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Author Topic: Lacie WARNING  (Read 22355 times)
AndreNapier
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« on: September 18, 2008, 12:49:46 AM »
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Stupidity is costly as we all know. I thought I share my recent experience here to save some big headache to any fellow member who will want to trust Lacie.
We just came back from a five day calendar shoot in Costa Rica. Shooting went very smooth, we had a great weather, flew in amazing models and wrapped up everything to our greatest satisfaction.
It was a decent size production with lots of rented lighting equipment so all with a substantial price tag.
We saved all images to Lacie 1TB and becked everything to identical memory unit.
Due to weight restrictions on hand baggage I opted to keep camera, lenses and two laptops with us and putting memories to two separate travel cases.
One of my bags got lost/stolen/vanished and never got recovered. The second one looked like it fell from from airplane and crashed on concrete. Upon inspection we realize that one of the hard drive disks moved out of its place rendering it unreadable. Right away I called Lacie and personally made arrangement to have it repaired. I explained the importance and value of the content and got verbal reasurrence that they will not due anything to harm the files. I Fedex it overnight to personal attention of my Lacie contact whom I spoke earlier on the phone. We put red tape sticky note " do not reformat " on the box and the Lacie case. Package arrived to Lacie at 9:30 am and after tracking the package on Fedex website and confirming delivery I call them around 11am. That 1.5 hour was enough time for this Fuc...rs to reformat the memory and mount back the disk.
The rest is just a history, nobody is liable responsible or even willing to say I am sorry. The form I sign says they do not guarantee the content just the hardware. This a common practice of reformatting at Lacie before even diagnosing the problem. After facts I was told that they are not in business of recovering files and then hanged up on.
No words to describe how I feel.
Andre
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klane
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« Reply #1 on: September 18, 2008, 01:31:44 AM »
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Its sickening to think about but most companies just have a "screw you" attitude anymore.

I had a bad experience with lacie on a 19" display a couple years back, the quality was awful and the vertical orientation did not work properly. They refunded my money, but overall it was like they didnt care and were not very helpful about the situation. After that I wrote them off and have not purchased another item from them.

Leaf has been the worst as far as customer service, Ive called them a couple of times to get pricing on an adapter and I was pretty much treated like crap...not to mention their "service staff" is incredibly uneducated on the product line. I was even grunted at by someone and instantly transfered to voicemail on one occasion.

Apple is going this way too, Ive been an apple user since highschool and over the past year or so the customer service has been outsourced a ridiculous amount and they do not know their product.


Sometimes I wonder if its even worth picking up the phone to call about problems anymore, but there are at least some great dealers out there that make things less painful.

If I were you Id get lacie back on the phone, if nothing else just to chew them out. It won't solve much but it will make you feel better.

What did the client say about the loss?  
« Last Edit: September 18, 2008, 01:33:14 AM by klane » Logged
Adina
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« Reply #2 on: September 18, 2008, 01:33:27 AM »
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Hi Andre,

try this guys http://www.krollontrack.com/
(there also other ...)
i think sey can help you, formate disk is not erase disk !


Hope the best for you ..

Greetings
Adina
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Dustbak
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« Reply #3 on: September 18, 2008, 01:57:48 AM »
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Indeed, a format does not necessarily mean deletion of files.

when you get it back: DO NOT USE IT, DON'T WRITE ON IT!

Unless Lacie did a low level format (rare nowadays), new partitioning or write tests on the drive it is very well possible a data recovery company can get a lot of files back.
« Last Edit: September 18, 2008, 01:58:15 AM by Dustbak » Logged
locpham
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« Reply #4 on: September 18, 2008, 02:15:17 AM »
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Quote
Stupidity is costly as we all know. I thought I share my recent experience here to save some big headache to any fellow member who will want to trust Lacie.
We just came back from a five day calendar shoot in Costa Rica. Shooting went very smooth, we had a great weather, flew in amazing models and wrapped up everything to our greatest satisfaction.
It was a decent size production with lots of rented lighting equipment so all with a substantial price tag.
We saved all images to Lacie 1TB and becked everything to identical memory unit.
Due to weight restrictions on hand baggage I opted to keep camera, lenses and two laptops with us and putting memories to two separate travel cases.
One of my bags got lost/stolen/vanished and never got recovered. The second one looked like it fell from from airplane and crashed on concrete. Upon inspection we realize that one of the hard drive disks moved out of its place rendering it unreadable. Right away I called Lacie and personally made arrangement to have it repaired. I explained the importance and value of the content and got verbal reasurrence that they will not due anything to harm the files. I Fedex it overnight to personal attention of my Lacie contact whom I spoke earlier on the phone. We put red tape sticky note " do not reformat " on the box and the Lacie case. Package arrived to Lacie at 9:30 am and after tracking the package on Fedex website and confirming delivery I call them around 11am. That 1.5 hour was enough time for this Fuc...rs to reformat the memory and mount back the disk.
The rest is just a history, nobody is liable responsible or even willing to say I am sorry. The form I sign says they do not guarantee the content just the hardware. This a common practice of reformatting at Lacie before even diagnosing the problem. After facts I was told that they are not in business of recovering files and then hanged up on.
No words to describe how I feel.
Andre
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=222255\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I avoid LaCie like the plague.  They don't seem to make anything, only relabel them.  I've had so many hard drives fail that I've lost count.
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Imaginara
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« Reply #5 on: September 18, 2008, 02:31:46 AM »
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Backups.. the scourge of any form of data-retention =)

