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Author Topic: Reflection in Print Viewer  (Read 3925 times)
walter.sk
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« on: January 18, 2009, 03:18:52 PM »
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I've been using my desktop print viewer for almost two weeks, and find that with glossy papers I get glare and reflections across the top of the print, which really interferes with assessing the print.  I contacted the sales rep of the manufacturer, who said they never saw such reflections.  It may be a function of the height of my chair and the height of the desktop, but I can't lower the desktop nor sit higher and still be able to use the keyboard.  The monitor and print viewer are at the same height, on a normal, everyday computer desk.

The company was very good about working with me on another issue, which is that the 17"x24" paper I need to proof doesn't get held in the paper-grabbing device at the top of the viewer (at least the Epson Premium Glossy doesn't.)  The company would provide a metal plate that is magnetic, and a few magnets to hold the 17x24 sheets. But they have not addressed the reflection issue yet.  

I have only until Monday to return the viewer, and I could order another brand.  The other brand is as involved in professional color matching/viewing, etc, but their desktop viewers are advertised as "totally glare free and reflection free" (a paraphrase).  The literature with the viewer I have now says nothing about glare or reflections.

I had an offer of a small piece of P95 plexi to use as a diffuser to cut the reflections.  My thinking is that I would be better off trying to return the print viewer and order the other company's.  If I still get the reflections, I would then try the P95 sheet of plexiglass (acrylic, I think.)

Any thoughts on this?  I have posted a picture of the viewer and the glare.

[attachment=10975:GlareNormalViewing.jpg]
« Last Edit: January 18, 2009, 03:25:07 PM by walter.sk » Logged
Craig Lamson
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« Reply #1 on: January 18, 2009, 03:50:00 PM »
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Quote from: walter.sk
I've been using my desktop print viewer for almost two weeks, and find that with glossy papers I get glare and reflections across the top of the print, which really interferes with assessing the print.  I contacted the sales rep of the manufacturer, who said they never saw such reflections.  It may be a function of the height of my chair and the height of the desktop, but I can't lower the desktop nor sit higher and still be able to use the keyboard.  The monitor and print viewer are at the same height, on a normal, everyday computer desk.

The company was very good about working with me on another issue, which is that the 17"x24" paper I need to proof doesn't get held in the paper-grabbing device at the top of the viewer (at least the Epson Premium Glossy doesn't.)  The company would provide a metal plate that is magnetic, and a few magnets to hold the 17x24 sheets. But they have not addressed the reflection issue yet.  

I have only until Monday to return the viewer, and I could order another brand.  The other brand is as involved in professional color matching/viewing, etc, but their desktop viewers are advertised as "totally glare free and reflection free" (a paraphrase).  The literature with the viewer I have now says nothing about glare or reflections.

I had an offer of a small piece of P95 plexi to use as a diffuser to cut the reflections.  My thinking is that I would be better off trying to return the print viewer and order the other company's.  If I still get the reflections, I would then try the P95 sheet of plexiglass (acrylic, I think.)

Any thoughts on this?  I have posted a picture of the viewer and the glare.




[attachment=10975:GlareNormalViewing.jpg]

Is that a GTI viewer?  I have one as well and I love it, just slightly change your viewing angle. and there is no glare.  Better yet, just don't use the grabber and let the print sit at the bottom.
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walter.sk
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« Reply #2 on: January 18, 2009, 04:27:52 PM »
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Quote from: infocusinc
Is that a GTI viewer?  I have one as well and I love it, just slightly change your viewing angle. and there is no glare.  Better yet, just don't use the grabber and let the print sit at the bottom.
It is a GTI.  I've tried a wide range of viewing angles.  The only way I can lessen the reflection is by raising the front of the light panel and putting a wedge in where it joins the viewing panel.  But then the light is noticeably less at the bottom of the print.

I also got this model so that I could put 17x24 paper in, and there is no room to raise or lower it; it goes from top to bottom of the viewing area.

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Craig Lamson
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« Reply #3 on: January 18, 2009, 08:30:31 PM »
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Quote from: walter.sk
It is a GTI.  I've tried a wide range of viewing angles.  The only way I can lessen the reflection is by raising the front of the light panel and putting a wedge in where it joins the viewing panel.  But then the light is noticeably less at the bottom of the print.

I also got this model so that I could put 17x24 paper in, and there is no room to raise or lower it; it goes from top to bottom of the viewing area.


You might need a bigger viewer then.

