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Author Topic: Z3200 Review  (Read 7678 times)
Mussi_Spectraflow
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« on: October 27, 2008, 11:22:07 PM »
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Hi all,
    Greetings from Graph Expo! Just finished up our review of the Z3200. This is an early version and subject to revision after the printer starts to ship. Over the Next few weeks we will also be publishing a review of the Epson 7900. As always I appreciate your comments and feedback.

http://www.spectraflow.com/index.php?optio...4&Itemid=67
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Julian Mussi

Spectraflow, Color Workflow Solutions
www.Spectraflow.com
Ernst Dinkla
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« Reply #1 on: October 28, 2008, 05:21:20 AM »
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Quote from: Mussi_Spectraflow
Hi all,
    Greetings from Graph Expo! Just finished up our review of the Z3200. This is an early version and subject to revision after the printer starts to ship. Over the Next few weeks we will also be publishing a review of the Epson 7900. As always I appreciate your comments and feedback.

http://www.spectraflow.com/index.php?optio...4&Itemid=67

Julian,

Thank you.

A nice summary of all pros and cons.
If the need is there the Z3200 makes it even more easy to use third party papers than HP already made possible for the Z3100. Given the GE limiting and some other features in profile creation.

A question:
You mention in the article that the Gloss Enhancer amount can be varied in the Z3200's media preset settings when a custom media preset is created and can also be varied in the driver. Do I understand that correctly ?

On the RGB 255 not getting GE when GE is used in the image area only on the print page (Economy mode): I have edited a Z3100 GE profile so the RGB 255,255,255 becomes 254,254,255 (less yellow used in theory) and with Photoshop it will lay down GE on all spots of the image that way. I see no color problems resulting from that edit. It doesn't work on the Qimage CM, which shows again that its CM is still different on details to Photoshop's CM. But Qimage has a nice print filter feature that applies custom filters (curves etc) on the fly on the printer input. Just bringing Red to 254 is enough in that case to get GE printing all image spots in Economy mode. That way I do not have to make profile edits either. The microscope didn't show any additional color dots in the image white areas.

The Wasatch SoftRip has the feature of limiting the GE amount per media preset and does print all image areas with GE in "Economy mode" so the Z3200 with the new GE limiting choice(s) and with the patch I mention will do the same now. That's nice. The SoftRip however doesn't use the HP 11 color separation you mention in the review and its own methods are not up to that quality so I do not use it for the Z3100 right now.

Another question, I have not updated my APS yet and wonder whether the CGAT transfer is available in the last version of APS and compatible with the Z3100. Probably asking too much :-)


Ernst Dinkla

Try: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Wide_Inkjet_Printers/


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neil snape
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« Reply #2 on: October 28, 2008, 11:18:07 AM »
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Nice review Julian. Lots of info there. So much I haven't enough time to completely read it.

One note: the Z does actually purge inks. When the NEDD checks per cycle, per run length, per time schedule, there is a purge with a median of 3 drops per nozzle. There is a sort of maintenance diaper too unless this has changed.


Ernst, please write me with an email that I can send you something. Your mail server still rejects all mail from free.fr.
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kers
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« Reply #3 on: October 28, 2008, 02:59:24 PM »
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Julian,
Thanks for the very good review with lots of information!

As a more than happy HP Z3100 owner I may say it is in line with my own findings.
But I have some additions to it although I like the printer a lot:

strenghts:

the ability to tweak the amount of ink and other parameters for each papertype you like and susbsequently make a reliable ICC-profile (that also shows you the result of the changes made)

weaknesses:
it cannot handle thick media over 0.8mm
---
The gloss enhancer system does not work well on a lot of interesting third party papers like Ilford Fibre Silk
In these cases or used without gloss enhancer bronzing ( black& White prints) and Gloss differential will appear strongly
« Last Edit: October 29, 2008, 03:24:26 AM by kers » Logged

Pieter Kers
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dct123
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« Reply #4 on: October 28, 2008, 04:45:34 PM »
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Quote from: Mussi_Spectraflow
Hi all,
    Greetings from Graph Expo! Just finished up our review of the Z3200. This is an early version and subject to revision after the printer starts to ship. Over the Next few weeks we will also be publishing a review of the Epson 7900. As always I appreciate your comments and feedback.

http://www.spectraflow.com/index.php?optio...4&Itemid=67

Fopr those of you who may be weighing the differences between the Z3100 and Z3200, here are some preliminary observations of my new 44" Z3200ps:

1. The 44" Z3200ps I received shipped w/69ml ink cartridges, not the full-size 130ml (mfg date 10/10/08, low 4 digit serial #).
2. The Z3200ps is from 12–30% faster than the Z3100ps, depending on quality settings.
3. The Z3200ps has an 80GB hard drive...the Z3100ps a 40GB drive.
4. And last but not least...the 44" model is much heavier than the 24"! (I recommend you use two people to stand it upright)

When my workload has cleared, I'll do more comparisons and post them here.

DC Tomick
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neil snape
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« Reply #5 on: October 29, 2008, 05:08:49 AM »
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Quote from: dct123
Fopr those of you who may be weighing the differences between the Z3100 and Z3200, here are some preliminary observations of my new 44" Z3200ps:

1. The 44" Z3200ps I received shipped w/69ml ink cartridges, not the full-size 130ml (mfg date 10/10/08, low 4 digit serial #).
2. The Z3200ps is from 12–30% faster than the Z3100ps, depending on quality settings.
3. The Z3200ps has an 80GB hard drive...the Z3100ps a 40GB drive.
4. And last but not least...the 44" model is much heavier than the 24"! (I recommend you use two people to stand it upright)

When my workload has cleared, I'll do more comparisons and post them here.

