Ad
Ad
Ad
Pages: [1] 2 3 4 »   Bottom of Page
Print
Author Topic: tethered shooting 1dsmkIII  (Read 14020 times)
pss
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 960


WWW
« on: August 31, 2008, 12:00:08 PM »
ReplyReply

graeme...sorry if this offends you but i need this question to be in the MF forum because i need the experience of MF shooters, some of which also happen to use canon...so this is really a pro forum question.....

so: i got the canon dsIII....great camera....i have never had a camera that does such a great job of getting out of the way of shooting.....great files...really everything i expected the dsII would be when i got that.....and was very disappointed....anyway...

with the files being quite large i really have a hard time shooting tethered....the canon software seems to be only way to get the files in and after that i guess it comes down to whatever software one wants to use.....in my case i tried aperture and it makes the shooting just too slow....it works and there are no real glitches, but it is just too slow.....i will try LR in the next couple of days, but i am starting to think that the USB is the real problem.....

i am on shooting to a macbookpro with an internal striped raid (with 7200rpm dives) so write speed can't really be the issue.....

any input welcome....
Logged

Henry Goh
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 574


« Reply #1 on: August 31, 2008, 12:09:22 PM »
ReplyReply

Hope I understand you correctly:

You are able to tether and can get the files into the MacBook Pro.
Your problem is it comes in slow?  How slow using EOS Utility, I presume?
You have not configured it to send the file to say C1 V4 or LR I guess or even Bridge CS3.

On my PC, 2 to 3 seconds to pop up rendered in Bridge or C1, if it helps.
« Last Edit: August 31, 2008, 12:09:34 PM by Henry Goh » Logged
James R Russell
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 984



WWW
« Reply #2 on: August 31, 2008, 12:12:49 PM »
ReplyReply

Quote
Hope I understand you correctly:

You are able to tether and can get the files into the MacBook Pro.
Your problem is it comes in slow?  How slow using EOS Utility, I presume?
You have not configured it to send the file to say C1 V4 or LR I guess or even Bridge CS3.

On my PC, 2 to 3 seconds to pop up rendered in Bridge or C1, if it helps.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218513\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

When I tether the 1ds3 I use the EOS software shooting raw and small jpeg.  The first 5 files are pretty fast, the previews are full screen.  After 5 the rest are very slow.

I've been told it's the mac usb drivers, not the software or the camera.

I guess if I ran windows on the intel computers it would be faster.

JR
Logged

juicy
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 254


« Reply #3 on: August 31, 2008, 02:25:47 PM »
ReplyReply

Hi,
There was some info here 1Ds3 tethered
and here some more

Cheers,
J
« Last Edit: August 31, 2008, 02:27:37 PM by juicy » Logged
gwhitf
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 820


« Reply #4 on: August 31, 2008, 02:34:42 PM »
ReplyReply

You can set a HotFolder inside of CaptureOne, and then use CaptureOne to tether. Downside is you're importing RAWs so that means eight seconds or so per image, due to lame decision to use USB instead of FW.

Or, you can use EOS Utility, but same deal: eight seconds if you're importing raws.

Or, you can use EOS Utility, with or without linking it to DPP, and if you're willing to download cards, you can see the images come in much faster, around one second each. this is the workaround:

1. Put a CF card in Slot 1.
2. Put an SD card in Slot 2.
3. Set the camera to "record separately".
4. Set the camera to "Playback only Slot 2".
5. Set the Slot 1, the CF slot, to record RAW.
6. Set the Slot 2, the SC card, to record JPG SMALL with compression.
7. Open EOS Utility, and link it to DPP.
8. Hook up the USB cable to the Mac.

Downside with this: every time you open the CF door on the body, it drops connection to EOS Utility and it takes about thirty seconds to reconnect. Obvious other downside: you must remember to download the CF RAWs onto the computer, since you're only viewing JPGs on the tethered computer.
Logged
James R Russell
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 984



WWW
« Reply #5 on: August 31, 2008, 03:38:09 PM »
ReplyReply

Quote
You can set a HotFolder inside of CaptureOne, and then use CaptureOne to tether. Downside is you're importing RAWs so that means eight seconds or so per image, due to lame decision to use USB instead of FW.

Or, you can use EOS Utility, but same deal: eight seconds if you're importing raws.

Or, you can use EOS Utility, with or without linking it to DPP, and if you're willing to download cards, you can see the images come in much faster, around one second each. this is the workaround:

1. Put a CF card in Slot 1.
2. Put an SD card in Slot 2.
3. Set the camera to "record separately".
4. Set the camera to "Playback only Slot 2".
5. Set the Slot 1, the CF slot, to record RAW.
6. Set the Slot 2, the SC card, to record JPG SMALL with compression.
7. Open EOS Utility, and link it to DPP.
8. Hook up the USB cable to the Mac.

