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Author Topic: Epson Traditional Photo Paper & Profiles  (Read 8814 times)
FDewannieux
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« on: December 01, 2007, 01:10:55 PM »
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I just put my hand on a box of "Epson Traditional Photo Paper" in Paris. I thought it would be the same as the "Epson Exhibition Fiber Paper". I tested it with a color image and the profile I downloaded from the Epson website. The soft proof was reasonably accurate (not incredibly great but not bad for a canned profile). I am printing from CS3 and let Photoshop do the color management.

I then printed the same image with the Pixel Genius profile. I was surprised to notice that the result is significantly worst, there is actually quite a strong yellow color cast.

Either I don't know what I am doing (but I have become reasonably competent at this and usually don't have this kind of problem) or maybe the papers are actually different ? The product id on my box is S045050 whereas the product id for the "Epson Exhibition Fiber Paper" on the US website is S045033. My paper was manufactured in Switzerland.

I am puzzled...
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fred888
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« Reply #1 on: July 24, 2008, 10:01:37 AM »
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I got the same results with the Pixelgenius profiles and a 3800 on this paper. A strong yellow greenish cat.
I'm from Paris as well.
I've never heard there would be any difference between EU vs US paper but who knows.....

I'm not very satisfied either with the canned profile even in V2. I will surely create my own quickly.

Fred - my 0.02
« Last Edit: July 30, 2008, 09:00:39 AM by fred888 » Logged
dfphoto
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« Reply #2 on: July 24, 2008, 10:49:53 AM »
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Hi saw your post, why would you softproof in one profile and use PG to print? Also are you setting photoshop to manage color or the printer or both? I'm a digital tech in Los Angeles, and I've seen a lot people do mistakes like that...
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mmurph
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« Reply #3 on: July 24, 2008, 10:57:21 AM »
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My Epson Exhibition Fiber prints were 100% neutral when using the PixelGenius profile.

In fact they were very, very good when using the Epson Premium Luster profile. There may be a difference in the papers?

Best,
Michael
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francois
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« Reply #4 on: July 24, 2008, 11:18:45 AM »
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Quote
I got the same results with the Pixelgenius profiles and a 3800 on this paper. A strong yellow greenish cat.
I'm from Paris as well.
I've never heard there would be any difference between EU vs US paper but who knows.....

I'm not very satisfied either with the canned profile even in V2. I will surely create my own quickly.

Fred - my 0.02
www.combaneyre.com
[{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Although it doesn't offer any solution to your problem, you might be interested in [a href=\"http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=26575&hl=epson]this[/url] thread.
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Francois
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« Reply #5 on: July 24, 2008, 11:31:21 AM »
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Although it doesn't offer any solution to your problem, you might be interested in this thread.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=210450\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

the two papers are made from the same stock, the name's changed to suit the markets.

The PG profile is 100% neutral, it must be something you're doing.
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fred888
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« Reply #6 on: July 26, 2008, 05:55:44 AM »
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it must be something you're doing.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=210452\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I'd like having make a mistake but unfortunately I'm not.

The PS3 soft proof is consistent with what I get, except for the yellow tone, whatever profile I use.

Something very surprising also is that there is a strong difference  in the dark skin tone when soft proofing under PS3, between the 2 profiles regardless of the rendering. The canned profile keeps some reds where the PG has muted and very much darker tones. I didn't expect a so strong difference between 2 profiles.

Anyway I'm gonna create a custom profile this week and see what I get.

Thx
F
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Ralph Eisenberg
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« Reply #7 on: July 27, 2008, 11:08:36 AM »
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I'd like having make a mistake but unfortunately I'm not.

The PS3 soft proof is consistent with what I get, except for the yellow tone, whatever profile I use.

Something very surprising also is that there is a strong difference  in the dark skin tone when soft proofing under PS3, between the 2 profiles regardless of the rendering. The canned profile keeps some reds where the PG has muted and very much darker tones. I didn't expect a so strong difference between 2 profiles.

Anyway I'm gonna create a custom profile this week and see what I get.

Thx
F
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=210791\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I encountered the same, serious problem with the PG profile with my Epson 3800, which surprised me. I find the Epson profile for Traditional Photo Paper very good, affording quite accurate soft proofing. I never received an answer to my several queries as to whether TPP was the same as Exhibition Fiber, and if memory serves, I think that they have two different weights listed on their respective boxes. I'm also in Paris.
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Ralph
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« Reply #8 on: July 27, 2008, 02:38:58 PM »
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I'm located in Paris, like my friend Ralph Von Wau Wau (private joke) .  - if you want I can make a 4000 patch Atkinson profile for both of you using my iSis XL.

This will be a PMP profile, but I can also make Monaco Profiler profiles, which I actually prefer.

I have used the locally sold variant of this paper on my Epson 9600 with good results.

Edmund
« Last Edit: July 27, 2008, 02:42:49 PM by eronald » Logged

Edmund Ronald, Ph.D. 
digitaldog
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« Reply #9 on: July 28, 2008, 08:58:52 AM »
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In fact they were very, very good when using the Epson Premium Luster profile. There may be a difference in the papers?
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=210444\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

That's what it sounds like. But without a sample, impossible to say. Could be a UV issue (on paper having a different among of optical brighteners).
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Andrew Rodney
Author “Color Management for Photographers”
http://digitaldog.net/
fred888
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« Reply #10 on: July 29, 2008, 04:02:39 PM »
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I'd like having make a mistake but unfortunately I'm not.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=210791\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

but....fortunately I did      

I've just discovered that with the new epson driver (16bits) there's 2 places where to specify the color management and when upgrading the driver, it has managed to change the settings in some of my saved presets and not in others.
So even though in the printer settings the Epson color mgmt is set to "No color mgmt" in another menu it was set to "colorsync" and not "Epson" ..  

I just don't know why some saved presets has been changed and not the others.

I still have to test it though, but I'm pretty sure this came from that.
Stay tune for the test !Wink

Edmund, thanks for the offer, I will test first that fix and ask you for a profile if I finally need one.

Anyway it would be a pleasure to meet and have a drink with you and Ralph some day out there  

Fred
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fred888
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« Reply #11 on: July 30, 2008, 08:51:38 AM »
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but....fortunately I did       

[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=211547\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

And then after testing I did not.

Actually I've seen this dual option too quickly yesterday night, printing from another software, but I've tested it today in PS3 and the just discovered option is just greyed out. So there's wasn't double color mgmt.

F
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FDewannieux
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« Reply #12 on: July 31, 2008, 04:37:43 PM »
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I still have not figured out what happened, it does seem that the European and US papers are somewhat different. Maybe I will have a custom profile built but I am not using this paper that often. Weird though.
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digitaldog
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« Reply #13 on: August 02, 2008, 01:23:03 PM »
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My Epson Exhibition Fiber prints were 100% neutral when using the PixelGenius profile.

In fact they were very, very good when using the Epson Premium Luster profile. There may be a difference in the papers?

[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=210444\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I just did tests using the EFP profile on Luster paper and would agree, it works pretty well (its not prefect). So in a pinch I guess you can use either but I still think using the profile intended for the paper is of course best. They both use the same media settings (which could be problematic in the future when more of this stuff gets automated).
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Andrew Rodney
Author “Color Management for Photographers”
http://digitaldog.net/
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