A good rule is to as a bare minimum have one master, one backup, one backup to the backup and one off-site backup. This means that the master may fail, and the  backup may fail and you will still have one updated backup and one slightly less updated. And if you are travelling or moving, you separate every backup.

And here's the point.. this applies EVERYWHERE. that means if you are on location, you need the same setup including the off-site backup.

Lets take a worst case scenario.. your studio (or the studio/warehouse you are renting right now for the location shoot to store all the equipment) burns to the ground. Thats what the off-site backup is for.

Then lets take a travel scenario. Bag with master in gets stolen, bag with backup in is crashed. Ok. you still have two more. One should probably be in your carry-on luggage. The off-site one you MAIL to yourself. Then you are covering all possible bases. If you loose all four datasources, someones out to get you =)

Sound like a lot of work? Well, reconstructing hard-drive data from a burned/crashed harddrive can cost as much as $1000 per megabyte depending on how much actually can be retrieved. I would say keeping a minimum of 4 datasources (harddrives or some other backup that works) is a lot cheaper and easier.

All this takes is routine. Get your backup-routines sorted out and foremost, make them easy to handle for you. Skipping the backup because you need to rush out the door and just cant be arsed is a good way to loose that days work. Mr. Murphy is not a friend =)

In the end, it can be the difference between delivering that awesome super-shot to your client, or going out of business because you lost all your work.

Oh and some final words on the media. Your average hard-drive (top quality) has a life length of between 3-5 years. This means two things; 1) it MAY fail before that. 2) cycle your harddrives every 3.rd year, OR if one fails, cycle all of them. Especially if you buy your harddrives at the same place then chances are you got a bad batch. This is the same rule btw that you do with every life-protecting securityequipment, when the first unit fails - change all of them.

DVD's & CD's have a life-span of roughly the same thing provided they are handled with extreme care and stored in a dry/sun-less environment. In the jewel-case on a bookshelf in the nice studio is not a good place to store it. Though DVD's are rarely used now simply because of the ammount of data you need to back-up often exceeds the DVD capacity. But still good to know that they are not meant for permanent storage ever, even archive-quality.

Look at your backups not as a permanent solution, ie you shoot, you deliver, you backup, you forget about it. But rather as an ongoing cycling of your information. Keep it active between your backup-systems and for long term storage, online backupservices may be a good idea. But remember to back those up aswell as THEY may not have the same routines you do.

Sorry for the long post here but i have worked with information security and integrity (which includes backuproutines) for the past 20 years so i felt chatty today

Have fun all and keep your backups safe =)
/Henrik
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amsp
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« Reply #6 on: September 18, 2008, 04:37:25 AM »
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Lacie have notoriously bad quality and horrible customer service unfortunately.
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patrickfransdesmet
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« Reply #7 on: September 18, 2008, 04:56:56 AM »
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André,
I share your feelings ...
It is too sad to experience this
But it is also the backside of digital photography

I suggest to KEEP your digital files ON your body as handlugage

I do not know if it was possible to connect to a fileserver through internet and post your files from the shooting location to your office.
But it is something you have to consider in the future.