Downside with this: every time you open the CF door on the body, it drops connection to EOS Utility and it takes about thirty seconds to reconnect. Obvious other downside: you must remember to download the CF RAWs onto the computer, since you're only viewing JPGs on the tethered computer.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218544\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


The other downside of this system for my work is naming.  I have to name every raw file later and use a software like photomechanic that will combine the raws and jpegs so the corresponding files have the same name.

I use a cf card in the camera shooting tethered and the upside is it backs up every raw file, downside if I name in the computer while shooting the files on the card have a different name.

As you mentioned with either system, when you open the cf door everything must be restarted.

I find the EOS utility very stable, actually amazingly stable and not that hard to learn, but once past a few frames, that 8 second delay is a killer.

Also after about 15 files you hit some kind of buffer and have to wait, kind of like the old 1ds1.

One upside is the previews are great and full 24" screen.

JR
Logged

pss
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 960


WWW
« Reply #6 on: August 31, 2008, 05:16:44 PM »
ReplyReply

thanks for all the answers....looks like i will have to wait for apple to write new drivers (and fully support the dsIII in aperture, which will probably happen at the same time) or for phase to finally come out with the 4.0 pro version to support tethered shooting....which i won't hold my breath for....especially for canon....

the jpeg workaround does not work for me..... for me the main reason to shoot tethered in the first place is to see the raw files, check focus, check detail, apply some adjustments,....so jpegs are out.....also the renaming of files, duplicates and everything else does not really work either.....

as much as i need tethered shooting, i am fine with shooting the set-up, getting a couple of shots, making sure everything is right, everybody is happy and then i can move on and shoot to card and download....but sometimes that does not work.....

so i guess until apple fixes the driver issue, i will have to deal with 8sec previews and the buffer ....which really is a pain.....once you start shooting, nobody cares when the shots come in, but having to stop shooting is a just not fun.....

still loving the dsIII though.....
Logged

Tim Lüdin
Jr. Member
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 57


WWW
« Reply #7 on: August 31, 2008, 05:26:34 PM »
ReplyReply

Isn't there a way to programme Lightroom or Aperture for tethered shooting?
I read that Aperture should be able to go tethered. What about Lightroom?

I dont undestand why Bridge, LR, PS arent programmed for tethered shooting.
That would be killer and so easy.

Tim
Logged

Cinematographer & Photographer
My Webpagewww.timluedin.com
Imaginara
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 114


« Reply #8 on: August 31, 2008, 05:34:06 PM »
ReplyReply

What you do with LR is to set it to monitor and auto-import from a folder, and then make the capture program (EOS utility) save all the images in that same folder. You take a pic, Eos Utility downloads it to the folder, LR sees the new file and grabs it.

It's a bit delayed though but it works pretty ok.

On the PC i prefere to use a different utility called DSLR Remote (breesesys) which does all the tethering directly without any fuss.

Capture One is supposed to be doing it in the v4 pro version but as that right now is vapourware i guess we'll see how well it does it at Photokina.
Logged
gwhitf
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 820


« Reply #9 on: August 31, 2008, 06:08:11 PM »
ReplyReply

Quote
the jpeg workaround does not work for me..... for me the main reason to shoot tethered in the first place is to see the raw files, check focus, check detail, apply some adjustments,....so jpegs are out.....
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218566\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Paul,

You bring up a good point here. While EOS Utility and DPP combination work just fine, that approach is really better when you're working a job where the color and contrast are pretty "normal". If you're working on a more creative job, where you're skewing the color and/or contrast more, the controls in Capture One are much more thorough.

Even so, we never found a way for new incoming files, coming into CaptureOne, to be automatically tagged with your color settings. Thus, it forces to Tech to manually highlight the new incoming RAWs, and then do APPLY SETTINGs to the new incoming. In short, pretty irritating, and it really gets old, by about after lunch.

Also, if you choose the other JPG approach, the full screen preview of the tiny compressed JPG is VERY GOOD. Even though it's a tiny JPG. Even on a 17" or 24" monitor. Because even the smallest JPG on the 1ds3 is still quite large.

But to be blunt about it, if you really want to tether the right way, shoot a Phase back, and use CaptureOne 3.78. That's my bottom line opinion.
Logged
Craig Lamson
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 766



WWW
« Reply #10 on: August 31, 2008, 06:15:14 PM »
ReplyReply

Quote
What you do with LR is to set it to monitor and auto-import from a folder, and then make the capture program (EOS utility) save all the images in that same folder. You take a pic, Eos Utility downloads it to the folder, LR sees the new file and grabs it.

It's a bit delayed though but it works pretty ok.

