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Author Topic: C1 USERS  (Read 24671 times)
Phil Indeblanc
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« Reply #20 on: July 13, 2010, 06:59:43 PM »
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Quote from: Christopher
I don't Need it faster, just stable. . . . . . .


Glad you mention Chris...It took almost 4 minutes to get 270 thumbnails to show up. then I sorted them by name and that was a snap.  To get one of the 22mp images in focus it took 10 seconds.

I have Win7 8GB ram with OS onRaptor, Page file on 2 Raid0 SSD 64gb drives sharing scratch for PS, and the files are on a Intel 1000gb network.

to me...thats slow...any of thing give someone a idea vs their speed?
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Nill Toulme
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« Reply #21 on: July 13, 2010, 07:52:03 PM »
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Something is wrong with y'all's setups.  v5.1 is very snappy for me, and I'm running it on a four-year-old dual Athlon with 4GB RAM under Win XP2 32-bit.  It's faster than v3.7.x and, so far, considerably more stable.  In fact, come to think of it, I'm not entirely sure that it's (knock wood) crashed or hung even once since I installed it.

Nill
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Phil Indeblanc
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« Reply #22 on: July 13, 2010, 08:05:50 PM »
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Quote from: Nill Toulme
Something is wrong with y'all's setups.  v5.1 is very snappy for me, and I'm running it on a four-year-old dual Athlon with 4GB RAM under Win XP2 32-bit.  It's faster than v3.7.x and, so far, considerably more stable.  In fact, come to think of it, I'm not entirely sure that it's (knock wood) crashed or hung even once since I installed it.

Nill



I have not compared it to 3.7x, And I have yet to have it crash on me since the latest update.  I am running 64bit, as I have 8gb ram. (plan to up this to 12gb or more.

Maybe you can do a ballpark est like I did with the time it takes a file to focus, and maybe loading a number files in the browser...meaning select folder from library and let it load. images/min/sec

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Christopher
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« Reply #23 on: July 14, 2010, 03:35:02 AM »
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Quote from: Phil Indeblanc
I have not compared it to 3.7x, And I have yet to have it crash on me since the latest update.  I am running 64bit, as I have 8gb ram. (plan to up this to 12gb or more.

Maybe you can do a ballpark est like I did with the time it takes a file to focus, and maybe loading a number files in the browser...meaning select folder from library and let it load. images/min/sec

Well I'm still testing a bit, but as far as I can tell C1 on windows gets more and more unstable, the better the computer gets. It runs fine on old computers.
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Phil Indeblanc
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« Reply #24 on: July 14, 2010, 03:59:35 AM »
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Quote from: Christopher
Well I'm still testing a bit, but as far as I can tell C1 on windows gets more and more unstable, the better the computer gets. It runs fine on old computers.



I have my share of sw issues with ACDsee Pro crash, Bridge used to until I Xed it out.... but for basic processing that I do using many of the tool sets in C1 5.1.2 using dual screen/2x 30" screens, Win7 64bit on i7 3.5ghz quad, and 8gb ram, on Asus P7P55D Pro board, with SSD drives for swap/scratch, and a Raptor for OS, with files on a server, I have not had any crashes.  Can it be the file types you are working on?  I think it is slow...but it is stable for me, and I would say my system is rather new.  It can also be a mix of other SW you may have loaded on your system?   I keep my editing machine clean, with just the needed sw.  I would love to hear some numbers for file loading and focus when you do some testing Chris.
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Christopher
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« Reply #25 on: July 14, 2010, 04:18:15 AM »
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Quote from: Phil Indeblanc
I have my share of sw issues with ACDsee Pro crash, Bridge used to until I Xed it out.... but for basic processing that I do using many of the tool sets in C1 5.1.2 using dual screen/2x 30" screens, Win7 64bit on i7 3.5ghz quad, and 8gb ram, on Asus P7P55D Pro board, with SSD drives for swap/scratch, and a Raptor for OS, with files on a server, I have not had any crashes.  Can it be the file types you are working on?  I think it is slow...but it is stable for me, and I would say my system is rather new.  It can also be a mix of other SW you may have loaded on your system?   I keep my editing machine clean, with just the needed sw.  I would love to hear some numbers for file loading and focus when you do some testing Chris.

Well I'm more talking about:

Win 7 64 bit
Dual Xeon Hexacores running at 3.2 Ghz
48Gb of RAM
and so on

The funny thing is C1 runs fine on my laptop which just has a Intel i7 and 8Gb of RAM

In addition, C1 is the ONLY program, which is so unstable. LR, PS, Maya, and many more programs run 100% stable.

