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Author Topic: Old discussion, but need solution.  (Read 6442 times)
Mark D Segal
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« Reply #20 on: August 04, 2005, 11:57:22 PM »
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wowhorse: best wishes for fine results with your new camera. Enjoy it.

jani: one would NOT use the same lens on a 20D that one would use on a 1Ds if one wanted the same field of view, and in those circumstances the manner in which both you and Nikon are defining resolution doesn't hold up. There is much material on definition of resolution both on the L-L website and in other literature. It indicates "resolution" is much more complicated than either of us are discussing here.

pom: as I mentioned, I have not noticed in my work the kind of red banding in black areas that you have brought to our attention, nor did any of the websites that reviewed the 1Ds when it first hit the market mention such an issue (e.g. Luminous Landscape, Imaging Resource and dpReview to name three of the main ones).  If you use the same lighting and lighting techniques for capturing the same clothing with other digital cameras and they did not produce this phenominon, perhaps you should discuss the issue with Canon and let them check the camera unless they come up with some cogent reason for it - which would really be interesting to know about.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
Author: "Scanning Workflows with SilverFast 8....." http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/film/scanning_workflows_with_silverfast_8.shtml
Jonathan Wienke
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« Reply #21 on: August 05, 2005, 11:31:20 AM »
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Jonathan, you are generally correct that if it looks too good to be true it is and your advice is a timely call to action. But before assuming "wowhorse" has been had, perhaps he should first call the dealer and make sure that he will be receiving every piece that is normally supposed to be "in the box" AND that the equipment is neither USED nor a DEMONSTRATOR AND that USA WARRANTIES are included, then if he finds trouble, he should cancel the transaction.
Did you look at the link I posted? expresscameras.com is a totally sleazy scam outfit. I'm not assuming anything; read their reviews and you'll find nobody that has done business with them has anything good to say about them. And calling them is a waste of time, they're a bunch of liars. Read their reviews.
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Ben Rubinstein
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« Reply #22 on: August 05, 2005, 08:16:49 AM »
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It's under a warranty from the company I bought it from 2nd hand, not Canon, I doubt they will agree that there is enough of a problem to warrant a chip replacement costing more than I paid for the camera. Bugger!
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wowhorse
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« Reply #23 on: August 03, 2005, 04:50:32 PM »
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I'm also concerned, when it comes to the Rebel XT, with changing f-stops because I'm so used to spinning a dial, and it seems pretty laborious from the review on this website. Then again, I don't know the difference in how the Nikon D70 performs when it comes to changing apertures.
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Ben Rubinstein
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« Reply #24 on: August 04, 2005, 06:22:47 AM »
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If you will be shooting weddings then keep in mind that you will need a backup camera as well. The XT is a bit too small to hang pro level lenses from, unless you will be shooting only with primes, I know I couldn't work with that thing hanging off the end of a 24-70L or 70-200L. I dont know about the speed, responsiveness, etc but keep in mind that it is the bottom rung of the Canon DSLR ladder, not that it's not a good camera, but maybe not one for professional use.

I know several photographers shooting weddings with the D70 which is the Nikon's equivelent to Canon's 20D, a step up from the XT.

I would either recommend the D70s (I have a friend who bought one as backup to the Fuji S2 though after he saw the flash exposures swopped the S2 to backup role instead!) or a 20D.

If you are happy with it then you could use the canon AE-1 as backup, just make sure that you are able to shoot the entire wedding - in your advertised style - on film, should your DSLR die or be murdered at the beginning of the day.
Otherwise, and if you do go down the Canon route, you could do a lot worse than a 2nd hand 10D, I was shooting weddings with it until recently when I upgaded (the resolution and AF) and downgraded (almost everything else) to the 1Ds.

On an aside, don't spend a bunch of money on the camera and skimp on the lenses. A problem with DSLR's is that you will notice anything less than top quality lenses very fast, don't waste your money, save up a bit longer and get the best, anything less will cost you more money in the long run and plenty soul wrenching.
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jani
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« Reply #25 on: August 04, 2005, 09:14:23 AM »
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Pom, in what important (to you) respects was a 1Ds a downgrade from a 10D?
If I may intrude with my recollection, it was performance in shadow areas, where the 10D was noticeably better.

Judging from what I've read, the 1Ds is not an improvement over the 20D here, but I don't know if the 20D is as good as the 10D.