On the PC i prefere to use a different utility called DSLR Remote (breesesys) which does all the tethering directly without any fuss.

Capture One is supposed to be doing it in the v4 pro version but as that right now is vapourware i guess we'll see how well it does it at Photokina.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218569\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I'll echo the DSLR Remote!  A very nice and stable program. Combine it with C1 v4 and a hot folder on a second monitor and you have a very workable setup.

I bracket quite a bit for layering and in the past with the MKII  I used EOS utility to change camera setting and C1 v3.x.  EOS and C1 did not play nice...you had to open and close EOS every time you used it.

No longer a problem with the MKIII and DSLR Remote.  They seem made for each other.
Logged

Craig Lamson Photo
www.craiglamson.com
ruraltrekker
Jr. Member
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 69


« Reply #11 on: August 31, 2008, 06:26:11 PM »
ReplyReply

FYI -

The "bottleneck" that has been mentioned shows on a Win setup as well. They come in fast but at some point (I don't bother to count, etc.) things get a little slow - no new images, and then wham, a rush of images that don't finish the "course pixel to fine pixel" before the next image starts to display.

I find tether shooting fine in two situations:

1) it is a more controlled shot with a frame every minute or so (or even slower)

2) I don't want to download cards (and the shot allways a tether setup).

I find ADs following the shoot on the large monitor and say "we got it" when I truely know that they are seeing very little if I am shooting with any speed. Yeah, they have a "sense of got it" but I shoot until "I get that feeling that I got it".

Until we get bigger pipes to work with (and I didn't find firewire that much better with the II) we are just stuck with what we have. Just remember five frames is over 100 megs that have to be pushed down the cable, written to the HD and displayed in whatever proggram you are using to view it. That is still a lot to plain expect "instant". Hell a Polariod took longer.

Ken
Logged
James R Russell
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 984



WWW
« Reply #12 on: August 31, 2008, 06:41:58 PM »
ReplyReply

Quote
But to be blunt about it, if you really want to tether the right way, shoot a Phase back, and use CaptureOne 3.78. That's my bottom line opinion.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218571\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


I agree with the 3.78 quote, to some extent, if what your shooting is normal and you can get past the  previews 3.7 produce.  I like 3.7 for it's stability and naming but the previews can be challanging.

I loved it when I first bought my phase, but then there wasn't a lot of other options.  Now next to lightroom, 3.78 has some limitations.  Maybe v4 pro ut will change some of this.

We shot a  job a month ago that is in final post right now with the p30+ and 3.78.  I just couldn't show the AD the look I wanted with 3.78 so we did a preset in Lightroom and ran a hot folder to the program.

it worked very well, other than the LR previews were slowwww.  For this project that was fine as it was very placed and though the people we're moving the look was profiled and somewhat static.

For this it worked and the previews came up as planned with out a lot of tech massaging.




JR
« Last Edit: August 31, 2008, 11:39:46 PM by James R Russell » Logged

mcfoto
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 938


WWW
« Reply #13 on: August 31, 2008, 10:51:14 PM »
ReplyReply

Hi
We have a shoot coming up & I am going to use a 16' (5m) USB Active Extension Cable which should give me 8 meters toal with the Canon 3 m usb cable. Should I shoot s jpeg/Raw into the G5 tower? We have to see the shots as they come up.
Denis
Logged

Denis Montalbetti
Montalbetti+Campbell
www.montalbetticampbell.com
pss
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 960


WWW
« Reply #14 on: August 31, 2008, 11:10:49 PM »
ReplyReply

Quote
Hi
We have a shoot coming up & I am going to use a 16' (5m) USB Active Extension Cable which should give me 8 meters toal with the Canon 3 m usb cable. Should I shoot s jpeg/Raw into the G5 tower? We have to see the shots as they come up.
Denis
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218618\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

denis.....it seems if you want fast (as in right away or 1-2 sec) previews you will have to do jpegs....

i have used the canon utility (afaik the only way as of right now to shoot tethered with the dsIII) to shoot raw to a folder which i had watched by aperture....this takes a looong time (7sec? 8sec?) and hits a buffer....this is to a striped array....no usb extension....

i looked into it a little from the mac/aperture end....aperture supports tethered shooting (without any canon utility) of almost all older canons (up to rebel and dsII) no problem...firewrie, usb, no problem.....i guess canon completely re-wrote their software and apple hasn't made it truly compatible...yet....hence the usb "delay" and non tethered support for the latest canons in aperture...

i really hope this will be resolved soon.....

the m8 comes with a little tethered app (which crashes in 10.5 on startup) which shoots superslow...actually kindof like the canon.....turns out aperture supports tethered shooting for the  m8 and voila....snappy, happy shooting raw with great previews.....i am just mentioning this because i am hoping for a similar experience with the canons....soon...

