Ad
Ad
Ad
Pages: « 1 [2] 3 »   Bottom of Page
Print
Author Topic: How do I get rich, deep blacks...  (Read 20869 times)
stamper
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2704


« Reply #20 on: April 24, 2008, 07:30:08 AM »
ReplyReply

Quote
On the second layer which is the one where the mid tones look OK to you the Blend if targets the mid tones and excludes the darkest tones and the lightest tones The darkest and lightest tones show through from the underlying layer If you understand how Blend if works then you will realise how it is done A few weeks ago there was a long thread on Blend if It is a little understood method that deserves more use Google for it and make it part of your workflow It can be used in all sorts of situations including sharpening
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=191584\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


I don't claim to have discovered this method It was a thought that popped into my head when I read the thread I am pretty sure that Dan Margulis will have something on it in his books I have just experimented with four or five images Ones where they were flat looking especially the mid tones When using the Blend If make sure that the slider points are split Like everything else a little experimentation is a must
Logged

button
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 427


WWW
« Reply #21 on: April 24, 2008, 10:44:00 AM »
ReplyReply

When I have a photo worth my time, the only way to get what I want is to use local adjustments.  One pretty cool way (although a bit tedious) is to "develop" the RAW image in ACR several different ways, one for each aspect of the photo, and opening each of these into PS.  Then, just drag and drop the layers into one file, close all the rest, and attach masks to all but the background layer.  Use a brush set to hardness of "0" and paint on or off the masks where you want each of the layers to shine through.  I think this gives a file that is more "robust", that is, less likely to posturize when applying global adjustments to the stack of layers.  Anyway, it's pretty simple, and it works for me.

John
« Last Edit: April 24, 2008, 04:18:43 PM by button » Logged
rovanpera
Jr. Member
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 70


« Reply #22 on: April 24, 2008, 03:49:50 PM »
ReplyReply

one easy way to deepen the blacks without touching the mids would be with selective color:
 select blacks and then boost the black channel.
Logged
Jonathan Wienke
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 5759



WWW
« Reply #23 on: April 24, 2008, 07:43:43 PM »
ReplyReply

Quote
one easy way to deepen the blacks without touching the mids would be with selective color:
 select blacks and then boost the black channel.

This is only useful if editing in CMYK mode, which is pointless 99% of the time.
Logged

The View
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1001


« Reply #24 on: April 25, 2008, 01:25:30 AM »
ReplyReply

Quote
This is only useful if editing in CMYK mode, which is pointless 99% of the time.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=191733\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I have used selective color to improve skin tones and must say I got good results out of it, especially with the blacks and neutral channel.

Why do you think it would only be applicable to CMYK?
Logged

Deserts, Cities, Woods, Faces - View of the World.
rdonson
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1420


WWW
« Reply #25 on: April 25, 2008, 07:41:10 AM »
ReplyReply

Quote
I have seen images I admire for their rich, deep blacks, while the rest of the image seems to have normal tone values.

If, for example, I lower the shadow values in Camera Raw, the contrast automatically increases.

I wonder if there could be a threshold, that deepens the tones, and leaves the rest of the image alone.

Sorry that I can't describe it better at the moment...
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=190871\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Since I own PixelGenius' PhotoKit I just use the "Punch Black" from the "Tone Correction Set".  It creates a layer so its easy to tune to taste.
Logged

[span style='font-size:14pt;line-height:100%'][span style='font-family:Arial'][span style='font-family:Geneva'][span style='font-size:8pt;line-height:100%']Regards,
Ron[/span][/span][/span][/span]
gmitchel
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 151


WWW
« Reply #26 on: April 25, 2008, 07:43:54 AM »
ReplyReply

Quote
I have used selective color to improve skin tones and must say I got good results out of it, especially with the blacks and neutral channel.

Why do you think it would only be applicable to CMYK?
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=191789\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Selective Color works with RGB images.

You get more control with Curves. Selective Color, especially if you choose Absolute instead of Relative, will stop up the shadows quickly.

You can punch your blacks and still retain shadows detail with Curves.

More important, however, was that the original post asked about being able to punch up the blacks in ACR. There are multiple ways to do it in Photoshop, including Selective Color. ACR is more limited in its ability to punch the blacks.

Cheers,

Mitch
Logged
Peter_DL
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 421


« Reply #27 on: April 25, 2008, 04:11:45 PM »
ReplyReply

Quote
I have seen images I admire for their rich, deep blacks, while the rest of the image seems to have normal tone values.
If, for example, I lower the shadow values in Camera Raw, the contrast automatically increases.
I wonder if there could be a threshold, that deepens the tones, and leaves the rest of the image alone.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=190871\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Not sure if it was already suggested.
You could combine Local contrast enhancement with Blend-if control.

For example:
/> on a duplicated or merged image layer, apply USM with something like Strength 20, Radius 50.
/> Blend mode set to Luminosity, Opacity perhaps a bit reduced to 80%
/> Layer style > Blend-if > This layer > white triangle split to 0/64

Given that Clarity in ACR is focused on the midtones, this may be a nice after-treatment in Photoshop when needed. It doesn’t seem to eat up the shadow details, or increase global contrast, while the blacks are getting deeper as long as such dark areas don’t stretch beyond the USM radius.  Whereas I’d be careful with Curves which as a matter of principle always do both: they increase the contrast for some tones while decreasing it for others (local slope >/< 1).