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Jan, I was confronted last year with a choice between a used 1Ds and a new 20D. The 1Ds was much more expensive, but I bought it anyhow. The trade-off for me was very simple: the main advantages of the 20D are lighter weight, faster camera-on, faster image processing. DIGIC 2 may also produce less noise at higher ISOs, but for me that is largely an academic issue. The main attractions of the used 1Ds were simply build quality (when I buy stuff - except printers - I tend to keep it a long time), full frame 24x36 and higher resolution, which I value alot for making enlargements of cropped images.
In my case, the used 1Ds was still noticeably more expensive than a brand new 1D MkII, which would have been too expensive for me anyway. Today, purchasing the used 1Ds would put the total sum of my already acquired 20D body and the 1Ds body at less than purchasing the 1D MkII.

The "resolution" advantage of the 1Ds isn't much compared to the 20D (16% more pixels in either dimension in the final image), but you can get by with lenses that the 20D would strip bare because of its greater angular resolution (37% horizontally or vertically). Cue the arguments con/pro stitching. ::

And wide-angle is of course easier with the 1Ds full frame, which is something that I sometimes miss with the 20D.

As for build quality, the 20D is good, but it's not as bombproof as the 1-series, and of course it shouldn't be exposed to rain or such. I fully expect to be able to keep it at least 5 years, without worrying about it falling apart. A 1-series body should last "forever".

I didn't think I'd appreciate the high-ISO performance of the 20D until I suddenly used it.

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All this goes to show simply that what one buys is a very personal decision based on what one considers to be most important for his/her own situation. It's fine for first-time buyers to solicit opinions like this on the web, but as I mentioned above, that is why it is worth putting alot of effort into some basic system decisions relative to ones needs and preferences.
Absolutely.

And if my priorities weren't towards getting better lenses, a photo printer, software and other gear, I'd probably have aimed for a 1-series camera myself.
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Jan
Mark D Segal
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« Reply #26 on: August 04, 2005, 03:17:09 PM »
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I see what you mean, but I haven't experienced it at such low ISO and limited underexposure.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
Author: "Scanning Workflows with SilverFast 8....." http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/film/scanning_workflows_with_silverfast_8.shtml
wowhorse
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« Reply #27 on: August 04, 2005, 09:48:24 PM »
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*small wave* Hi, it's the original poster again... hah.

Well, I didn't know my little ol' post would ignite such conversation-- but I did want to tell you guys, I was pushed just enough away from the Rebel that I fell into the lap of the Nikon D70S, and in combination with planning a spur of the moment trip out west, I figured what the heck! So I ordered it from expresscameras.com for a pretty good deal. I got it in a package with a Sigma "70-300mm f4-5.6 APO Zoom Macro SuperII Pro Lens" and another lens which our dealer claimed was a step up from the kit Nikon lens. I ordered it next day shipping so it would be here in time to leave for the trip, so hopefully that all goes well and I don't get a ton of replies from you guys telling me, "You've been HAD!" or something. It's really overwhelming when I'm just getting into this and there is SO MUCH on the market, and I have barely scratched the surface with information on digital cameras.

I am so excited to play with my new gadgets! I've never had a nice digital SLR so this is going to open a new world for me, and hopefully will steer me into the right direction for business.
Anyway, thanks for all your help! I'm sure I'll be back for more questions later!
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Jonathan Wienke
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« Reply #28 on: August 05, 2005, 01:46:47 AM »
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I'd say it's possible Pom's camera is more susceptible to the banding issue than most copies of the 1Ds. I've encountered it a few times, but always in images underexposed by at least a stop, and mostly at higher ISO settings. I've seen reports of people who sent their cameras in to Canon and had the sensor replaced under warranty and the problem went away, but details are hazy as this was like 2 years ago. It may be worth contacting Canon service if being without the camera for a few weeks coincides with a planned recuperation anyway. Include an example image, preferably with the least amount of underexposure possible, when contacting Canon.
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Mark D Segal
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« Reply #29 on: August 05, 2005, 08:36:21 AM »
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Pom, if their warranty is worth the paper it's printed on the camera should meet Canon's own technical performance specifications, and if it doesn't their warranty should obligate them to fix it. What it costs them is not your issue, and you won't know what you can achieve before trying. Obviously if you expect trouble getting the warranty respected you need to make doubly sure you have the problem well demonstrated and documented so they can't wiggle out unless they can clearly prove to your satisfaction that the problem does not reside within the camera.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
Author: "Scanning Workflows with SilverFast 8....." http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/film/scanning_workflows_with_silverfast_8.shtml
Mark D Segal
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« Reply #30 on: August 05, 2005, 11:58:57 AM »
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Hi Jonathan - did what you suggested - you're right. It raises real questions about the meaning of consumer protection laws and what to do about governmental institutions that don't work.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
Author: "Scanning Workflows with SilverFast 8....." http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/film/scanning_workflows_with_silverfast_8.shtml
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