i never tried tethered with the dsII and aperture, maybe someone has some input about that?

and yes of course.....c1 3.7 with the phase backs rules.....it is proof that it can be done.....i used to shoot with the P30 (larger files) to a much slower computer and much much slower HDs....no problem.....
« Last Edit: August 31, 2008, 11:12:49 PM by pss » Logged

Dustbak
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2370


« Reply #15 on: September 01, 2008, 08:42:21 AM »
ReplyReply

How about running Windows (bootcamp or parallels) would that bypass the USB bottleneck? At least you will not be using the Apple USB driver and the Windows USB driver is a lot faster. I can notice a big difference with external disks (on the same MBP that is) between Windows USB and Mac USB.

Sure, it would be a true nuisance but if tethering the Canon is really important it might be worthwhile to look into.

I don't have a Canon BTW and have not been using any of my Nikons tethered since 2004 so it might totally not make sense what I am suggesting.
« Last Edit: September 01, 2008, 09:30:21 AM by Dustbak » Logged
Esben
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 182


WWW
« Reply #16 on: September 01, 2008, 09:57:47 AM »
ReplyReply

There is a LR2 plug-in which make it possible to shoot tethered to Canon and Nikon cameras with a Mac.

I haven't tested it comprehensively, but it works with my Canon.  It will cut the Canon software out of the loop and import the image straight into LR2. I think the shooting speed is the same, but the time it takes to get a viewable picture might be faster.

It does however have glitches. It looks like it's possible to start several tethered connections at once, and that fast shooting will crash the connection immediately. However, it works and potential future versions might be a good alternative to both C1pro and Canon software.

http://www.mountainstorm.co.uk/photography/page2/page2.html

Happy Labor Day
Best,
Esben
« Last Edit: September 01, 2008, 12:01:54 PM by Esben » Logged

Digital Tech NYC // LA
www.captureforce.com

phone. 212 203 6427
pss
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 960


WWW
« Reply #17 on: September 01, 2008, 10:39:01 AM »
ReplyReply

Quote
How about running Windows (bootcamp or parallels) would that bypass the USB bottleneck? At least you will not be using the Apple USB driver and the Windows USB driver is a lot faster. I can notice a big difference with external disks (on the same MBP that is) between Windows USB and Mac USB.

Sure, it would be a true nuisance but if tethering the Canon is really important it might be worthwhile to look into.

I don't have a Canon BTW and have not been using any of my Nikons tethered since 2004 so it might totally not make sense what I am suggesting.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218682\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

i think that this might be the only way for right now...if you really HAVE to work it fast....

on the other hand i am not sure how much the extra software overhead might slow down everything else....runnning 4-5 apps at once AND running 2 systems at once just does not sound like a great workflow to me....
« Last Edit: September 01, 2008, 10:43:34 AM by pss » Logged

gwhitf
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 820


« Reply #18 on: September 01, 2008, 11:04:51 AM »
ReplyReply

Baby steps...

http://prodig.org/2008/08/30/lightroom-tether-plugin/

Requires 10.5 and this one is mostly Nikon-only.

How many years after the introduction of the 1ds1, and we're still trying to simply tether a camera for a real-world job? Canon should be ashamed. Obviously a camera geared toward sports and weddings.
Logged
pss
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 960


WWW
« Reply #19 on: September 01, 2008, 11:20:44 AM »
ReplyReply

Quote
There is a LR2 plug-in which make it possible to shoot tethered to Canon and Nikon cameras with a Mac.

I haven't tested it comprehensively, but it works with my Canon.  It will cut the Canon software out of the loop and import the image straight into LR2. I think the shooting speed is the same, but the time it takes to get a viewable picture might be faster.

It does however have glitches. It looks like it's possible to start several tethered connections at once, and that fast shooting will crash the connection immediately. However, it works and potential future versions might be a good alternative to both C1pro and Canon software.

Best,
Esben
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218696\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


this uses the apple api, which means it won't work with the latest canons...once apple comes out with an update, tethering to aperture should work anyway....

apple really has tethered support built into the system, but if canon/nikon change their protocols, apple has to rewrite their end and i am pretty sure that kind of thing is not on top of apple's list when they update their system software.....

i wonder if the wireless gizmo could speed things up? the wireless conncetion would obviously be too slow for raw, but it also has ethernet and usb connections.....if the ethernet is 10/100 this would probbly be too slow as well, but one could shoot into an external usb HD and have LR/aperture watch the folder on the external HD....that usb connection should not be slowed by the canon camera usb driver?
Logged

Pages: [1] 2 3 4 »   Top of Page
Print
Jump to:  

Ad
Ad
Ad