Well it is as unstable on brand new OS with only C1 installed I just did that test yesterday for Phase one.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2010, 04:29:48 AM by Christopher » Logged

Doug Peterson
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« Reply #26 on: July 14, 2010, 08:26:15 AM »
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Well I'm still testing a bit, but as far as I can tell C1 on windows gets more and more unstable, the better the computer gets. It runs fine on old computers.

Yes I'm not surprised. Though your definition of "old" computers would probably make most forum users giggle a bit.

Any bleeding edge setup is prone to find problems here and there. Having 48gb of ram on a dual Server-class 12-core tower is pretty bleeding edge. Add to it the complications of the Windows world where there are literally millions of combinations of equipment/OS-versions.

Don't get me wrong; it doesn't excuse the fact that C1 is not stable on your system, but it may well explain it.

Especially given that we have many high-end (but not bleeding-edge) Windows users that are finding stability to be excellent (see other replies to this thread, several of whom are our direct customers).

Hopefully stability will be improved for exotic setups like yours. If you haven't yet done so I would recommend submitting a support case at phaseone.com and following their steps to submit a system-report so they have your hardware/OS configuration that is problematic. I doubt they have a large number of data points for machines with 48gb of ram.

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Christopher
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« Reply #27 on: July 14, 2010, 08:37:44 AM »
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Quote from: dougpetersonci
Yes I'm not surprised. Though your definition of "old" computers would probably make most forum users giggle a bit.

Any bleeding edge setup is prone to find problems here and there. Having 48gb of ram on a dual Server-class 12-core tower is pretty bleeding edge. Add to it the complications of the Windows world where there are literally millions of combinations of equipment/OS-versions.

Don't get me wrong; it doesn't excuse the fact that C1 is not stable on your system, but it may well explain it.

Especially given that we have many high-end (but not bleeding-edge) Windows users that are finding stability to be excellent (see other replies to this thread, several of whom are our direct customers).

Hopefully stability will be improved for exotic setups like yours. If you haven't yet done so I would recommend submitting a support case at phaseone.com and following their steps to submit a system-report so they have your hardware/OS configuration that is problematic. I doubt they have a large number of data points for machines with 48gb of ram.

[font="Arial"]Doug Peterson

Don't worry I am already talking to Phase one and they have all my data and a collection of videos showing every problem and crash. I work with a lot of different software (Audio, 3D, Video and Photo Software) and I can say that Capture One is the ONLY program which can't deal with a bleeding edge system under windows. It also so far is not very hard for me to replicate the problem on a friends computer running only one CPU but again 24GB of RAM. So it certainly has to do something with bad memory management. I could go into a lot more detail, about stuff I found out, but it doesn't really belong here and it is enough that the Phase One support team has access to it. You know Doug that we already talked about the problem and I still don't really blame Phase One, it certainly is a exotic system, but it's also a fact that Capture One is the only program havening troubles, dealing with it.

Oh and did I really write old computer ? If I did so, I'm certainly sorry, because I don't think a i7 or similar is old, just not a real "modern" windows workstation.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2010, 08:39:29 AM by Christopher » Logged

craigwashburn
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« Reply #28 on: July 14, 2010, 10:55:27 AM »
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Quote from: Christopher
Don't worry I am already talking to Phase one and they have all my data and a collection of videos showing every problem and crash. I work with a lot of different software (Audio, 3D, Video and Photo Software) and I can say that Capture One is the ONLY program which can't deal with a bleeding edge system under windows. It also so far is not very hard for me to replicate the problem on a friends computer running only one CPU but again 24GB of RAM. So it certainly has to do something with bad memory management. I could go into a lot more detail, about stuff I found out, but it doesn't really belong here and it is enough that the Phase One support team has access to it. You know Doug that we already talked about the problem and I still don't really blame Phase One, it certainly is a exotic system, but it's also a fact that Capture One is the only program havening troubles, dealing with it.

Oh and did I really write old computer ? If I did so, I'm certainly sorry, because I don't think a i7 or similar is old, just not a real "modern" windows workstation.


I wonder if its partly multi-threading issues.  The problems I have (unpredictable loss of capture settings) feel like threading problems in that it's very hard to reproduce on demand, even though it happens frequently.  Different hardware configurations would react differently too, making debugging a chore and a half.  

