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Author Topic: Temporarily Protecting Prints With Plastic  (Read 3804 times)
MoreThanWords
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« on: May 21, 2008, 06:39:38 AM »
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Hello,

I have a 24 inch Z3100 printer, and use it mostly to make 24 x 36 inch prints on HP Instant Dry Semi Gloss Paper. This is nice enough paper, but I noticed that with dark-tone prints, the surface is very susceptible to small scratches.
I am actually looking for plastic or Polyethylene, envelope or glove-like "bags" that I can temporarily store my prints in (I'm thinking disposable maybe, just one print per "bag"), from the moment they come out of the printer until I deliver them to my clients or to be mounted, to minimize the risk of scratches and smudges. And also to minimize the risk of them getting scratched when I roll them up for transportation. I am thinking like the plastic most smaller sized papers are put in before the manufacturer puts them in the box.

Anyone know if this exists in this format or any other suggestions? How do you protect your large format prints between the moment they come out of the printer and they go to your clients?

Any suggestions greatly appreciated. Already learnt a lot on this forum!
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Bruce Watson
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« Reply #1 on: May 21, 2008, 06:58:42 AM »
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Try Clearbags.com.

And, it's not as easy as what you propose. Prints need time to out gas. That is, the ink carrier components need time to leave the print. This is very fast with the water, but considerably slower with the glycols and glycerins.

You can hurry this along with a hand held hair dryer (low heat high fan), but most people just set the print aside and let it "breathe" for a day or two.

If you go directly from printer to plastic bag, don't be surprised when your customers start complaining about condensation on the inside a frame's glazing, especially if the framed print catches even a few minutes of direct sun light.
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MoreThanWords
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« Reply #2 on: May 21, 2008, 07:44:09 AM »
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Try Clearbags.com.

And, it's not as easy as what you propose. Prints need time to out gas. That is, the ink carrier components need time to leave the print. This is very fast with the water, but considerably slower with the glycols and glycerins.

You can hurry this along with a hand held hair dryer (low heat high fan), but most people just set the print aside and let it "breathe" for a day or two.

If you go directly from printer to plastic bag, don't be surprised when your customers start complaining about condensation on the inside a frame's glazing, especially if the framed print catches even a few minutes of direct sun light.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=196987\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Hi Bruce, thanks for the suggestion. So a better idea would be to lay down the prints on a table for a day or two, and then put them in the plastic for transportation...
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kdphotography
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« Reply #3 on: May 21, 2008, 08:19:02 AM »
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Uline is another supplier of plastic bags----and tons of supplies.

www.uline.com
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sesshin
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« Reply #4 on: May 21, 2008, 01:58:04 PM »
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www.bagsunlimited.com is where I get my clear poly bags.
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Thomas Krüger
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« Reply #5 on: May 21, 2008, 11:54:08 PM »
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Are there also any suppliers in EUROPE beside monochrom.de for big polypropylen bags?
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MoreThanWords
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« Reply #6 on: May 22, 2008, 01:33:37 AM »
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Hi Thomas, I actually forgot to mention in my own post that I live in Belgium (Europe). I have tried the excellent looking clearbags website, but the shipping price for what I needed was a bit prohibitive.

Now that I know what terms to google for, I found this company in the UK that might be helpful for your needs (not for mine, as they don't carry as big as 610 x 910):

http://www.transpack.co.uk/list-products.asp?subcat=28

Hope this helps

Piet

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Are there also any suppliers in EUROPE beside monochrom.de for big polypropylen bags?
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Thomas Krüger
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« Reply #7 on: May 22, 2008, 02:44:28 AM »
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Thanks, Piet.

Printing on 24" roll paper we could also search for 620 mm wide cellophan sleeve in rolls, where you cut the needed amount for the print and close the cut with scotch.
Should be cheaper on the long run.

To display the prints for selling I'd like to insert also some inexpensive cardboard to avoid bending through the handling of the prints.
« Last Edit: May 22, 2008, 09:30:36 AM by ThomasK » Logged
sergio
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« Reply #8 on: May 23, 2008, 10:37:56 AM »
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If I remember from my film days:

Mylar polyester and poliethylene were the most archival materials for film.
If my memory fails me, surely somebody here knows the correct answer.
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Chris_T
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« Reply #9 on: May 24, 2008, 07:14:25 AM »
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Quote

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Can those who have used Clearbags as well as these vendons comment on the pros and cons, if any?
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mmurph
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« Reply #10 on: May 25, 2008, 02:19:01 PM »
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So a better idea would be to lay down the prints on a table for a day or two, and then put them in the plastic for transportation...

Epson and others suggest using plain paper on top of the prints to help facilitate the outgassing.  It helps speed up teh process.

Best,
Michael
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mmurph
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« Reply #11 on: May 25, 2008, 03:00:44 PM »
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Here is a link to an Epson article on outgassing:

http://www.epson.com/cmc_upload/0/000/020/...%20P3.15692.pdf
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Bruce Watson
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« Reply #12 on: May 25, 2008, 04:46:37 PM »
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Here is a link to an Epson article on outgassing:

http://www.epson.com/cmc_upload/0/000/020/...%20P3.15692.pdf
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=197911\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
I'm not a believer. I was incredulous that Epson actually made that suggestion, so much so that I actually tried it. After two days under two different "sponges" I hit the print with a hand held hair dryer. I could smell the glycols coming off the print when I put the heat to it -- it was very evident to me that the plain paper "sponge" had little to zero effect, which is what one would reasonably expect.

I was incredulous because if you spend any time at all researching how fluids interact with papers and fabrics you'll find that this "plain paper as sponge" idea is, well, ridiculous. There's nothing to induce the glycols to phase change from liquid to vapor, which they would have to do to migrate from the print to the plain paper overlay (because the two will only be in good mechanical contact at a few points, and there's nothing to induce a glycol molecule to let go it's perch on one fiber to move to a different one, especially over a mechanical gap. If all this were taking place under a liquid you could make an argument for a diffusion mechanism -- but it's not, so you can't).

The bottom line here is that it takes energy to make that phase change; the thing that *will* induce the required phase change is the application of heat. As usual, it all comes down to the laws of physics.
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