In viewing the Just Normlicht viewer (I'm guessing that is the other unit in question) I don't think you will have any better luck...at least from what I see in the PDF
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NikosR
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« Reply #4 on: January 20, 2009, 10:57:54 PM »
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I'm afraid you can't beat physics... The solution for avoiding reflections is changing either the viewing or the light to paper angle. If you can't do either due to physical constraints you're out of luck.
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walter.sk
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« Reply #5 on: January 21, 2009, 07:52:19 AM »
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Quote from: NikosR
I'm afraid you can't beat physics... The solution for avoiding reflections is changing either the viewing or the light to paper angle. If you can't do either due to physical constraints you're out of luck.
Well, I am ordering a different brand of viewer, which hopefully will have a slightly different light-to-paper angle.  It is also going to be 24.6"Hx 25.25"W on the viewing surface, so that I could position the prints (usually 17x24) lower.  If all that fails, I will try some P95 plastic to diffuse the light.  Something is bound to work...
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Craig Lamson
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« Reply #6 on: January 21, 2009, 08:12:58 AM »
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Quote from: walter.sk
Well, I am ordering a different brand of viewer, which hopefully will have a slightly different light-to-paper angle.  It is also going to be 24.6"Hx 25.25"W on the viewing surface, so that I could position the prints (usually 17x24) lower.  If all that fails, I will try some P95 plastic to diffuse the light.  Something is bound to work...


Diffusion won't change anything.  Remember the saying... Angle of incidence equals angle of reflection.
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walter.sk
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« Reply #7 on: January 21, 2009, 08:28:20 AM »
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Quote from: infocusinc
Diffusion won't change anything.  Remember the saying... Angle of incidence equals angle of reflection.

I'll have to reflect on that.  Actually, if I still have the problem with the other company's viewer, I'll be forced to find a better viewing situation.  Or I might resort to a ballpeen adjustment, using the hammer I keep in the desk drawer if the frustration level gets too high.  It might not solve the problem, but for a while it would make me feel better.
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Eric Myrvaagnes
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« Reply #8 on: January 21, 2009, 10:38:25 AM »
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Quote from: infocusinc
Diffusion won't change anything.  Remember the saying... Angle of incidence equals angle of reflection.
This is absolutely true, and there is no getting around it.

I haven't yet bought a viewing box, but from this thread it seems to me that the ideal one should be very deep (front to back), with a tiltable back panel that you can swing back and forth until you get the angles right to minimize reflection off the print. Do any of the commercial print viewing boxes do that? Is the light positioned far enough from the back wall so that there is evn enough room to change the tilt angle of the print?
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Craig Lamson
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« Reply #9 on: January 21, 2009, 03:46:36 PM »
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Quote from: EricM
This is absolutely true, and there is no getting around it.

I haven't yet bought a viewing box, but from this thread it seems to me that the ideal one should be very deep (front to back), with a tiltable back panel that you can swing back and forth until you get the angles right to minimize reflection off the print. Do any of the commercial print viewing boxes do that? Is the light positioned far enough from the back wall so that there is evn enough room to change the tilt angle of the print?

I have no idea but I mus tsay after using my GTI for the last few years a reflection is not really that big of a deal.  After all the box is just for reviewing work not for display.  If for some reason you can't get rid a a reflection by standing up and changing the viewing angle, then turn the print 180 degree to view the area that had the reflection.  I can't imagine dropping more money tha the GTI costs because of a reflection given that the box is just a proofing tool.
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Tim Lookingbill
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« Reply #10 on: January 24, 2009, 01:17:06 AM »
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Ever consider a set up like the one depicted in the image below. It's my current setup though the picture is taken in my old studio and it didn't cost an arm and a leg.

I'm using small 18" T8's, but two 4 foot T-12's will give more diffused light to more evenly illuminate a large print whether under the table or large booth constructed out of black foamcore.

[attachment=11069:AmbientL...ckGEonly.jpg]
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walter.sk
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« Reply #11 on: January 24, 2009, 08:28:27 AM »
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Quote from: tlooknbill
Ever consider a set up like the one depicted in the image below. It's my current setup though the picture is taken in my old studio and it didn't cost an arm and a leg.

I'm using small 18" T8's, but two 4 foot T-12's will give more diffused light to more evenly illuminate a large print whether under the table or large booth constructed out of black foamcore.

[attachment=11069:AmbientL...ckGEonly.jpg]

It looks good, but I want the ability to dim the light to match the monitor's intensity.  I ordered a Just Normlicht with a larger viewing area for not much more than the GTI was.  The angle looks different and I'm hoping I won't get the reflection of the bulbs.  However, because it has a taller viewing area I can position prints lower relative to the light if I have to.  Since my most frequent print size is 17x24 (11x17's 2 up on the sheet)  the Just viewing area will allow me to put the sheet in as 17x24 or 24x17, depending on the orientation of the individual 11x17's.  If the reflection is the same, I will find some alternative setup of my room if I have to.
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« Reply #12 on: January 24, 2009, 05:04:26 PM »
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Quote from: walter.sk
It looks good, but I want the ability to dim the light to match the monitor's intensity.  I ordered a Just Normlicht with a larger viewing area for not much more than the GTI was.  The angle looks different and I'm hoping I won't get the reflection of the bulbs.  However, because it has a taller viewing area I can position prints lower relative to the light if I have to.  Since my most frequent print size is 17x24 (11x17's 2 up on the sheet)  the Just viewing area will allow me to put the sheet in as 17x24 or 24x17, depending on the orientation of the individual 11x17's.  If the reflection is the same, I will find some alternative setup of my room if I have to.


I hope the new viewer fits your needs.
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