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Author Topic: Hand held HDR - What software are you using?  (Read 10027 times)
BernardLanguillier
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« Reply #20 on: January 14, 2009, 04:38:43 PM »
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Quote from: kikashi
I've heard it said that Hydra is particularly good at this kind of thing (their blurb certainly claims that it is), but I confess I've not tried it myself. It's both standalone and an Aperture plug-in, if that's of interest.

Thanks for the pointer, will give it a try.

Cheers,
Bernard
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BernardLanguillier
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« Reply #21 on: January 14, 2009, 05:18:39 PM »
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Quote from: kikashi
I've heard it said that Hydra is particularly good at this kind of thing (their blurb certainly claims that it is), but I confess I've not tried it myself. It's both standalone and an Aperture plug-in, if that's of interest.

Jeremy

Just did a quick test based on my sample images. Hydra is for sure doing a better job than Photomatix and CS4 at alignement, but it is still isn't as accurate as a well optimized PTgui alignement. Other images might deliver different results though.

Colorwise also, I see some artifacts with Hydra that are not there with PTgui, but Hydra still delivers a good result very quickly.

My first impression is that there is good potential, and that Hydra is already a player to consider when good (but not excellent) results are needed quickly.

Cheers,
Bernard
« Last Edit: January 15, 2009, 02:00:17 AM by BernardLanguillier » Logged

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kikashi
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« Reply #22 on: January 15, 2009, 03:05:41 AM »
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Quote from: BernardLanguillier
Just did a quick test based on my sample images. Hydra is for sure doing a better job than Photomatix and CS4 at alignement, but it is still isn't as accurate as a well optimized PTgui alignement. Other images might deliver different results though.

Colorwise also, I see some artifacts with Hydra that are not there with PTgui, but Hydra still delivers a good result very quickly.

My first impression is that there is good potential, and that Hydra is already a player to consider when good (but not excellent) results are needed quickly.

Cheers,
Bernard
Thanks for the feedback, Bernard. I've shied away from HDR so far, having come across some truly awful, artificial-looking results, but I suppose that like any other technique it works well in good hands. I look forward to seeing what you produce!

Jeremy
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Alexandre Buisse
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« Reply #23 on: January 15, 2009, 04:41:29 AM »
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I have tried yesterday to use Autopano Pro to align the images, but did not manage to tell it to not autoblend and export the layers separately. Did anyone manage to get that working?
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mbalensiefer
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« Reply #24 on: January 15, 2009, 07:17:15 AM »
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Not to break this thread up, but is there an HDR program that can work off of just one image?
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BernardLanguillier
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« Reply #25 on: January 15, 2009, 07:48:06 AM »
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Quote from: Alexandre Buisse
I have tried yesterday to use Autopano Pro to align the images, but did not manage to tell it to not autoblend and export the layers separately. Did anyone manage to get that working?

In the "create panorama" tab, you should select under LDR "individual layers" to get individual files containing warped and aligned images.

Cheers,
Bernard

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jani
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« Reply #26 on: January 15, 2009, 10:04:15 AM »
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Quote from: mbalensiefer
Not to break this thread up, but is there an HDR program that can work off of just one image?
That would be rather pointless, unless you're looking for that particular artificial look you get with certain tone mapping techniques.

To extract the greatest dynamic range, use your favourite raw converter. Most raw converters have gratis tutorials on their own websites, and for those that don't explain how to do this, try to use e.g. Google to search for "raw converter best dynamic range" or similar search terms.
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BernardLanguillier
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« Reply #27 on: January 15, 2009, 10:24:18 PM »
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Quote from: schrodingerscat
Bernard -

Are you on a Mac? If so, try: http://pangeasoft.net/pano/bracketeer/index.html. It's specifically designed for hand held HDR's. I've fooled with it a bit and it seems to work well enough to warrant further exploration.

My first tests with Bracketeer are not too encouraging in terms of alignement capability for hand held images.

The Fusion based algo seems to work well and offers a bit more control than PTgui, so it might be a good option for tripo shot HDR work, but alignement seems disapointing per my first tests, I need to spend more time playing with the parameters.

Cheers,
Bernard

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sniper
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« Reply #28 on: January 16, 2009, 08:09:55 AM »
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Quote from: mbalensiefer
Not to break this thread up, but is there an HDR program that can work off of just one image?
Dynamic photo HDR   link does a fair job from a single jpeg, the free trial doesn't time out either, it puts a small logo in one corner of the image, theres a few other limitations but it's usuable enough to get a fairly decent result.  Wayne
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BernardLanguillier
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« Reply #29 on: January 16, 2009, 07:23:16 PM »
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Quote from: kikashi
Thanks for the feedback, Bernard. I've shied away from HDR so far, having come across some truly awful, artificial-looking results, but I suppose that like any other technique it works well in good hands. I look forward to seeing what you produce!

Well, I hope that you will never notice that an image I produce uses some sort of HDR technique.

I understand that some people see HDR as a style, and respect that, but I do personnally currently see it as a technique among others to overcome the limitations of my gear.

Since software at post-processing is a key component, it is key to know in advance what needs to be done at shooting time to be able to get good results at the end of the chain.