I often take FILM shots as back-up, just in case...

patrick frans de smet
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Yoram from Berlin
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« Reply #8 on: September 18, 2008, 05:54:06 AM »
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Quote
Stupidity is costly as we all know. I thought I share my recent experience here to save some big headache to any fellow member who will want to trust Lacie.
We just came back from a five day calendar shoot in Costa Rica. Shooting went very smooth, we had a great weather, flew in amazing models and wrapped up everything to our greatest satisfaction.
It was a decent size production with lots of rented lighting equipment so all with a substantial price tag.
We saved all images to Lacie 1TB and becked everything to identical memory unit.
Due to weight restrictions on hand baggage I opted to keep camera, lenses and two laptops with us and putting memories to two separate travel cases.
One of my bags got lost/stolen/vanished and never got recovered. The second one looked like it fell from from airplane and crashed on concrete. Upon inspection we realize that one of the hard drive disks moved out of its place rendering it unreadable. Right away I called Lacie and personally made arrangement to have it repaired. I explained the importance and value of the content and got verbal reasurrence that they will not due anything to harm the files. I Fedex it overnight to personal attention of my Lacie contact whom I spoke earlier on the phone. We put red tape sticky note " do not reformat " on the box and the Lacie case. Package arrived to Lacie at 9:30 am and after tracking the package on Fedex website and confirming delivery I call them around 11am. That 1.5 hour was enough time for this Fuc...rs to reformat the memory and mount back the disk.
The rest is just a history, nobody is liable responsible or even willing to say I am sorry. The form I sign says they do not guarantee the content just the hardware. This a common practice of reformatting at Lacie before even diagnosing the problem. After facts I was told that they are not in business of recovering files and then hanged up on.
No words to describe how I feel.
Andre
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=222255\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Write a detailed account of your experience, and email it to customer service. Also, a few days later, start posting it to as many customer review sites as possible, including Amazon, etc...
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woof75
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« Reply #9 on: September 18, 2008, 06:57:46 AM »
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Quote
Write a detailed account of your experience, and email it to customer service. Also, a few days later, start posting it to as many customer review sites as possible, including Amazon, etc...
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=222295\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I have a maxtor 160GB mini hard drive that never leaves my pocket with all my files on when I'm on location. (and another hard drive that I take on as carry on).
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N Walker
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« Reply #10 on: September 18, 2008, 07:09:30 AM »
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Lacie have notoriously bad quality and horrible customer service unfortunately.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=222287\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


I have been using four Lacie 250 external firewire drives for 5+ years and none of them have failed (they will at some point). I recently dropped one on concrete and 'fortunately' it is still going.

There are always two sides to the coin. Whilst they do re-badge products, and I am no big fan of Lacie, as I have moved on to Wiebetech products, I feel that it is important to give another users opinion of their products.

I agree that their customer service is poor and Andre's experience is dreadful.

www.golfpicturebank.com
« Last Edit: September 18, 2008, 07:13:23 AM by Nick Walker » Logged

Snook
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« Reply #11 on: September 18, 2008, 07:29:46 AM »
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Quote
I have been using four Lacie 250 external firewire drives for 5+ years and none of them have failed (they will at some point). I recently dropped one on concrete and 'fortunately' it is still going.

There are always two sides to the coin. Whilst they do re-badge products, and I am no big fan of Lacie, as I have moved on to Wiebetech products, I feel that it is important to give another users opinion of their products.

I agree that their customer service is poor and Andre's experience is dreadful.

www.golfpicturebank.com
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=222307\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I hate to say this... But what were you thinking putting all the eggs under the plane???
Atleast one should have been carry on. Specially seeing how the whole production was probably worth more than your laptop or cameras lens etc...

I feel for you, but I would NEVER send a Hard drive with images on it something other then under my arm at all times!
But then again that is my paranoia...

Did you get the images of the HD.. Did you lose everything?
Also Lacie Terra Drives are known for the worst of the line up.
I have Lacie drives for more than 10 years and only have had 1 Hic-Up

Again sorry and hope you figure something out...

Closest that I came to something similar was in the film days and just got done doing a 2 week job in miami.. Sitting in MIA someone Stole my cart with everything on it..
Camera Bags, Film... etc... Luckily some security guard saw everything and stopped a women heading out of the airport with all my stuff.

Snook
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revaaron
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« Reply #12 on: September 18, 2008, 07:46:26 AM »
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one problem with going in/out of the USA
http://www.cbp.gov/linkhandler/cgov/travel...h_authority.pdf
Officers may detain documents and electronic
devices, or copies thereof, for a reasonable period of time to perform a thorough
border search. The search may take place on-site or at an off-site location.
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Snook
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« Reply #13 on: September 18, 2008, 08:04:35 AM »
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Quote
one problem with going in/out of the USA
http://www.cbp.gov/linkhandler/cgov/travel...h_authority.pdf
Officers may detain documents and electronic
devices, or copies thereof, for a reasonable period of time to perform a thorough
border search. The search may take place on-site or at an off-site location.

