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Author Topic: 'Phase One Master Class' Workshop with Drew Gardner  (Read 15516 times)
francois
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« Reply #20 on: August 21, 2009, 09:42:57 AM »
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Quote from: michael
I received an email yesterday from someone who said that I should remove the current front page photograph because it was obscene.
I'm not surprised! Some people with twisted minds always manage to find obscenity, profanity, etc... everwhere. It's sad but I don't see this dangerous trend going down.
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Francois
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« Reply #21 on: August 21, 2009, 11:52:33 AM »
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Well i for one are looking forward to the workshop in Sweden on tuesday. If i could afford going to Paso Robles i would because i have found that no matter how good you are at something, there is usually something new you learn when watching a good photographer do their craft. And if anyone tries to claim that Drew is not a good photographer better be prepared to back that claim up with an astounding quality of work to show us

And Michael, if the reason they found it obscene was that the left girl was sitting down and showing a few cm of knickers, they definately should consider seeking help. Because the obscene mind is in the viewer in that case and one would shudder to think how that person would react walking on any beach in the world or even past a kindergarten.
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bcooter
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« Reply #22 on: August 21, 2009, 01:58:23 PM »
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Quote from: francois
d obscenity, profanity, etc...


I use to work with a retoucher that wouldn't allow profanity or retouch, nudes, cigarettes or alcohol.

I'd say shit Ralph, those are the only reasons I got into this business.

BC
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peegeenyc
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« Reply #23 on: August 21, 2009, 02:13:54 PM »
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the issue is far bigger than the political correctness gone awry - thats too easy a response.

for years photographers (usually male and middle aged) have made unthinking images of naked women a staple of their work.
95% of the time its because it sells a product, draws attention to their work, massages their ego, and has overt or covert prurient interest
just occasionally it is justified and/or worthwhile, but these are far outweighed by the above, and the unthinking dumbness with which it occurs is depressing.
it has been this way for decades, especially since the 1960's, and if the pendulum is now swinging back a bit over center, then quite frankly, we deserved it.

its time we got our brains in gear, stopped mindlessly using womens naked bodies as decorative objects in imagery without pause for good thought or reflection, and watertight intentions.
if you genuinely feel you have those, then go right ahead, but you are going to have to expect some critiques along the way.

and for what its worth, the o.p. image looks more like an out-take of a 1970's hair commercial to me!
« Last Edit: August 21, 2009, 02:17:42 PM by peegeenyc » Logged
lisa_r
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« Reply #24 on: August 21, 2009, 02:49:16 PM »
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I agree it's a tough crowd and I think it has something to do with the tight market we are in these days. It seems like some photographers feel like they have to be more competitive than ever before, and are thus more quick to shoot down someone else's work. I don' think it's necessary, nor does it advance anyone. Just my 2 cents.

And I like the image - the smoky lighting effect through the trees is quite nice IMO.
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TMARK
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« Reply #25 on: August 21, 2009, 03:40:50 PM »
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I'm not hateing on Drew Gardner, I like Drew's work, we met a few times, I dig him. I like naked women, always have.  Straight women like naked women, because naked women are attractive as things in themselves, in the Kantian sense.

I just think the Europa photo fails as an homage to the myth, and for the simple reason that I know the myth, I know the Rembrandt painting well, and I didn't see the connection with Drew's photo until the OP posted an explanation.  Maybe I was drinking and smoking, learing at naked women or otherwise impaired when I saw the OP.  The composition is also off to me, not in a good way.  Not to build tension like a dissonant note in an otherwise harmonious chord, but just bothersome.  Other people obviously have a different opinion, and I hope those people are SMOTE BY GOD.  I'm kidding, by the way.
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Voltman
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« Reply #26 on: August 21, 2009, 05:41:56 PM »
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Quote from: peegeenyc
...
.....and if the pendulum is now swinging back a bit over center, then quite frankly, we deserved it.
...

The core issue is that we're having to discuss the morality of nude photography versus the composition of the work or at least its technical merits.  Although I'm not a professional photographer I am a consumer of imagery and when the first reply to a benign post about a photo workshop turns into a spectacle about nudity it doesn't bode well for future of the freedom to express one's self and explore the bounds of creativity.  

"we deserved it" ??  Speak for yourself please - "I deserved it" would be more appropriate for your thinking....
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Voltman
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« Reply #27 on: August 21, 2009, 05:42:32 PM »
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duplicate post deleted....
« Last Edit: August 21, 2009, 05:43:15 PM by Voltman » Logged
feppe
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« Reply #28 on: August 21, 2009, 06:39:35 PM »
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Quote from: michael
I received an email yesterday from someone who said that I should remove the current front page photograph because it was obscene.

One has to wonder at some people's grasp of reality.

It's a sick society when something like that can be considered obscene.

I read from somewhere you need to get permission to photograph your own kids at a school football (soccer) game in the UK - you might accidentally take a picture of somebody else's kid.

