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Author Topic: Canon shooting at f/1.2  (Read 10881 times)
stevecoleccs
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« Reply #20 on: April 18, 2008, 09:44:31 PM »
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Thanks everyone for comments except for:

, if people would learn to use their DSLR as the maker intended, we might have less of these types of threads. Canon offers 9, 11, 45 focus points for a reason people, so use them (manual choosing), and doing so will not only improve...

useless comment.

As for "Why Focus-Recompose Sucks..." I am testing my new lens & camera on a tripod
without recomposing. I just wanted to know why I have soft images @ f/1.2 after spending
12K + (also after selling my P30+ & Contax system which is a killer system but not for
my style of shooting)

Thanks - I hope this thread ends.

~ cole
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daethon
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« Reply #21 on: April 18, 2008, 10:31:55 PM »
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delete...
« Last Edit: April 18, 2008, 10:40:21 PM by daethon » Logged

Jonathan Wienke
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« Reply #22 on: April 19, 2008, 08:34:06 AM »
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Quote
As for "Why Focus-Recompose Sucks..." I am testing my new lens & camera on a tripod
without recomposing. I just wanted to know why I have soft images @ f/1.2 after spending
12K + (also after selling my P30+ & Contax system which is a killer system but not for
my style of shooting)

It might be helpful if you post a sample RAW that shows the problem you're having. Since the Canon has an AA filter and your P30+ does not, you'll need to alter your sharpening methodology to achieve a similar level of pixel-level sharpness.
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lovell
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« Reply #23 on: April 21, 2008, 09:18:07 AM »
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Thanks everyone for comments except for:

, if people would learn to use their DSLR as the maker intended, we might have less of these types of threads. Canon offers 9, 11, 45 focus points for a reason people, so use them (manual choosing), and doing so will not only improve...

useless comment.

As for "Why Focus-Recompose Sucks..." I am testing my new lens & camera on a tripod
without recomposing. I just wanted to know why I have soft images @ f/1.2 after spending
12K + (also after selling my P30+ & Contax system which is a killer system but not for
my style of shooting)

Thanks - I hope this thread ends.

~ cole
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=190534\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Cole, so we're supposed to be mind readers and know your skill level eventhough you're a perfect stranger?  To bad you think my comment is "useless"...your lousy attitude blocks your ability to learning.  And your arrogance makes you look really bad....even Canon agrees with my comment about the evils of recomposing and the need to manually pick focus points, as they have included this information in their White Paper in getting the most from EOS kit.  I guess Canon publishes "useless" information too....too bad your arrogance blocks your learning.
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After composition, everything else is secondary--Alfred Steiglitz, NYC, 1927.

I'm not afraid of death.  I just don't want to be there when it happens--Woody Allen, Annie Hall, '70s
juicy
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« Reply #24 on: April 21, 2008, 03:27:26 PM »
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Hi!

An interesting comparison using ISO-testchart and 1Ds2 (some lenses also with Ds3):
The Digital Picture com

Cheers,
J
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geesbert
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« Reply #25 on: April 22, 2008, 06:02:50 AM »
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people (and I) prefer recomposing because selecting focus points in a canon 1 series is so unintuitive! the 5d way of using a jaystick ist so much easier, i was really pissed off when i realised the 1dsmk3 is not using its joystick for that.

how could canon come up with using two controls for Selection? it is like using two mice on your computer, one for left and right, one for up and down... the rotation setting is missing out on too many of the focus points.
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lovell
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« Reply #26 on: April 22, 2008, 08:47:51 AM »
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people (and I) prefer recomposing because selecting focus points in a canon 1 series is so unintuitive! the 5d way of using a jaystick ist so much easier, i was really pissed off when i realised the 1dsmk3 is not using its joystick for that.

how could canon come up with using two controls for Selection? it is like using two mice on your computer, one for left and right, one for up and down... the rotation setting is missing out on too many of the focus points.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=191182\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I agree, that choosing a focus point manually on a 1D series body is a bit awkward, but with practice, it can be done fast, and easy.  I would suggest you practice until the movements are 2nd nature...critical focus will improve as well as metering, and over time, you'll find yourself doing it without even thinking...naturally.

When shooting fast in aperture and close, why shot like a newbie?  Use the body as intended by the maker.  ;-)
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After composition, everything else is secondary--Alfred Steiglitz, NYC, 1927.

I'm not afraid of death.  I just don't want to be there when it happens--Woody Allen, Annie Hall, '70s
James Godman
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« Reply #27 on: April 22, 2008, 09:22:48 AM »
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When I tested one of the 50 1.2s on my 5d, it backfocused every time within about 3.5 feet.  I've never had a problem with the 85 1.2
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Jim Pascoe
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« Reply #28 on: April 22, 2008, 11:39:00 AM »
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Jonathon

Re "why focus, recompose sucks".

Thank you for some interesting information that I had previously been ignorant of.  What a great pastime photography is with so much to learn.  My knowledge has just advanced a smidgen.

Jim
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Jonathan Wienke
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« Reply #29 on: April 22, 2008, 12:11:56 PM »
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Thank you!
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jeremydillon
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« Reply #30 on: April 22, 2008, 06:34:03 PM »
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To test the lens sharpness and not the autofocus system ... set focus with LIVE VIEW at 10X and THEN evaluate the results.

