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Author Topic: Dude...  (Read 10750 times)
yaya
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« Reply #40 on: May 29, 2010, 09:59:35 AM »
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Quote from: MattLaver
This has probably already been mentioned... but if that Leaf App was able to act as a viewing app for leaf mos files using the bluetooth connection directly to the DB rather than through a tethered laptop network that would be huge for me. Strap or mount the iPad to the tripod and off you go. Great for location architecture shooting where tethering is a pain but a big view would be very useful.

Matt

Hi Matt,

Yes that would have been cool and it has been discussed here and elsewhere in the past on more than one occasion:-)

The Bluetooth on the iPhone/ iPad is rather "primitive" and geared towards use of headsets and handsfree devices.

But the main thing is that the Mac does all the processing and that includes colour management, noise reduction, sharpening etc. which makes the viewing experience far, far better than what the digital back will ever be able to do, processing wise.

You can try it today: zoom into 100% on the Aptus and then do the same on the iPhone

Yair
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bcooter
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« Reply #41 on: May 29, 2010, 12:51:42 PM »
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Quote from: CBarrett
Oh my God. You guys are like a bunch of frightened villagers huddling around  the Space Alien with your pitchforks!

Here is a great new bit of technology. If it can improve your process do it. If not... Fuhgidaboudit.

Move on and go make pictures.

CB


Man there are some touchy people here.

CB, if this gizmo works for you good, great, amazing, tremendous, but you dig geek stuff and personally I find a lot of it just gets in the way.  

Now without a doubt I commend these small companies like Phase and Leaf trying to bring us more usability and it's a hell of a feat considering Canon's wi-fi is still a failure in progress.

I also appreciate Doug and Yair taking the shit they do and still pushing forward with answers.  Me, I'd bolt from here so fast the screen door would still be flappin' in the wind as I saddled up.

In fact Yair and Doug both e-mailed me with offers to help.  They're a hell of a lot  nicer and smarter people than me.

Still, back to you comments, CB, you do something way different than a lot of other photographers do and until you pay that $1,000 an hour per chair or desk to sit there while you try to connect some gizmo I think it would be nice to recognize that all of us have different clients, pressures, and complexities in our specialties.  To you a sick grip truck is a cute Mercedes SUV, to me it's a 20' box end, has a roll up back door and a harry armed guy named Big Jud to roll that stuff out.

As far as taking pictures, OK thanks, I think we all get that and maybe that's the point, because when we spend our studios' resources working out devices we could spend more time on the make a photo process.

Few of us are luddites, crap I have 10 Macs in our studios and a combined 24 raid 5 drives, so technology doesn't make me want to grab the pitchfork.

Silly ass comments do.  (And this isn't only directed at you.  I make a lot of silly ass comments myself).

I also  have two  I-pads on order though  I doubt if I'll use them on set for any form of tethering, but I've been wrong before so we'll see.

BC
« Last Edit: May 29, 2010, 12:53:35 PM by bcooter » Logged
Frank Doorhof
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« Reply #42 on: May 29, 2010, 01:36:46 PM »
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I strongly believe the iPad will be a game changer.
I'm DYING to see the Leaf application on the iPad, I already loved it on the iPhone but on location on the iPad it will rock.

Otherwise indeed as second monitor is a great option.
Everything that can make our live easier and workflow faster is a good thing.

At the moment I use the iPad a lot for mails and surfing, gives me more time to do things I really like instead of being stuck at a workstation.

So we'll see what the future brings, but it will be fun and handy.
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yaya
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« Reply #43 on: May 29, 2010, 01:57:00 PM »
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Quote from: Frank Doorhof
I strongly believe the iPad will be a game changer.
I'm DYING to see the Leaf application on the iPad, I already loved it on the iPhone but on location on the iPad it will rock.

Otherwise indeed as second monitor is a great option.
Everything that can make our live easier and workflow faster is a good thing.

At the moment I use the iPad a lot for mails and surfing, gives me more time to do things I really like instead of being stuck at a workstation.

So we'll see what the future brings, but it will be fun and handy.

Frank you can already run version 1.0 on your iPad in X2 mode

Yair
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fredjeang
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« Reply #44 on: May 29, 2010, 03:24:09 PM »
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I think that the problem of photographic gear is very specific, specially since digital.
I do not know any professional activity that depends so much on unprofessional machinery involved on the chain in order to make the all circus
working (un)properly.

Go to see a Formula One Gran Prix, every single tool from a screwdriver to a computer is just made for doing what it's been built for with maximum
performance and reliability. They do not run Macs neither Pcs but Unix platforms. These guys are not kidding, there is no room for averageness. Things simply works, point.