*sigh*
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feppe
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« Reply #29 on: August 21, 2009, 06:56:34 PM »
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Quote from: Voltman
The core issue is that we're having to discuss the morality of nude photography versus the composition of the work or at least its technical merits.  Although I'm not a professional photographer I am a consumer of imagery and when the first reply to a benign post about a photo workshop turns into a spectacle about nudity it doesn't bode well for future of the freedom to express one's self and explore the bounds of creativity.  

"we deserved it" ??  Speak for yourself please - "I deserved it" would be more appropriate for your thinking....

Fortunately that unfortunate and lone kneejerk reaction was duly condemned by later posters, restoring some sanity to this crazy world.
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tmx3
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« Reply #30 on: August 21, 2009, 08:53:41 PM »
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I wouldnt say its obscene. I would say its tacky overdone rubbish though (imo).
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kevinwilson
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« Reply #31 on: August 22, 2009, 11:06:34 AM »
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Quote from: tmx3
I wouldnt say its obscene. I would say its tacky overdone rubbish though (imo).


I think it is a little sad that when someone tries to put a programme together, it is then ripped apart by some on the image he has selected.
Let Drew put on his seminar , judge him by the knowledge he passes out. Personally, I do not find the image offensive at all.

Kevin
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Christopher
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« Reply #32 on: August 22, 2009, 02:36:21 PM »
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Quote from: tmx3
I wouldnt say its obscene. I would say its tacky overdone rubbish though (imo).

How great are these comments by anonymous people like yourself. Why don't you show us some of your great images and artworks ?
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Imaginara
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« Reply #33 on: August 25, 2009, 01:05:01 PM »
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Well i went to the workshop in Gothenburg with Drew Gardner today and i would like to personally recommend anyone to go listen to him. He is a very engaging photographer and the seminar and workshop was well worth it.

If you (like me) happen to be one of the quiet ones who actually do like his Forest series (where the OP picture can be found) it is nice to meet Drew in person and get to pick his brain for what he is passionate about in photography. And if you think that the waterbuffalo picture the biggest bash to womanhood since the first man bashed his future wife over the head with a club, then you probably wont need to go after all.

The good thing with opinions after all is that all is entitled to their own. Sometimes however it would be nice if some people remembered that the rest of us are entitled NOT to hear that opinion aswell

Peace out, now im going to go shoot something.... (with a camera)

/Henrik
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pixjohn
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« Reply #34 on: August 25, 2009, 04:09:23 PM »
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I would personally like to thank Drew for offending me. I would enjoy to see additional offending photographs of this caliber. Its a great image. As stated before, if your so down on his work lets see what you have done. If your so offended by this get a life.

From one of my favorite photographers Peter Joel Witkin

P.S. Please make my day and be offended.


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asf
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« Reply #35 on: August 25, 2009, 06:34:09 PM »
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Can someone explain the logic behind this statement - "if your so down on his work lets see what you have done" - or similar ones echoed above?

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TMARK
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« Reply #36 on: August 25, 2009, 09:34:21 PM »
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Quote from: asf
Can someone explain the logic behind this statement - "if your so down on his work lets see what you have done" - or similar ones echoed above?

Its a ploy to change the subject, is all.  Ad hominim, I believe its called.  Puts someone on the defense and changes the the debate to something off topic, like the debate in the US over health care and "death panels".
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TMARK
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« Reply #37 on: August 25, 2009, 09:36:27 PM »
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Quote from: Imaginara
Well i went to the workshop in Gothenburg with Drew Gardner today and i would like to personally recommend anyone to go listen to him. He is a very engaging photographer and the seminar and workshop was well worth it.

If you (like me) happen to be one of the quiet ones who actually do like his Forest series (where the OP picture can be found) it is nice to meet Drew in person and get to pick his brain for what he is passionate about in photography. And if you think that the waterbuffalo picture the biggest bash to womanhood since the first man bashed his future wife over the head with a club, then you probably wont need to go after all.

The good thing with opinions after all is that all is entitled to their own. Sometimes however it would be nice if some people remembered that the rest of us are entitled NOT to hear that opinion aswell

Peace out, now im going to go shoot something.... (with a camera)

/Henrik

Who did Drew offend?  One prissy dude?  No one else seems to care, except for the people outraged that some gentle flower got all 1995 up in this joint.
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lisa_r
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« Reply #38 on: August 26, 2009, 08:03:29 PM »
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Quote from: TMARK
Its a ploy to change the subject, is all.  Ad hominim, I believe its called.  Puts someone on the defense and changes the the debate to something off topic, like the debate in the US over health care and "death panels".

You have to admit, though, that it can be odd on any forum when you have unknown people throwing rocks from behind the bushes. It's also interesting how often you find that it's the least experienced photographers who make the harshest/boldest remarks. (I'm not just talking about LL - this seems to happen all across the web.) I don't know anything about tmx3 but it's nice to know something about who are speaking with, no?
« Last Edit: August 26, 2009, 08:07:55 PM by lisa_r » Logged
Alex MacPherson
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« Reply #39 on: August 26, 2009, 08:45:38 PM »
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Quote from: TMARK
Who did Drew offend?  One prissy dude?  No one else seems to care, except for the people outraged that some gentle flower got all 1995 up in this joint.

Hilarious!  
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Alex MacPherson

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