Cheers,
Bernard
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BernardLanguillier
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« Reply #30 on: January 17, 2009, 08:58:01 AM »
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I have pushed my investigations a bit further, and have found a new workflow that appears to give a result a bit better than PTgui, but at the cost of extra operations:

- Use Photoacute to align the images only (the HDR output of PA is poor) -> this produces an excellent alignment
  - The usability of PA is very poor, each of the tiff files have to be saved on by one after alignment...
- Open each of the tiff in CS4 and re-save them as tiff (the next step doesn't work if this is not done, probably because PA applies some un-supported compression to its tiff files)
- Use bracketeer to apply a Fusion HDR to the images (Bracketeer alignement is poor).

Cheers,
Bernard

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mcbroomf
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« Reply #31 on: January 18, 2009, 06:03:17 PM »
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Bernard,

I use a Lightroom plugin called Enfuse occasionally and have found it pretty effective.  2 things bugged me though, it does not produce a layered output, and it does not appear to accept the changes initially made in LR (eg WB, CA etc).

Here's one example;
http://www.pbase.com/mike_broomfield/image/98270814

Regards,
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Mike Broomfield
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BernardLanguillier
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« Reply #32 on: January 18, 2009, 09:44:41 PM »
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Quote from: mcbroomf
Bernard,

I use a Lightroom plugin called Enfuse occasionally and have found it pretty effective.  2 things bugged me though, it does not produce a layered output, and it does not appear to accept the changes initially made in LR (eg WB, CA etc).

Here's one example;
http://www.pbase.com/mike_broomfield/image/98270814

Regards,

Very natural looking sample indeed. I know a bit about the Enfuse approach to DR expansion, and have found it to deliver much more pleasing results compared to Tone Mapped images.

A few questions though:

- Does Enfuse have a Mac version? Last time I checked I got the feeling that it was Win only,
- Does it exist as a PS plug-in or standalone application? I have stopped using LR some time ago,
- How well does it deal with alignement?

Bracketeer is a Mac version of the Enfuse algo available as a standalone application, but its alignement capability appears to be pretty poor.

Thank you.

Cheers,
Bernard
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Guillermo Luijk
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« Reply #33 on: January 18, 2009, 09:52:45 PM »
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Enfuse works on the same algorithm as TuFuse, but I found the later to provide slightly better results. Both provide quite reallistic images thanks to the way that algorithm works, which is a pixel selection rather than HDR tone mapping.

Moreover TuFuse performs a 2 steps blending with first iteration making a focus blend (DOF enhancement), and second an exposure blend (tone mapping).

I haven't used it intensively, but from my tests it provides a very good image in terms of local contrast (which is the most difficult part):



Then you can add a global contrast curve to get the final image:



Usually no halos, unreallistic lighting nor surprises, but in this case the correction of the brightness of the window seemed to affect the chair.

BR
« Last Edit: January 18, 2009, 09:55:50 PM by GLuijk » Logged

teddillard
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« Reply #34 on: January 19, 2009, 04:58:48 AM »
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I use RAW Smart Objects.

 
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Ted Dillard
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« Reply #35 on: January 19, 2009, 05:52:53 AM »
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I too am a tad tripod-obsessed but the other way around I'm afraid...

So far I did have good results with the "align layers" function of CS3, way better than the tests I made with Photomatix 3.0 (very deceiving, and the "tonemapped" look is quite errrr hard to say the least). As said by Ted Dillard, used with ACR smart objects it sounds quite powerful.

Working mainly with LR I often try Enfuse, but the alignment is not that perfect (way better than Photomatix too, but still some occasional ghosting). It works for some cases and not others, it seems it doesn't tolerate much move between images.

I did think to try TuFuse or Enfuse, but would really like something that doesn't break the LR flow... With that constraint, LR/Enfuse is the best tool I found so far.
« Last Edit: January 19, 2009, 05:55:47 AM by NikoJorj » Logged

Nicolas from Grenoble
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« Reply #36 on: January 19, 2009, 07:07:57 AM »
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I use the Enfuse LR plugin created by Timothy Armes, but if you do not use LR that is not much help I'm afraid, although he does offers a MAC version..  As Guillermo said other front ends are available...I'm not sure which offer Mac versions though.

http://timothyarmes.com/lrenfuse.php

I'd say that for 95%+ of my work I'm on a tripod, so I don't usually check the align images feature.  I can't say for sure how many problems I've had with it as my handheld shots tend to fall into the snapshot bucket.  It sounds like Nicolas has put it through more paces than I have.

The misalignment of the images taken in shot I posted was quite significant by the way.  My recollection is that I lost 5-10 of the linear width of the photo just due to the cropping required.
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Mike Broomfield
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« Reply #37 on: January 19, 2009, 07:34:15 AM »
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Quote from: BernardLanguillier
In the "create panorama" tab, you should select under LDR "individual layers" to get individual files containing warped and aligned images.

Cheers,
Bernard


http://www.autopano.net/wiki/action/view/P...p_layer_edition
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Oscar Rysdyk
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« Reply #38 on: January 19, 2009, 02:06:58 PM »
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Quote from: teddillard
I use RAW Smart Objects.

 

Is it possible the make that work with handheld exposures though? I've tried and never found a way to make it work-- specifically, how do you deal wit the alignment?


Regarding the Enfuse plugin, look here: http://wiki.panotools.org/Enfuse. Looks like there's a few options to run it on a Mac without using LR.
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