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Author Topic: Canon Picture Styles In Lightroom  (Read 7893 times)
samosa
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« on: February 15, 2009, 11:04:49 AM »
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In Canon's description of the various Picture Styles there are differences in Sharpness, Contrast, Saturation, and Color Tone. When I apply these various Picture Styles to a RAW file in Lightroom (under the Camera Calibration tab), I can see the preview image changing, but there are no changes to the slider settings in Lightroom. This makes sense because, if my understanding is correct, each Picture Style is simply a slightly different  starting point to which the default slider settings make subsequent changes.

My question therefore is, when applying the Picture Styles to a RAW file in Lightroom, do they apply any sharpening as suggested by Canon's description of these profiles?  Furthermore, am I right in thinking that when shooting RAW only, the application of a Picture Style in camera is completly irrelevant because that setting is not read by Lightroom?

Before you rush in - I do understand that Picture Styles applied in LR don't alter the RAW file, but they are altering the preview of the image and the output - so the choice is very relevant.

Presumably, for the purists who want total control within Lightroom, you are using Faithfull or Neutral (which, according to Canon, both say they are relevant if you want to post-process on the computer) - although I can't see much difference?
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digitaldog
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« Reply #1 on: February 15, 2009, 11:46:04 AM »
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Quote from: samosa
In Canon's description of the various Picture Styles there are differences in Sharpness, Contrast, Saturation, and Color Tone. When I apply these various Picture Styles to a RAW file in Lightroom (under the Camera Calibration tab), I can see the preview image changing, but there are no changes to the slider settings in Lightroom.

Picture styles you set on the camera are only applied to JPEGs, the Raw's are just that, Raw. The options you're picking in Calibration are "profiles" from Adobe, they don't affect sharpness at all. These profiles don't affect the sliders at all (a preset would). They are taking place in the rendering pipeline prior to any user settings above.
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Andrew Rodney
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Scott Martin
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« Reply #2 on: February 15, 2009, 01:24:10 PM »
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Canon's picture styles can also effect DPP's processing of raw files. So if you shoot with vivid color and high sharpness DPP will process those raw files with those settings. DPP is often overlooked and does have some neat things going for it.

Interestingly, Canon's camera reps say that Lightroom/ACR can be set to use the picture styles to set ACR's sliders. So for example, they say that if the sharpness is set to high in-camera, Lightroom/ACR can be set to pay attention to this metadata and use a high sharping amount on those files. Hmmm. I haven't figured out how Lightroom/ACR might be able to do this and would love to hear from someone if they have.
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digitaldog
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« Reply #3 on: February 15, 2009, 01:34:48 PM »
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Quote from: Onsight
Interestingly, Canon's camera reps say that Lightroom/ACR can be set to use the picture styles to set ACR's sliders. So for example, they say that if the sharpness is set to high in-camera, Lightroom/ACR can be set to pay attention to this metadata and use a high sharping amount on those files. Hmmm. I haven't figured out how Lightroom/ACR might be able to do this and would love to hear from someone if they have.

We both haven't figured this out because I'm pretty darn sure, Canon is wrong!
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Andrew Rodney
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Tklimek
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« Reply #4 on: February 15, 2009, 01:57:56 PM »
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Andrew....

The camera profiles in Lightroom only affect color calibration in the pipeline prior to processing.....is that correct?

Cheers....

Todd in Chicago

Quote from: digitaldog
We both haven't figured this out because I'm pretty darn sure, Canon is wrong!
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digitaldog
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« Reply #5 on: February 15, 2009, 02:03:53 PM »
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Quote from: Tklimek
The camera profiles in Lightroom only affect color calibration in the pipeline prior to processing.....is that correct?

That's my understanding yes. Hopefully Eric will chime in and confirm or deny.
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Andrew Rodney
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Peter_DL
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« Reply #6 on: February 15, 2009, 03:24:22 PM »
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Quote from: digitaldog
The options you're picking in Calibration are "profiles" from Adobe, they don't affect sharpness at all. These profiles don't affect the sliders at all (a preset would). They are taking place in the rendering pipeline prior to any user settings above.
The profiles can effect tonality as well, even though the sliders LR/CR don't move
(see DNG profile editor).

DPL

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digitaldog
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« Reply #7 on: February 15, 2009, 03:28:09 PM »
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Quote from: DPL
The profiles can effect tonality as well, even though the sliders LR/CR don't move
--


Indeed, they affect color and tone, nothing else and they are applied prior to the sliders above.
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Andrew Rodney
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Schewe
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« Reply #8 on: February 15, 2009, 04:25:47 PM »
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Quote from: Onsight
Interestingly, Canon's camera reps say that Lightroom/ACR can be set to use the picture styles to set ACR's sliders.


Guy is on drugs...or simply a moron. Adobe has decoded ISO white balance and now DNG color profiles but that's it. The is no parameter in Camera Raw that would equate to Canons sharpening settings and the other settings would not match up either...this is a pipe dream and not something I would want.
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sandymc
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« Reply #9 on: February 16, 2009, 12:46:35 AM »
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Quote from: Tklimek
The camera profiles in Lightroom only affect color calibration in the pipeline prior to processing.....is that correct?

Profiles in Lightroom (and ACR) can affect color calibration both before processing, and after "basic exposure adjustments" (exposure, contrast, recovery, etc).

See Eric Chan from Adobe's comment here on the Adobe forums: http://www.adobeforums.com/webx?14@@.3bc03c04.59b77b09/0

If you want more gory detail of the processing pipeline and where DNG camera profiles fit in:

http://chromasoft.blogspot.com/2009/02/adobe-hue-twist.html
http://dcptool.sourceforge.net/Hue%20Twists.html

And no, camera profiles do not affect sharpening

Sandy
« Last Edit: February 16, 2009, 12:47:25 AM by sandymc » Logged
Scott Martin
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« Reply #10 on: February 16, 2009, 08:51:47 AM »
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Quote from: Schewe
Guy is on drugs...or simply a moron.
While I don't think that language is appropriate, I was thinking something similar. :-]

Quote from: Schewe
Adobe has decoded ISO white balance and now DNG color profiles but that's it.
Just had a good chat with Eric Chan. He confirms that they decode white balance and Highlight Tone Priority. The DNG profiles *are not* correlated with the camera's pictures styles. IE, if picture A is taken with "Faithful" and picture B is taken with "Landscape" ACR does not see these differences and does not apply the corresponding DNG profiles. The DNG profiles are made to simulate DPP's rendering but there is no automatic integration with the in-camera settings.

But to get back to the original poster's question; in camera settings like sharpness, contrast, etc have no effect upon the development of raw files via Adobe's software.

Quote from: Schewe
The is no parameter in Camera Raw that would equate to Canons sharpening settings...
Right, but that's exactly what Canon's camera reps are claiming to be the case. How weird. Beware people! No wonder there is so much confusion...
« Last Edit: February 16, 2009, 09:48:26 AM by Onsight » Logged

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