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Author Topic: PC video editing software for 5D2  (Read 7628 times)
NigelC
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« on: July 21, 2010, 03:08:52 AM »
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Just acquired 5D2 as stills DSLR, however would like to try video since its there - most likely to use for live performance at music festival. I know minus zero about getting video out of camera onto something I can view on TV or computer and don't really want to get into technicalities. What is best simple low cost solution for editing on PC?
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Rhossydd
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« Reply #1 on: July 25, 2010, 11:51:05 AM »
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Quote from: NigelC
most likely to use for live performance at music festival.
The limitation of only shooting 12mins max at a time makes the 5DII not the best camera for this. Plus getting decent sound is a whole separate art in it's own right.
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don't really want to get into technicalities.
To get any decent sort result you will NEED to involve yourself with the technicalities. DSLRs are definitely not point 'n shoot video cameras and editing any sort of HD footage swiftly becomes difficult due to the huge amount of data involved.
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What is best simple low cost solution for editing on PC?
All the cheap editing packages need careful set up to work reliably and tend to be unreliable and are crash prone compared to stills software. Just cehck out the user reviews on Amazon for that.
Sony Vegas movie studio or Pinnacle 14 are recommended as budget choices, but you'll soon find out why anything less than Premiere Pro CS5 is a pain to use.
Go and trawl through http://www.cinema5d.com forums on PC editing to see what you're up against.
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BobFisher
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« Reply #2 on: July 26, 2010, 07:44:53 AM »
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Wow, that's pretty discouraging.  Now I'm sorry I ever got into video.  

The audio issues aren't much different from the small, compact camcorders which also have terrible audio quality with the built in mic.

If you want a true budget solution, check out Virtualdub.  It's free.  Yes, free.  There are a ton of plugins available (also free) for it which make it pretty decent.  It only accepts AVI format.  Your Canon records in MOV format.  You can convert using AVS Video Converter (also free, I believe).  

Otherwise, download the trial version of Sony Vegas Platinum or Adobe Premiere (not Pro).  Both are good and can give you a handle on what video editing is about.  

Video editing is completely unlike still editing.  It's a whole different learning curve and what you know about still editing won't be a lot of use in editing video from a workflow standpoint.  From the standpoint of some of the tools like sharpening, colour correction, etc. that knowledge will carry over but will be implemented differently.
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Rhossydd
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« Reply #3 on: July 29, 2010, 03:56:13 AM »
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Quote from: BobFisher
Wow, that's pretty discouraging.
It would be dishonest to suggest that HD video editing is in any way a trivial task. With good software and hardware it can be done reliably, but to get any sort of decent results one needs to engage with the technicalities to a degree. As soon as you try to work with hardware that isn't sufficiently capable or use use cheap software you'll need even more experience to get things working as you might expect.
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If you want a true budget solution, check out Virtualdub.  It's free.  Yes, free.
To quote from their web site http://www.virtualdub.org/features.html :- "VirtualDub isn't an editor application; it's a pre- and post-processor that works as a valuable companion to one:"
So it may be free, but it's not much use for actual editing.
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BobFisher
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« Reply #4 on: July 29, 2010, 10:59:22 AM »
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I never said HD video editing was a simple task.  Or SD video editing for that matter.  Video editing is an entirely different process from still editing.  I just found your statement a little over the top and that it could discourage someone from even trying in the first place.

As far as Virtualdub goes, it can do a fair bit.  There are a variety of filters available to work with it that give it enhanced functionality.  You can trim and crop, adjust colour, sharpen, etc.  You can add audio, although it's best if the audio clip and video are the same length.  Can you add tracks or other more advanced features?  No, for that you do need something more fulsome.  Depends on what you want to do.
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Rhossydd
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« Reply #5 on: July 29, 2010, 12:31:30 PM »
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Quote from: BobFisher
I just found your statement a little over the top and that it could discourage someone from even trying in the first place.
"Over the top" ? no, just honest and realistic. Two qualities often lacking in the hype surrounding DSLR video.
It would be dishonest to suggest that dealing with H264 HD video can be achieved simply and cheaply at the present time.