[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=222316\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Never heard of that.. I go in and out all the time with laptop and hard drives with me..
But you make a good point of what a pain in the ass it is to go in and out of the US.
Paranoia is also a terrorist act and it is and has been working in the us for a long time now.

Besides that.. who cares .. let them look at the pictures and be on with it.. I doubt they are going to make you lose your flight over it.. unless you have some resemblance to Osama...

Snook

Still there is NO excuse for putting everything with check in... That is Rookie move for sure and I do not think any Brand HD is going to take a beting in luggage any better than the other.
And if your bag get's Stolen, which quite common now a days.
How could that be Lacie's fault...?
The poster even said the Luggage looked all bang up, but then blames lacie for not helping.

I really o feel for the poster, but do not get where it is anybodies fault but his for sending it under??

I get in fights all the time about my carry on and I tell them what the stuff cost and there is not way it is going under neath the plane.
Been doing that for 20 years..

Snook

PS. edited meant to say Monks... But took out a phrase for the Political correct crew here..
 Is it OK to say Religious fanatic freaks!!
« Last Edit: September 18, 2008, 02:04:11 PM by Snook » Logged
woof75
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« Reply #14 on: September 18, 2008, 08:28:48 AM »
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Quote
Never heard of that.. I go in and out all the time with laptop and hard drives with me..
But you make a good point of what a pain in the ass it is to go in and out of the US.
Paranoia is also a terrorist act and it is and has been working in the us for a long time now.

Besides that.. who cares .. let them look at the pictures and be on with it.. I doubt they are going to make you lose your flight over it.. unless you have some resemblance to Osama or one of his sand monkey's!

Snook

Still there is NO excuse for putting everything with check in... That is Rookie move for sure and I do not think any Brand HD is going to take a beting in luggage any better than the other.
And if your bag get's Stolen, which quite common now a days.
How could that be Lacie's fault...?
The poster even said the Luggage looked all bang up, but then blames lacie for not helping.

I really o feel for the poster, but do not get where it is anybodies fault but his for sending it under??

I get in fights all the time about my carry on and I tell them what the stuff cost and there is not way it is going under neath the plane.
Been doing that for 20 years..

Snook
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=222325\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Hate to say it but I agree, when your the photographer the buck stops with you. You put the value of your camera and laptop above the value of your clients shoot and you paid the price.
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Frank Doorhof
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« Reply #15 on: September 18, 2008, 08:29:37 AM »
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Don't panic yet and don't send to an expensive company.
Download/buy lost and found.
My wife runs a pc/mac store and she recovered dozens of hdds for customers even after a format and reinstall.  Best is to do nothing because than most is recovered but even when someone has used the drive you can recover data.

And invest in a second drive for mirror backups.
We use three arrays.
One always online
One once every two days to backup
One in a safe on other locations

Seeing the prices off hdds you can't afford not to.
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Snook
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« Reply #16 on: September 18, 2008, 08:58:17 AM »
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Quote
Don't panic yet and don't send to an expensive company.
Download/buy lost and found.
My wife runs a pc/mac store and she recovered dozens of hdds for customers even after a format and reinstall.  Best is to do nothing because than most is recovered but even when someone has used the drive you can recover data.

And invest in a second drive for mirror backups.
We use three arrays.
One always online
One once every two days to backup
One in a safe on other locations

Seeing the prices off hdds you can't afford not to.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=222332\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

He Did use a second drive which was stolen..
And as far as salvaging a whole trip of pictures from a HD... I do not see that happening.
You can sometimes recover a couple of pictures from a CF card or Drive but a Whole photoshoot with Gigs of Pictures.. Ain't happening if someone has erase or written over the stuff.
I heard those kind of stories of people saving there pictures from erase drives...
Again.. I think just stories...:+}

I was able to save some images from a damaged drive but nothing special.

But it is worth a try for sure...

