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Author Topic: Epson 3800 print feed problem with Moab Lasal 5x7  (Read 10295 times)
NickJB
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« on: February 08, 2008, 11:32:38 AM »
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I'm having some feeder problems with my new Epson 3800.
I'm printing up a bunch of promotional postcards using Moab Lasal Photo Matte 235 double sided paper. Paper is 5x7. I keep getting an error message
PAPER ERROR
LOAD PAPER
this has happened a dozen plus times in a row when trying to load multiple sheets, though I'm keeping it down to 10 sheets t a time, which should be no problem with the sheet feeder. If I try a single sheet it will sometimes feed, but sometimes will also keep giving me the Paper Error message. I'm printing through Photoshop, on a Mac, all my driver settings are good.
Epson of course say it's either the paper - because no-one out there uses Moab paper of course - or say I need to take it into a repair facility, where it will take 5-6 biz days to look at.
I've got a call into Moab, but haven't heard back yet.
Any experiences with the feeder on the 3800 or with the Lasal paper?
Any thoughts or help would be appreciated.

Thanks!

nick
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duraace
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« Reply #1 on: February 10, 2008, 11:08:08 PM »
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Quote
I'm having some feeder problems with my new Epson 3800.
I'm printing up a bunch of promotional postcards using Moab Lasal Photo Matte 235 double sided paper. Paper is 5x7. I keep getting an error message
PAPER ERROR
LOAD PAPER
this has happened a dozen plus times in a row when trying to load multiple sheets, though I'm keeping it down to 10 sheets t a time, which should be no problem with the sheet feeder. If I try a single sheet it will sometimes feed, but sometimes will also keep giving me the Paper Error message. I'm printing through Photoshop, on a Mac, all my driver settings are good.
Epson of course say it's either the paper - because no-one out there uses Moab paper of course - or say I need to take it into a repair facility, where it will take 5-6 biz days to look at.
I've got a call into Moab, but haven't heard back yet.
Any experiences with the feeder on the 3800 or with the Lasal paper?
Any thoughts or help would be appreciated.

Thanks!

nick
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I rarely if ever use the sheet feeder, but only because I'm using somewhat thicker paper and only need one at a time.  Is it because the paper you're using is too thick for the feeder?  I only use the manual read feed.  The manual front feed is only for really thick paper.  Thinner paper gets caught on the way out causing a paper jam.
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NickJB
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« Reply #2 on: February 11, 2008, 08:50:19 AM »
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Because it's small cut sheet paper (5x7) the only settings on the Epson driver are for using the sheet feeder. Plus, as I'm printing between 50 and 300 copies at a time, of course I need to use the sheet feeder. The Moab Lasal is very similar in weight to a lot of the Epson brand papers, it's just that it's double sided.
On an update to this, I noticed debris appearing on the paper that matched the location of the cork bar in the sheet feeder. If I ran a sheet of Epson Presentation Matte through about 4 times, cleaning off the debris each time, then I could print 3 or maybe 4 sheets of the Lasal, then it would paper jam again and I would need to repeat the "cleaning". Of course Epson says that cleaning sheets should not be used on the 3800 and this is not really a cleaning sheet. It appears to me to be a defect in the materials used in the sheet feeder.
I'm going to call Epson and see what they want to do. I have a feeling they will want me to send it in for repair to a local shop, but I think I'm going to push for a new machine. I live in a small town and frankly I don't trust any repair shops here to do a good job. Plus this is a new machine and I paid for a new machine, not a re-furb, which is what a repair would make this. I also can't afford to wait 5-8 days for a repair with no printer right now.  
Anyone have any guidance on how to deal wit Epson to secure a replacement?
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pflower
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« Reply #3 on: February 11, 2008, 09:28:03 AM »
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I have had problems loading paper from the sheet feeder and called in an Epson Tech.  He told me that it was because paper debris was adhering to the roller which then couldn't pickup the paper in the feeder.  He soaked a paper towel in isopropy alcohol and held it against the roller whilst advancing the roller with the paper feed button.  Worked perfectly.  I now do that once every few weeks and all my paper feeds happily.  He also said that cleaning sheets were fine to use.  I had some left over from years ago and used them but didn't bother buying more when they were used up.

Quote
Because it's small cut sheet paper (5x7) the only settings on the Epson driver are for using the sheet feeder. Plus, as I'm printing between 50 and 300 copies at a time, of course I need to use the sheet feeder. The Moab Lasal is very similar in weight to a lot of the Epson brand papers, it's just that it's double sided.
On an update to this, I noticed debris appearing on the paper that matched the location of the cork bar in the sheet feeder. If I ran a sheet of Epson Presentation Matte through about 4 times, cleaning off the debris each time, then I could print 3 or maybe 4 sheets of the Lasal, then it would paper jam again and I would need to repeat the "cleaning". Of course Epson says that cleaning sheets should not be used on the 3800 and this is not really a cleaning sheet. It appears to me to be a defect in the materials used in the sheet feeder.
I'm going to call Epson and see what they want to do. I have a feeling they will want me to send it in for repair to a local shop, but I think I'm going to push for a new machine. I live in a small town and frankly I don't trust any repair shops here to do a good job. Plus this is a new machine and I paid for a new machine, not a re-furb, which is what a repair would make this. I also can't afford to wait 5-8 days for a repair with no printer right now. 
Anyone have any guidance on how to deal wit Epson to secure a replacement?
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abiggs
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« Reply #4 on: February 11, 2008, 10:06:46 AM »
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Unfortunately, the EPson 3800 has some of the worst paper handling of any printer on the market. The printer creates wonderful output, but is seriously compromised with a sub-par media handling system.
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Andy Biggs
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Eric Myrvaagnes
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« Reply #5 on: February 11, 2008, 12:39:48 PM »
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Possibly relevant:  I have an  Epson 2200 and I sometimes uses double-sided paper. Epson's own double-sided paper says in the instructions to load single sheets only. When I have tried loading a small stack of them, they stick together and won't load. Royal pain.