The cine industry would not accept the hassle and compromises we are obliged to deal with in photography. It simply would not happen.
All the chain works to professional standart and has to.

As photography navigates between a big consumer industry and a small niche pro market, the tools are indeed reflecting this situation.
It makes its charm, it's romantic, but also it is the open door to many hassles.

In no other craft that I know, I've heard so much complains about the systems and the gears for a reason or another, in all possible languages.

Back to I.pad, it is first a fancy, promissing, cool consumer object (underpowered, and frankly, the shiny screen...) that can be included into a professional environment but with some compromises. It has never been built for the photographer. The laptops we are using are simple consumer computers that can be found in les Galleries Lafayette. Let's call it Mac, Pc, whatever.
They are all underpowered, and made to suit an average user that can be sometimes a photographer. They are cool and attractive until a blast of tethered 30MP raw files reveals the engine behind the mask.

Brands are talking advantage of these unperfections because we are tempted to buy gadgets, more softwares etc...
It is very interesting for them to leave us with unfinished or unperfect products. Then they can also sell the remedies.

I can't beleive that we are still talking about lcd, interface issues and usability with cameras. They know perfectly how to make perfect cameras but it just will not happen because it is not a market made for the pro, it is made for the consupro.
Cinema gear have no consumer market but just pro, and there is a big difference: Hassle free and cost.

So, wired situations are going to continue and MacGyver solutions are going to keep going exactly like yesterday.
On that comic play, the photographer will keep going asking: how could I solve this or that, spend half of his life in internet to find a solution while the only thing he/she really cares about (IMO) is the shooting and the artistic aspect.

Yes K.C, you are right: more is more profitable.
« Last Edit: May 29, 2010, 07:57:52 PM by fredjeang » Logged
Frank Doorhof
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« Reply #45 on: May 29, 2010, 03:59:42 PM »
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Could be however, and I speak for myself here, the iPad is used for me to do mail, read, watch a movie when traveling etc. However in the future it will replace my home theater remote, it will be used for my photography but all just to make things easier, I think it Wil never take away from the core business and that is creating the image.
Or at least it should not, it's all just tools that you can use for what you need it for it should not be used I think as gadgets. Have a pile of those somewhere

@yaya,
Will test that soon.
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Williamson Images
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« Reply #46 on: May 29, 2010, 11:39:24 PM »
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This would be an ideal use to help those of us in the field.  Probably more of these users that would run to the bank for this application than as a second or third portable viewer inside a studio.

My 2cents.  Eliminating the tether and a desktop is the dream.

Robb    


Quote from: MattLaver
This has probably already been mentioned... but if that Leaf App was able to act as a viewing app for leaf mos files using the bluetooth connection directly to the DB rather than through a tethered laptop network that would be huge for me. Strap or mount the iPad to the tripod and off you go. Great for location architecture shooting where tethering is a pain but a big view would be very useful.

Matt
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eronald
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« Reply #47 on: May 30, 2010, 12:33:20 AM »
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Quote from: Williamson Images
This would be an ideal use to help those of us in the field.  Probably more of these users that would run to the bank for this application than as a second or third portable viewer inside a studio.

My 2cents.  Eliminating the tether and a desktop is the dream.

Robb

Bluetooth was a big selling point (sorry, promise) of the P+ backs.

Edmund
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Frank Doorhof
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« Reply #48 on: May 30, 2010, 01:45:23 AM »
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It would have to be tumbnails than, transporting files in the 75-100+ range over Bluetooth would mean that you can shoot two images and wait for a long time to see them.
Even with normal wifi I found shooting with the normal 5d in raw to be too slow to really work in a normal fashion setup.
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eronald
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« Reply #49 on: May 30, 2010, 04:31:24 AM »
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Quote from: Frank Doorhof
It would have to be tumbnails than, transporting files in the 75-100+ range over Bluetooth would mean that you can shoot two images and wait for a long time to see them.
Even with normal wifi I found shooting with the normal 5d in raw to be too slow to really work in a normal fashion setup.

I still would have found some form of Bluetooth link useful. Essentially Phase promised a hardware feature, I think it's actually there maybe,  then killed it.


Everybody who needs  a preview isn't necessarily shooting fashion.

Also, once you have some hardware going, you can write software around it eg. have the camera just send one small area, or a histogram of that area, or an indication of  overexposed zones etc.


Edmund
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Frank Doorhof
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« Reply #50 on: May 30, 2010, 10:01:26 AM »
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Quote from: eronald
I still would have found some form of Bluetooth link useful. Essentially Phase promised a hardware feature, I think it's actually there maybe,  then killed it.


Everybody who needs  a preview isn't necessarily shooting fashion.