Good Luck..
Snook
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gwhitf
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« Reply #17 on: September 18, 2008, 09:11:24 AM »
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mr napier

i cant imagine how you feel. all that work, all that effort. your gut must be acheing.

i use tiny bus powered GTech drives when i travel. I have six of them. 160 or 200 gigs each. i take velcro and stick them together so they don't separate. two mounted together. they take up VERY little space in the camera bag. assistant puts two in his carry on; i put two in my carry on; we check two. i also try to never reformat cf cards during a job; i have a million of them. but it is hard for a five day job, i agree. so i've got the cards as an extreme backup too.

can you not salvage last day of job from the laptop hd and the cf cards?

trust me, i know it feels awful today, but you will NEVER do it again. so feel good that this is the last time it will ever happen to you.

and everyone else, read this story twice, imagine how he feels, then head to apple store and buy three sets of drives, so you learn from his mistake.
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antonyoung
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« Reply #18 on: September 18, 2008, 09:48:51 AM »
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Wait wait wait...

You put the two existing copies of your data in checked baggage, which is insane. Then the airline lost one copy and broke the other, which is really not hard to predict. Airlines lose luggage all the time, and what they don't lose they break, and that is why I say it's insane to check hard drives.

Then you signed a form that says you understand that Lacie is responsible for the mechanism and not the data, and then you are surprised that you didn't get your data back? I'm sorry for your loss, but you are primarily the victim of your own actions, not Lacie's. Hopefully both you and other people can learn from the mistake.

Once the job is shot it's the hard drives that are the most valuable thing, not the cameras or lenses. If it comes to a choice of having to check something, the cameras, lenses, and laptops should all get checked before the hard drives.

Quote
Stupidity is costly as we all know. I thought I share my recent experience here to save some big headache to any fellow member who will want to trust Lacie.
We just came back from a five day calendar shoot in Costa Rica. Shooting went very smooth, we had a great weather, flew in amazing models and wrapped up everything to our greatest satisfaction.
It was a decent size production with lots of rented lighting equipment so all with a substantial price tag.
We saved all images to Lacie 1TB and becked everything to identical memory unit.
Due to weight restrictions on hand baggage I opted to keep camera, lenses and two laptops with us and putting memories to two separate travel cases.
One of my bags got lost/stolen/vanished and never got recovered. The second one looked like it fell from from airplane and crashed on concrete. Upon inspection we realize that one of the hard drive disks moved out of its place rendering it unreadable. Right away I called Lacie and personally made arrangement to have it repaired. I explained the importance and value of the content and got verbal reasurrence that they will not due anything to harm the files. I Fedex it overnight to personal attention of my Lacie contact whom I spoke earlier on the phone. We put red tape sticky note " do not reformat " on the box and the Lacie case. Package arrived to Lacie at 9:30 am and after tracking the package on Fedex website and confirming delivery I call them around 11am. That 1.5 hour was enough time for this Fuc...rs to reformat the memory and mount back the disk.
The rest is just a history, nobody is liable responsible or even willing to say I am sorry. The form I sign says they do not guarantee the content just the hardware. This a common practice of reformatting at Lacie before even diagnosing the problem. After facts I was told that they are not in business of recovering files and then hanged up on.
No words to describe how I feel.
Andre
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=222255\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
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James R Russell
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« Reply #19 on: September 18, 2008, 09:48:52 AM »
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Quote
mr napier

i cant imagine how you feel. all that work, all that effort. your gut must be acheing.

[{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


Yea I feel for you man and of course everyone is going to have advice, cause hindsight is 20 20.

I would think that a data recovery company, (probabably drive savers and probably about 2 grand) could recover most of the data.

[a href=\"http://www.drivesavers.com/solutions/raid-nas-san.html?gclid=CIG79trJ5ZUCFQwuHgodvW3MfQ]http://www.drivesavers.com/solutions/raid-...CFQwuHgodvW3MfQ[/url]

That said, I've got a billion lacie drives and have had very few problems, though I really hate saying that because the moment I do some drive will go up in a puff of smoke.

I now have this 4 backup rule.  It's a drag and overly obsessive, but I do one copy I carry, 1 the first carries, 1 that is carried by someone somewhere else (not the same plane) and one that we fedex to the retoucher from every city (dhl if out of country).

I buy these things like water, http://www.lacie.com/us/products/product.htm?pid=11085 and have 10 on order right now.  It's crazy expensive, it's crazy insane to backup the way I do, but my 4 backup process saved me 6 months ago so I figure it's worth it.

JR


P.S.  I know it's a pain, you come off a shoot exhausted, your dragging all of this stuff and then you fly for 11 hours than the connecting flight is some crappy overcrowded 737 where all the overheads are full of baby strollers and overnight rollerboards.    I've had them make us put the cameras underneath, but not before I pull out those orange lacie drives, gaff tape them together and put them in my lap.
« Last Edit: September 18, 2008, 09:56:04 AM by James R Russell » Logged

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