DC Tomick

The PS models were supposed to have bigger drives and more memory for the Z 3100 too.

True the 24" Z 3100 was delivered in theory with 69ml carts vs the full 130ml carts. The Z 3100 44" was delivered with 130ml carts. No idea what is up there.
They claim it to be that much faster. Exact reasons have not been disclosed.
I think you mean turn it upright, unless you're like me where turning it to stand upright is necessary to pass through a doorway, it is not a good idea as the frame is quite stressed.
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Mussi_Spectraflow
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« Reply #6 on: October 29, 2008, 12:32:43 PM »
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Thanks for the feedback.
    A few responses. Neil, you are of course right that the printer does purge ink through the heads however, what I was trying to convey is that there is a fundamental difference between pushing 5ml of ink through the head when it's dirty and shooting several drops through each nozzle to keep them from getting clogged. I'll go back and clarify the language I used.
   The speed is slightly faster but I believe this is only on the best setting, in my review of the 3100 I said that the speed was generally slower than the epson 7800 and with the 3200 they are about on par. I'll try and make mention of this tweak though as it is a relevant change between models. Your Z3200 44" shipping with the 69ml inks is surprising. I will check with HP about this, demo versions always come with the full 130ml carts so I cant comment. Also thank you for your point about media thickness, and hard drive size those are specs that should be included.
     One more note, when I ordered my 44" 3100 it was SHIPPED on end. You can imagine my feelings when the guy pointed to the large vertically oriented box and said "well that was the only way we could fit it in" Being pretty pissed I said that I hoped that they weren't also in the business of shipping corpses. Any way despite the rough handling the printer has had no problems, although I wouldn't suggest ever putting a printer loaded with inks on end.

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Julian Mussi

Spectraflow, Color Workflow Solutions
www.Spectraflow.com
dct123
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« Reply #7 on: October 29, 2008, 01:26:35 PM »
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Quote from: neil snape
The PS models were supposed to have bigger drives and more memory for the Z 3100 too.

True the 24" Z 3100 was delivered in theory with 69ml carts vs the full 130ml carts. The Z 3100 44" was delivered with 130ml carts. No idea what is up there.
They claim it to be that much faster. Exact reasons have not been disclosed.
I think you mean turn it upright, unless you're like me where turning it to stand upright is necessary to pass through a doorway, it is not a good idea as the frame is quite stressed.

My printer assembly directions called for turning the main body of the printer upside down and attaching the legs. Then it called for standing the printer upright. (inverting it).

BTW: the ink cartridge kit was labeled "Red Baron B1K Kit"...(Hmmm...Sprechen Deutsch?)

So far, there is little difference in test images I'm printing from the Z3200 compared to the Z3100.  However, compared to the Z3100,  there is less noticable star wheel tracking on prints from the Z3200 on gloss photo (Professional High Gloss contract Proofing Paper) and Océ Clear Film. But, if you want to find some tracking, it's there...you just need to look more closely. For my own and my clients' quality criteria, I believe that the Z3200 has eliminated any star wheel tracking that is immediately visible to the naked eye under 'normal' lighting conditions, and therefore it is producing acceptable gloss and film output.

I have never had a problem with reds on the Z3100, so I'll not bother doing any comparisons there.

The Z3100 does a fantastic job of printing on canvas, satin, and matte papers. In fact, I continue to steadily increase the client base of my fine art reproduction and exhibition photograph business, based solely on "word of mouth" referrals.

My suggestion is to stay with HP paper (except for Océ film). The only head crash I've had with the Z3100 was when I tried some canvas samples from another manufacturer, and I'm quite pleased with Pro Canvas, Pro Satin, and Contract Gloss.

Also, for those of you contemplating whether to purchase the 24" or 44"...don't hesitate, go for the 44". You can always run 24" or 18" roll stock of the 44, but you have the option to print larger if a client requires it. Many times I regretted not buying the 44" Z3100. And, get the ps model if your budget allows. (Gigabit network, Postscript, Pantone, larger prints, etc.)

So in conclusion, it looks like HP has done a good job on the new Z3200 in clearing up some of the problems of the Z3100...now, I need to get back to work.

DC Tomick

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alan a
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« Reply #8 on: October 29, 2008, 10:43:00 PM »
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Your web site is down and not functioning.  Let us know when it is fixed so we can download the review.
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Mussi_Spectraflow
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« Reply #9 on: November 01, 2008, 11:07:27 PM »
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Should be back up now, we've been doing a lot of work on it lately.
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Julian Mussi

Spectraflow, Color Workflow Solutions
www.Spectraflow.com
Thomas Krüger
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« Reply #10 on: November 14, 2008, 04:01:06 AM »
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Maybe a stupid question but: Is it possible to use the new HP 73 Chromatic Red cartridges also in the old Z3100 printer?
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neil snape
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« Reply #11 on: November 14, 2008, 04:14:25 AM »
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No it isn't. Even if you load the inks into the older chipped cartridges the color maps will be all wrong so you'll not be able to print without contouring, non-linear output.
No amount of profiling will correct for the much different color maps with the new red ink.
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