I have recently tried some Ilford double-sided paper, and it does not have any caution about single sheets. And, indeed, I can load fresh paper in reasonable stacks (20-30 sheets at a time) with no problem.

But, when I print the second side, the already-printed side seems to stick (occasionally) to the unprinted side of the next sheet. Also, after running a couple of dozen sheets through the printer I need to clean the paper-feed rollers with alcohol (which I have never needed to do with single-sided papers).

So maybe the coating on the second side is gumming up the print feeders. I hope you find a solution.
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NickJB
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« Reply #6 on: February 11, 2008, 01:13:07 PM »
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Thanks for the feedback guys.

I must admit, I'm gobsmacked. $1200 pro printer and it can't feed paper. That's just unacceptable.
I just got off the phone with Epson and eventually they agreed to send me a replacement. BUT, as the printer is over 30 days old - though with only 225 sheets through it - they're sending a refurb. I can't tell you how unimpressed I am. To make matter worse the tech started arguing with me, asking what I intended to do if the issue continued with the replacement unit!! I was going to tell him demand my damned money back and get a Canon, but I restrained myself.

There is definitely debris building up on a feed roller. I'm getting consistent scuff marks on the front of the paper, about 3 inches long, on the edge that feeds into the printer. I tried running a piece of Brilliant Lustre through and it actually left a burnished scuff on the face of the paper.

abiggs, I have seen a couple of vague comments about paper handling problems with the 3800, but haven't seen any discussions of it or mention in any of the reviews I looked at before making the decision to buy it. I'd love to see or hear any further discussions of these problems as I've got a nasty feeling I'm going to be talking with Epson again and I'd like as much information as possible to argue my case .

pflower, could you describe how you run the paper towel against the roller in a bit more detail. I'm not sure I understand how to make that roller accessible and turn fully while cleaning it.


EricM, I'm letting the sheets dry before running them through again. If I can, for 24 hours, loose stack of 6 prints. But the issue is happening on the first side anyway.  

nick
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abiggs
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« Reply #7 on: February 11, 2008, 01:18:55 PM »
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Nick-

A few quick items that drive me nuts on the paper handling:

1) smudges of ink on fiber or cotton fiber papers. Since there is no vacuum in the 3800 to keep the paper flat when the paper is being fed into the printer, I often have ink smudges near the back of the sheet. I suspect this is because the paper isn't being sucked flat against the bottom, so papers that either have a slight curl or are less flexible are more likely to have smudges.

2) On the 4x00 series Epson printer, I have had absolutely no issues with feeding 300gsm paper in the front cassette. This allows me to put a stack of sheets in and walk away. The 3800 requires me to feed cotton fine art papers one at a time. This isn't a problem, but more of a consequence of the paper handling capabilities.

I think of the 3800 as being a large R2400, and not a small 4880.
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Andy Biggs
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Eric Myrvaagnes
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« Reply #8 on: February 11, 2008, 02:48:39 PM »
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This is all a bit disappointing, because I have been expecting to upgrade to a 3800 when my 2200 finally dies. Maybe there will be a "3880" with better paper handling by then.  
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-Eric Myrvaagnes

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NickJB
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« Reply #9 on: February 11, 2008, 03:39:38 PM »
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Eric,

I was contemplating the Canon ipf5000 , but size was a big issue, it's a beast. If I had the space I probably would have got that instead. Starting to wish I had now..... but let's see what happens, maybe it's a simple fix. If so, I'll post and update. Fingers crossed. The prints really are beautiful off it.

nick
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gwhitf
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« Reply #10 on: July 26, 2008, 01:12:19 PM »
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I am having the same paper feed issue with my 3800. Using Epson Exhibition Fiber. 8.5x11.

If I load it from the Manual Load slot in the back, the printer simply feeds it all the way thru the printer, and ejects it, before printing at all. Won't accept it.

If I load it from a stack in the AutoFeeder, it tries to load, but then does not, and then gives the Paper Error message.

Very frustrating.

The only way I can get it to load that paper is to hold onto the sheet, in the AutoSlot, and then FORCE it down in the printer.

WTF?
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RAFriedman
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« Reply #11 on: September 06, 2012, 10:50:30 AM »
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The 3880 has feed problems, no doubt. For Moab Lasal, you have to what I call the "Moab Maneuver" which is positioning the paper strategically curled with the bottom toward the front of the bottom of the hopper, so it catches, you then exert a slight downward paper to make sure it goes in. Occasionally, it does actually feed on its own, but I usually have to reach for the "down" feed button.

Note too, that with baryta papers, the little pickup wheel will become coated with a fine layer of powder, like baby powder and will need to be wiped off by powering down the printer and getting in there and manually cleaning.

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elolaugesen
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« Reply #12 on: September 06, 2012, 11:54:07 AM »
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I once used a spray of glue type special spray on a medium thick scrap paper (sample print) let it dry for an hour still slightly sticky then fed it thru my 3800   picks up dust etc from wheels.....
worked have not had a serious problem for two years..

cheers elo
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RAFriedman
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« Reply #13 on: September 06, 2012, 12:35:38 PM »
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This is an excellent idea. Will have to give a try. Thanks for posting this!
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