Though minor, it is notable that the "Time Remaining" when processing images is completely wrong on my quad-core machine.  It usually takes half the time it says it will - you can see the clock actually run fast.  On my dual-core, the timer is spot on.
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Phil Indeblanc
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« Reply #29 on: July 14, 2010, 02:10:41 PM »
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Quote from: Christopher
Oh and did I really write old computer ? If I did so, I'm certainly sorry, because I don't think a i7 or similar is old, just not a real "modern" windows workstation.


The fact that it takes me almost 4 minutes to see 270 files in the browser, and 10 seconds for each image to come into focus tells me that Chris is on the right track...
kinda:-)

I am sure that your Hexacores and ram are there mostly for Maya or other 3D apps... bwith that setup C1 can surely FLY and only limit with read/write pipeline speeds....And thats what I was wondering...Since there is a overkill factor to image processing with Chris' system, this might help me to know...Yes more RAM would help me....or Yes, a Xeon chip or 2 will help by so much, etc.  Ok sure you can also Raid0 your files, but its a little hard to do when you have 5-7TB of data AND you need to back that up.

You can look at the lastest i7 as bleeding edge also. but the class from consumer/prosumer/business class chips to enterprise server/3D workstation chips is just different.

If the latter is what it takes to run c1 smooth/snappy...then maybe I have some reconsidering to do, and every other c1 user with dMF files that don't like waiting 10 seconds for each picture to focus, or any time you make a slight adjustment.....or 4 or more minutes when changing folders for thiumb files to load in the broswers.

Chris, when you have it running a bit can you do those couple tests before it crashes?
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Christopher
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« Reply #30 on: July 14, 2010, 05:01:34 PM »
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Quote from: Phil Indeblanc
The fact that it takes me almost 4 minutes to see 270 files in the browser, and 10 seconds for each image to come into focus tells me that Chris is on the right track...
kinda:-)

I am sure that your Hexacores and ram are there mostly for Maya or other 3D apps... bwith that setup C1 can surely FLY and only limit with read/write pipeline speeds....And thats what I was wondering...Since there is a overkill factor to image processing with Chris' system, this might help me to know...Yes more RAM would help me....or Yes, a Xeon chip or 2 will help by so much, etc.  Ok sure you can also Raid0 your files, but its a little hard to do when you have 5-7TB of data AND you need to back that up.

You can look at the lastest i7 as bleeding edge also. but the class from consumer/prosumer/business class chips to enterprise server/3D workstation chips is just different.

If the latter is what it takes to run c1 smooth/snappy...then maybe I have some reconsidering to do, and every other c1 user with dMF files that don't like waiting 10 seconds for each picture to focus, or any time you make a slight adjustment.....or 4 or more minutes when changing folders for thiumb files to load in the broswers.

Chris, when you have it running a bit can you do those couple tests before it crashes?

Well I can tell you that it takes around 5-10 seconds for 50 P65 raws to load and that it takes around 1-3 seconds to get a P65 raw file in 100% focus. It's fast and great, but believe me it does not help, if the program decides to quite after 10 clicks ;-)
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Phil Indeblanc
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« Reply #31 on: July 14, 2010, 05:38:50 PM »
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Quote from: Christopher
Well I can tell you that it takes around 5-10 seconds for 50 P65 raws to load and that it takes around 1-3 seconds to get a P65 raw file in 100% focus. It's fast and great, but believe me it does not help, if the program decides to quite after 10 clicks ;-)

That is FAST.

What drives is the data being read from?

I hope they fix this for you....and those of us that itch to get such a system.   I am guessing each chip is about $800 to 1100 for the xeons? and then if you have 4gb sticks x 12  wow...12 slots?  or are these 8gb sticks(didnt know they have any?)   is this is a Supermicron board? or?
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Christopher
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« Reply #32 on: July 14, 2010, 06:49:35 PM »
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Quote from: Phil Indeblanc
That is FAST.

What drives is the data being read from?

I hope they fix this for you....and those of us that itch to get such a system.   I am guessing each chip is about $800 to 1100 for the xeons? and then if you have 4gb sticks x 12  wow...12 slots?  or are these 8gb sticks(didnt know they have any?)   is this is a Supermicron board? or?


It's a Asus Board, has 12 memory slots. and 4GB each, however you CAN get 8Gb in each so in total you can get 96Gb of Ram.

The files are being read from a RAID5 array. ( 5 x 2TB drives ) C1 itself runs on a SSD.
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Phil Indeblanc
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« Reply #33 on: July 14, 2010, 07:14:37 PM »
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Quote from: Christopher
It's a Asus Board, has 12 memory slots. and 4GB each, however you CAN get 8Gb in each so in total you can get 96Gb of Ram.

The files are being read from a RAID5 array. ( 5 x 2TB drives ) C1 itself runs on a SSD.