Also, once you have some hardware going, you can write software around it eg. have the camera just send one small area, or a histogram of that area, or an indication of  overexposed zones etc.


Edmund
You're right about fashion and that some people won't mind waiting for a minute or two before the preview comes in.
I was just thinking out loud.
For me wifi was way too slow on the 5d for some others it might be good enough of course.

I would love to see the iPad or iPhone to be used without the need for a laptop, let's say indeed a compressed jpeg in half res would be enough to preview in most cases.
Main reason for me is focus check.
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fredjeang
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« Reply #51 on: May 30, 2010, 10:23:32 AM »
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Quote from: Frank Doorhof
You're right about fashion and that some people won't mind waiting for a minute or two before the preview comes in.
I was just thinking out loud.
For me wifi was way too slow on the 5d for some others it might be good enough of course.

I would love to see the iPad or iPhone to be used without the need for a laptop, let's say indeed a compressed jpeg in half res would be enough to preview in most cases.
Main reason for me is focus check.
Yes Frank,
I think that this would be the ideal and was the message sent in this thread.
In that case I will see the iPad as a great improvement.
Is it going to be a "message in a bottle"?

Cheers.
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macz5024
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« Reply #52 on: May 30, 2010, 03:15:18 PM »
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Quote from: fredjeang
Is it going to be a "message in a bottle"?

Cheers.

Just to add something to the bottle:

Just remember the good old times when shooting 4x5 or 8x10 inches - in front of a huge screen, really being able to design your image...

It would be great to have a proper life view from the back - no laptop in between - and an iPad which would help the poor guys (including me)
shooting with a DB on an Alpa or a similar camera in real time and not seeing what they capture until they see the image on screen of their laptop after half of an eternity.

So hopefully we will some improvements from Phase One for Photokina - at least we should be able to expect something out of the Phase back after the merge of Phase and Leaf - and Leaf seems to be rather close...

Markus
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Frank Doorhof
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« Reply #53 on: May 30, 2010, 04:02:33 PM »
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Leaf already had a great iPhone app but you need a pc/Mac in between.
With the limited Bluetooth options of the iPad I don't think we will see something like we want, but we can all hope.
A digital with wifi, now that would be a solution, route the raws through FireWire or on the card and send a preview file to wifi to the iPad or iPhone. Now that would seriously push me to an upgrade.
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fredjeang
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« Reply #54 on: May 30, 2010, 04:18:29 PM »
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Quote from: Frank Doorhof
Leaf already had a great iPhone app but you need a pc/Mac in between.
With the limited Bluetooth options of the iPad I don't think we will see something like we want, but we can all hope.
A digital with wifi, now that would be a solution, route the raws through FireWire or on the card and send a preview file to wifi to the iPad or iPhone. Now that would seriously push me to an upgrade.
Yes.
What I do not get totally, is why would we need specially the iPad to acheive this? Why not an "home-made" solution from the photography industry and specially thought for the photographer?
With just the feature that are needed but perfectly implemented.
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Frank Doorhof
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« Reply #55 on: May 30, 2010, 04:53:03 PM »
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Quote from: fredjeang
Yes.
What I do not get totally, is why would we need specially the iPad to acheive this? Why not an "home-made" solution from the photography industry and specially thought for the photographer?
With just the feature that are needed but perfectly implemented.
I'm afraid that if leaf or phase one would release something like that it would be much more expensive. Plus I almost always have the ipad or iphone with me.
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« Reply #56 on: May 30, 2010, 05:46:33 PM »
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Quote from: fredjeang
Yes.
What I do not get totally, is why would we need specially the iPad to acheive this? Why not an "home-made" solution from the photography industry and specially thought for the photographer?
With just the feature that are needed but perfectly implemented.

Frank is right. Specialized hardware solutions (read: small production runs) from the photography industry are by necessity more expensive than writing software for existing non-specialized hardware with much larger market. Not to mention that anything labeled "photography" demands a premium over the generic stuff, from (gaffers) tape to high-def monitors.

Finally, there already are solutions from the industry: I believe onOne Software has an iPhone app which is to be released for iPad in the near future. Not sure about its feature set, though.

As soon as Android and Symbian and WebOS tablets come out we'll have competition to iPad, which will only make the customers (us) better off. Hell, they might even put a friggin USB port on one of those things or allow calibrating the screen or running more than one app at a time. And they'll certainly allow running non-approved apps.

Unless iPads and its ilk turn out to be the netbooks of 2010 and we (well, you) will be re-buying the next Big Thing again in 2011  
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Kumar
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« Reply #57 on: May 30, 2010, 06:26:42 PM »
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Quote from: fredjeang
It is very profitable for them to leave us with unfinished or unperfect products. Then they can also sell the remedies.

Bingo!

Kumar
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