply #5 on: August 07, 2007, 01:42:25 PM »
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Well I have been fighting dust with the ZD digital back and there is no easy solution.
To be honest cleaning my 5D was not easier but more effective.
Maybe the ZD back is more susceptible to dust, although I'd be surprised if that were the case. With my P45 back, a Rocket Blower has been sufficient so far. I haven't encountered anything yet that it couldn't take care of.

Update: Frank, I must have missed your last sentence. That would certainly be my experience also, with the main difference being my P45 was spotless when I got it. And anything that has gotten onto it since then has been easily blown off.
« Last Edit: August 07, 2007, 01:45:54 PM by Mort54 » Logged

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Anders_HK
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« Reply #6 on: August 07, 2007, 10:04:15 PM »
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The first day with my new Mamiya ZD camera I noticed what appeared as one sensor dust. I took it back to Mamiya Hong Kong agent day after. They simply removed the IR filter and removed it with a blower.

Compared to other cameras, the ZD camera/back has the advantage of that the IR filter can be removed. When dust do occur, perhaps it is most frequent to do so on this filter since it act as one "barrier" on way to sensor. Mamiya Hong Kong agent advised me strongly against cleaning the sensor myself, saying that it would be VERY expensive to replace the sensor if damaged. I will take them up on their advise! The IR filter on other hand can easily be cleanded by a user. This is an advantage I see compared to DSLRs, since assumably dust will collect most frequent on the IR filter.

Comaparing ZD camera to ZD back based on risk for dust on sensor/IR filter, with the ZD back there is one more path for dust to get to the sensor which is through the sealing between back and AFDII (or at any time the back is removed). The chamber in AFDII is also larger than that in the ZD camera.

Coming from D200 myself, the ZD camera is my preference since a DSLR handling medium format camera.

Regards
Anders
« Last Edit: August 07, 2007, 10:06:38 PM by Anders_HK » Logged
uaiomex
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« Reply #7 on: August 07, 2007, 10:31:02 PM »
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Anders:

If so, it would very easy and cheap to convert at will the ZD for infrared photography.

Just another good reason to consider the Mamiya.

In analog photography, the Japanese always showed better and cheaper implementations to resolve gear capabilities.
In digital, I guess, it will be the same.

Regards
Eduardo



Quote from: Anders_HK,Aug 7 2007, 10:04 PM

Compared to other cameras, the ZD camera/back has the advantage of that the IR filter can be removed. When dust do occur, perhaps it is most frequent to do so on this filter since it act as one "barrier" on way to sensor.
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Henry Goh
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« Reply #8 on: August 08, 2007, 03:19:51 AM »
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The first day with my new Mamiya ZD camera I noticed what appeared as one sensor dust. I took it back to Mamiya Hong Kong agent day after. They simply removed the IR filter and removed it with a blower.

Compared to other cameras, the ZD camera/back has the advantage of that the IR filter can be removed. When dust do occur, perhaps it is most frequent to do so on this filter since it act as one "barrier" on way to sensor. Mamiya Hong Kong agent advised me strongly against cleaning the sensor myself, saying that it would be VERY expensive to replace the sensor if damaged. I will take them up on their advise! The IR filter on other hand can easily be cleanded by a user. This is an advantage I see compared to DSLRs, since assumably dust will collect most frequent on the IR filter.

Comaparing ZD camera to ZD back based on risk for dust on sensor/IR filter, with the ZD back there is one more path for dust to get to the sensor which is through the sealing between back and AFDII (or at any time the back is removed). The chamber in AFDII is also larger than that in the ZD camera.

Coming from D200 myself, the ZD camera is my preference since a DSLR handling medium format camera.

Regards
Anders
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Anders,

I know the service centre people removed the IR filter to clean but would you know how much of a hassle is it for a user to remove and re-attach the IR filter?

Thanks.

Henry
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Anders_HK
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« Reply #9 on: August 08, 2007, 04:21:09 AM »
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If so, it would very easy and cheap to convert at will the ZD for infrared photography.
IF someone would make a replacement filter without IR built in, yes. As now is also Mamiya Low Pass filter is an IR filter. I read somewhere the camera does not work without a filter in that slot...

Regards
Anders
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Anders_HK
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« Reply #10 on: August 08, 2007, 04:23:59 AM »
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I know the service centre people removed the IR filter to clean but would you know how much of a hassle is it for a user to remove and re-attach the IR filter?
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=132085\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Looked simple (but one needs to be careful same time). They showed me how but I will read the manual before doing myself.

Rgds
Anders
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Henry Goh
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« Reply #11 on: August 08, 2007, 04:32:55 AM »
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Looked simple (but one needs to be careful same time). They showed me how but I will read the manual before doing myself.

Rgds
Anders
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Thanks Anders.

Are stores like Wing Shing or Man Shing selling the ZD/ZD back over the counter yet?

Regards,

Henry
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Anders_HK
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« Reply #12 on: August 08, 2007, 04:40:08 PM »
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Thanks Anders.

Are stores like Wing Shing or Man Shing selling the ZD/ZD back over the counter yet?

Regards,

Henry
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Henry,

I bought near all my gear from Wing Shing / Man Shing in past (including my 7)... but...

In HK you should buy Mamiya from www.sellenhk.com. They are the agent and price may be cheaper than store and not chance of being ripped off or overcharged! Honest. Excellent service. Cash only. This is where I got my Mamiya ZD camera, three lenses etc. They of course have best stock for Mamiya in HK . They also take time to explain and show you including hook up camera to computer to shoot tethered and let you try any products and lenses you like before purchase. Price is good.

Regards
Anders
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Henry Goh
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« Reply #13 on: August 09, 2007, 09:57:24 PM »
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Henry,

I bought near all my gear from Wing Shing / Man Shing in past (including my 7)... but...

In HK you should buy Mamiya from www.sellenhk.com. They are the agent and price may be cheaper than store and not chance of being ripped off or overcharged! Honest. Excellent service. Cash only. This is where I got my Mamiya ZD camera, three lenses etc. They of course have best stock for Mamiya in HK . They also take time to explain and show you including hook up camera to computer to shoot tethered and let you try any products and lenses you like before purchase. Price is good.

Regards
Anders
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Thank you Anders.  I should check this out when I come by HK on my next trip.

Henry
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Anders_HK
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« Reply #14 on: August 10, 2007, 08:33:15 AM »
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Anders,

... how much of a hassle is it for a user to remove and re-attach the IR filter?

Thanks.

Henry
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Done that now. Amazing simple to take out and reinsert. About 10 seconds on first try!

Had to use blower a second time to make sure dust on filter was removed.

Rgds
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Frank Doorhof
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« Reply #15 on: August 10, 2007, 04:26:06 PM »
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About the IR filter.
You can fire the camera without the filter.
Colors are all funky red (as it's supposed to be )

GREAT for IR BW photography I guess.
Will experiment with that in the nearby future.
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Anders_HK
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« Reply #16 on: August 12, 2007, 09:18:07 AM »
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About the IR filter.
You can fire the camera without the filter.
Colors are all funky red (as it's supposed to be )

GREAT for IR BW photography I guess.
Will experiment with that in the nearby future.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=132562\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Frank, Interesting that ZD back allows taking photos without the IR filter. I just tried it with the ZD camera and it does not. Would be nice if they made a clear filter...

Regards
Anders
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