Which SSD are you using?


I too had my OS and scratch&swap on SSD and recently switched back to raptor for the OS. I have programs on same drive as OS.
I had the Patriot Torq 64 and a 128gb. Now have 2 64gb SSD as scratch and OS page file.... while OS is on Raptor. I had it dump/wipe on me a few times, so I switched OS to Raptor.  My files are on 3 RAID5mirror 4x1TB ...using 3 Intel EMC SS4200E boxes.


I remember you and I chatted when I was building my system :-)
« Last Edit: July 14, 2010, 07:15:04 PM by Phil Indeblanc » Logged

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Jack Varney
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« Reply #34 on: July 16, 2010, 08:13:18 PM »
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Regarding Christopher's stability problem I am running an i7 intel 2.65mHz processors, Vista 64 bit with 12 GB RAM and no problems with C1 5.1.2. To test I loaded 595 P45+ files in eight minutes and 15 seconds.

Have you checked your event viewer for possible issues?
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Jack Varney
Phil Indeblanc
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« Reply #35 on: July 16, 2010, 10:48:23 PM »
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Quote from: Jack Varney
Regarding Christopher's stability problem I am running an i7 intel 2.65mHz processors, Vista 64 bit with 12 GB RAM and no problems with C1 5.1.2. To test I loaded 595 P45+ files in eight minutes and 15 seconds.

Have you checked your event viewer for possible issues?



Wow...I surely do have a bottleneck someplace.

I have a like setup, (3.5 i7 Quad with Raptor OS) 8GB ram reading P25 files. I am also reading it from a Intel network server 2.6ghz 2gb ram SS4200E Intel with WD Caviar black drives.

What hard drive are you using?

I also wonder if C1 uses some type of scratch/swap file/disk of its own, or is it the Windows page file?  I have the Win7-64bit page file on 2x 64gb RAID0 SSD drives.
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Persio
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« Reply #36 on: July 18, 2010, 12:05:38 PM »
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I have been using C1 since the early version 3.1 and I am now running the latest version 5.1.2.
I am running C1 (not the PRO version) under Win 7 x64 4GB with a Quad-Core Pentium processor and both the OS and C1 run on a WD Veloci/Raptor @ 10,000rpm.
C1 is very stable and very fast processing Canon RAW files.

1) I wish the slider button were a bit larger and less sensitive to allow for more precise adjustments.
2) A second request would be for the Copy Adjustments button to turn orange when active. It seems to me that this is true in the PRO version but not implemented the the non-PRO version.

Regards,
Persio.
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« Reply #37 on: August 14, 2010, 03:11:18 PM »
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I didn't see any performance differences rendering on quad vs dual core, similar mhz and cache parameters.  Memory same on both systems.  Although I think multi-tasking and doing other things while rendering in the background would be way faster on the quad core.
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Phil Indeblanc
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« Reply #38 on: August 14, 2010, 04:17:20 PM »
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I just looked over my connections and realized that some of the cables were Cat 5 rather than 5-E or 6.

OH BOY....EVERYTHING IS MUCH BETTER! Its been a few months with my new system and I was thinking its the server...now I get MIN 59mb/s to 80mb/sec transfer rates...YA!...saving is much faster, I am super happy!

Sometimes its easy to forget your old setup and a simple thing like a wire or 2 can toss a wrench in the system.

Chris, I would think you have your monster machine setup to handle 3D rendering.  Why not build a system for your still image processing and leave the apps that handle Xenon and 30+ram to 3D, while having a system thats half or a 1/4 that run still images?

Maybe Phase can give you a limitation guideline and max around that?  I don't even bother with email or internet or Office apps on my workstation. It is only for still image process editing.  they are in the same studio space yet, I have a dedicated capture computer also.  With systems so cheap, its better to dedicate the work load.  You would likely save on electricity at the least :-)  Just a thought in case its a option.
« Last Edit: August 14, 2010, 10:18:45 PM by Phil Indeblanc » Logged

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Christopher
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« Reply #39 on: August 15, 2010, 02:32:05 AM »
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Well i can live you all a some gerat News. After Talking to the Phase Support and giving them Access to all of my Information they Provider me with a New beta which was developed to handle Memory Terrors under Windows 7 in 64 Bit Better.

I can say they did a Perfect Job. So far after two weeks not a Single crash. I can also say that the system is MUCH faster than my quad core with 8gb of ram. It's now amazing to be able to actually work at many things at thebsame time and don't get any hangups at all.

I can only say fantastic work by phase one. 
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