Peter

--
Logged
Brian Gilkes
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 431


WWW
« Reply #28 on: April 25, 2008, 06:48:17 PM »
ReplyReply

A quicklook at this thread indicated not much attention to printing.
A higher resolution eg on Epson 2880 dpi rather han 1440 , puts down more ink thus deepening blacks. Relative Colorimetric rendering usually gives deeper shadows than perceptual.
Use of polarising filters when making profiles expands deep colour rendering giving shadow richness. The smoother  the paper the deeper the blacks.
HTH
Brian
www.pharoseditions.com.au
Logged
rovanpera
Jr. Member
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 70


« Reply #29 on: April 26, 2008, 07:25:06 AM »
ReplyReply

Quote
This is only useful if editing in CMYK mode, which is pointless 99% of the time.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=191733\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


huh? it works well in rgb.
Logged
Jonathan Wienke
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 5759



WWW
« Reply #30 on: April 26, 2008, 11:07:40 AM »
ReplyReply

How the hell do you boost the BLACK CHANNEL in RGB mode???
Logged

Peter_DL
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 421


« Reply #31 on: April 26, 2008, 12:13:21 PM »
ReplyReply

Quote
How the hell do you boost the BLACK CHANNEL in RGB mode???
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=192025\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
via Selective Color > Colors: Blacks > Black slider

Peter

--
Logged
Wayne Fox
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2846



WWW
« Reply #32 on: April 26, 2008, 12:42:25 PM »
ReplyReply

Quote
via Selective Color > Colors: Blacks > Black slider

Peter

--
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=192032\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

That's not a channel.
Logged

Peter_DL
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 421


« Reply #33 on: April 26, 2008, 01:53:50 PM »
ReplyReply

Quote
That's not a channel.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=192035\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
... per color range selection (in this case: Blacks), well – I would have thought it is a CMYK channel control.

Peter

--
Logged
Jonathan Wienke
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 5759



WWW
« Reply #34 on: April 27, 2008, 08:23:29 AM »
ReplyReply

Quote
via Selective Color > Colors: Blacks > Black slider

which isn't the same as "boosting the black channel"...
Logged

gmitchel
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 151


WWW
« Reply #35 on: April 27, 2008, 12:33:23 PM »
ReplyReply

Quote
which isn't the same as "boosting the black channel"...
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=192110\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

C'mon now, Jonathan. It was obvious that the intended advice was to boost the blacks via the Selective Color command. That is a technique that will work, if used with care.

You never clarified that you understood the point about using Selective Color. The most charitable interpretation is that you were only quibbling over the reference to boosting the "black channel" as opposed to boosting the blacks in the photo via Selective Color.

You might want to consider that Selective Color uses CMYK colors to correct the image.

A couple of quotations from the Adobe Photoshop Help File might help inform this discussion:

"Even though Selective Color uses CMYK colors to correct an image, you can use it on RGB images."

"For example, you can use selective color correction to dramatically decrease the cyan in the green component of an image while leaving the cyan in the blue component unaltered."

IOW, discussion of the Black channel is not irrelevant with respect to discussion of Selective Color.

Back to your point . . .

Quote
which isn't the same as "boosting the black channel"...
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=192110\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

The recommendation was to boost the Black component for Blacks with Selective Color. That is pretty much the same as boosting the Black channel.  

That misstatement was more helpful, in terms of giving the original poster a technique to use, than the quibble over boosting the Black channel v. boosting the blacks.

Cheers,

Mitch
« Last Edit: April 27, 2008, 12:36:20 PM by gmitchel » Logged
Jonathan Wienke
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 5759



WWW
« Reply #36 on: April 27, 2008, 02:35:58 PM »
ReplyReply

Quote
C'mon now, Jonathan. It was obvious that the intended advice was to boost the blacks via the Selective Color command. That is a technique that will work, if used with care.

You never clarified that you understood the point about using Selective Color. The most charitable interpretation is that you were only quibbling over the reference to boosting the "black channel" as opposed to boosting the blacks in the photo via Selective Color.

The original comment was unclear; it would have been much better written as "increasing the black slider setting in the Selective Color dialog" instead of "boosting the black channel".
Logged

gmitchel
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 151


WWW
« Reply #37 on: April 27, 2008, 05:49:00 PM »
ReplyReply

Quote
The original comment was unclear; it would have been much better written as "increasing the black slider setting in the Selective Color dialog" instead of "boosting the black channel".
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=192147\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Agreed, that would have been more accurate.  You could have gotten agreement on that point without snapping at someone who was trying to be helpful, "How the  hell . . ."

Cheers,

Mitch
Logged
rovanpera
Jr. Member
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 70


« Reply #38 on: April 28, 2008, 03:59:21 PM »
ReplyReply

I stand corrected.
« Last Edit: April 28, 2008, 04:06:10 PM by rovanpera » Logged
vandevanterSH
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 626


« Reply #39 on: April 28, 2008, 05:03:34 PM »
ReplyReply

I am new to PS but in one of the Print tutorials, Jeff "punched the blacks by, I believe,  making a selection of the "blacks" and then resetting those pixels to 0.

Steve
Logged
Pages: « 1 [2] 3 »   Top of Page
Print
Jump to:  

Ad
Ad
Ad