Once you know if it's the lens or the focus system you have an issue with you can work towards fixing the problem.
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AlanS
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« Reply #31 on: April 24, 2008, 03:41:50 PM »
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Check the depth of field chart at the "canon museum" -
http://www.canon.com/camera-museum/camera/...85_12l_usm.html
as you see at 1 meter it is the DOF is either on or off

[attachment=6248:attachment]

at 2 meters the DOF is .02 meters - if you try increasing the distance from the camera to subject you increase the DOF

Are you hand holding when you shoot, or do you use a tripod?

If i hand hold i will set the camera to multi exposure mode and take several image that way i increase my odds of having an image with correct focus. The slightest body movement will cause the image to be OOF.

Also rather than start out using 1.2 try 2.0 and work your way toward 1.2. It does take practice using 1.2. Someone compared it to swinging for a home run in baseball, you will strike out more but when you connect its sweet to watch.

Good Luck
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sojournerphoto
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« Reply #32 on: April 25, 2008, 06:21:39 AM »
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Quote
Check the depth of field chart at the "canon museum" -
http://www.canon.com/camera-museum/camera/...85_12l_usm.html
as you see at 1 meter it is the DOF is either on or off

[attachment=6248:attachment]

at 2 meters the DOF is .02 meters - if you try increasing the distance from the camera to subject you increase the DOF

Good Luck
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=191668\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Based on my experience I think the DoF numbers are probably optimistic for the 50 1.4 in real digital life, so the 1.2 is likely less than this!!

Mike
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AlanS
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« Reply #33 on: April 25, 2008, 10:04:13 AM »
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Based on my experience I think the DoF numbers are probably optimistic for the 50 1.4 in real digital life, so the 1.2 is likely less than this!!

Mike
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=191825\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I do think you right and i believe the reason is testing in done shooting B+W line pairs in a lab environment. Real life is about shades, tones and texture ( and lets not forget movement )

regards
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darylcheshire
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« Reply #34 on: February 14, 2011, 07:26:47 AM »
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I have been researching the Canon 50mm f/1.2 and I eventually bought it and it's a lovely lens.

However it was harshly criticised in the fredmiranda forums from 2006 roughly when it was introduced up to mid 2009 when opinion began to turn around.

It seems that later versions of this lens have less issues but Canon have not made any public statement about it. I made sure that my lens was made in 2010 by checking the date code.

The main criticism seems that it auto-focuses poorly in low light and it's soft at wide apertures.
I wondered if those people didn't consider the very narrow DoF and the trouble that some AF systems have with low light. I would suggest that this lens be focussed manually at low light levels.

The other topic which is not fully understood is focus shift. This can occur even if focussing manually. You focus wide open, no problem, but focus at say f/1.4 or f/1.8 and you get things out of focus. The phenomenon is that you set the aperture at f/1.4 and focus with a wide open aperture and the lens stops down to f/1.4 and the focus shifts to a short distance behind the subject. At smaller apertures, say f/2.0 the DoF increases and focus shift is no longer a problem.
You can test this by putting your camera on a tripod, focus on a suitable object like a ruler placed at 45 degrees and then take photos but just change the aperture. You may see the focus shift slightly behind the main area you focussed on.

This is a problem with fast lenses and even the expensive Noctilux can suffer this. It is not a defect but a law of physics and is can be designed around. Apparently a floating lens in the design mitigates this. I would say that every lens has focus shift in one form or another but it's probably not a problem with telephotos, wide angles etc. Seems to just be more noticeable with 50mm fast lenses.
Around 2009 Canon may have modified the design to reduce the complaining. Might have been a factor in the decision to no longer produce the 50mm f/1.0.

I hope I'm not stating the obvious but a search of the forum didn't really mention focus shift with fast lenses. In researching the 50mm f/1.2 before buying it, I found it fascinating that it had such poor reviews probably arising from a poor understanding of the focus shift issue.

You can Google this topic in respect to other fast lenses such as the Notilux and the Nikon 50mm f/1.2 which was first made in 1989 and is a manual focus lens. People are also discussing focus shift with these lenses too. Indeed, name any fast lens and someone comments on the focus shift issue.

It's interesting that very few fast lenses are still in production, mainly because they are expensive. The other one which comes to mind is the Noktor which is the four thirds f/0.95 lens.

I think focus shift is a worse problem with large formats, view cameras and bellows type rigs (correct me if I'm wrong)

Anyway (as I said before) I found the topic fascinating and the Canon lens may have been unjustifiably maligned.
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pfigen
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« Reply #35 on: February 14, 2011, 11:41:10 AM »
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"people (and I) prefer recomposing because selecting focus points in a canon 1 series is so unintuitive! the 5d way of using a jaystick ist so much easier, i was really pissed off when i realised the 1dsmk3 is not using its joystick for that."

Have you not enabled the joystick on your 1DsMKIII? Once you do that, it's just like the 5D but you have more control points literally at your fingertip. Microfocus adjust is mandatory on a 1DsMKIII with any lens, but particularly with the 85L. Once you really dial it in, the lens is quite sharp wide open and the focus is quite accurate, even using the peripheral AF points. Yes, it does get sharper to about 5.6, but it's still very very sharp wide open and more than usable even on a 21mp sensor.

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