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As far as Virtualdub goes, it can do a fair bit.
But not what the Nigel asked for; editing.
A look at it's web site also says it's no use for someone trying to avoid the technicalities of video editing.


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BobFisher
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« Reply #6 on: July 29, 2010, 04:45:38 PM »
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OK.  You're right.  I'm wrong.  You know all there is to know about video editing.  Fine.  Done.
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canmiya
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« Reply #7 on: July 29, 2010, 07:14:32 PM »
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Quote from: NigelC
Just acquired 5D2 as stills DSLR, however would like to try video since its there - most likely to use for live performance at music festival. I know minus zero about getting video out of camera onto something I can view on TV or computer and don't really want to get into technicalities. What is best simple low cost solution for editing on PC?
There are a number of PC video editors available for under $150 that are quite capable of handling Canon MOV files The interfaces are different as are their capabilities in terms of color correction, sound and effects.  Many operate by using proxy files which as long as you are comfortable with that,  eliminates the need to convert the MOV files to an intermediate format. Additionally most have output presets for uploading to popular video sites including Vimeo and YouTube as well as for TV, DVD and BluRay.  

All of Video editors have free trial periods, and I would encourage you to take advantage of these, as you will find out whether you like the software and interface and if it works with your system before spending any money. Corel, Cyberlink Power Director, Adobe Elements Premier,Sony, and Pinnacle all have programs (in fact some have multiple options) under $150.  If you want to shoot and edit footage at 24fps, your choices at this time are limited to the Sony and Pinnacle software--

If you want to get your feet wet without spending any money, you could start with  the Zoombrowser software that comes with the camera-- which basically allows you to cut clips, but offers little in terms of color adjustments and other effects-- but may allow you to ease into the editing process.  
Whatever software you consider, check the system requirements before you download.
Regards
« Last Edit: July 29, 2010, 07:15:58 PM by canmiya » Logged
Rhossydd
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« Reply #8 on: July 30, 2010, 03:04:59 AM »
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Quote from: BobFisher
OK.  You're right.  I'm wrong.  You know all there is to know about video editing.  Fine.  Done.
Now who's being over the top ?
I don't know everything about video editing, but if you take the trouble to check my profile you'll see I've worked in broadcasting for over thirty years. I started editing with U-matic tape suites and have some experience of almost every editing system that has been in use since. I'm not some newbie who's only ever knocked up a couple of two minute shorts on the web and think that makes them a film maker.
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BobFisher
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« Reply #9 on: July 30, 2010, 07:52:23 AM »
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Well, I don't think my experience makes me a filmmaker.  Never said it did.  So if that comment was in reference to me, then it's off base.

I'm relatively new to video but my point was that making completely discouraging comments isn't necessarily the best approach.  Is it a difficult task?  Yes.  But there's also the journey of discovery and your comments might well squash that journey before it even gets started.  

WRT the comment regarding 'editing', you're thinking like someone with 30+ years in the field.  'Editing' to you may mean something entirely different than to someone who's just getting started.  To them 'editing' may mean simply cropping, trimming, adjusting colour, and the like for which a multi-thousand dollar editing suite isn't necessary.  

In terms of trial periods, Premiere Pro (at one time, not sure if this is still the case) didn't allow working on HD video in the trial.  If that's still the case then I'd guess Premiere Elements might be the same.
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Rhossydd
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« Reply #10 on: July 30, 2010, 08:36:32 AM »
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Quote from: BobFisher
making completely discouraging comments isn't necessarily the best approach.  Is it a difficult task?  Yes.
If you agree it's difficult, why suggest it's anything else ?
Without a basic engagement with the technicalities, HD editing quickly become a frustrating nightmare. Other forums that specialise in video have huge numbers of posts from people who have been mislead into thinking HD editing can be simple and cheap, but have found out the hard way how difficult it really is.
Taking a couple of hours to read up about the subject and learn what's needed will equip people with the knowledge to actually get something positive achieved and not have false expectations of ease of use.

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In terms of trial periods, Premiere Pro (at one time, not sure if this is still the case) didn't allow working on HD video in the trial.
Yes the trial version of PP CS5 does allow HD editing, but not with the complete capability of the full version. This is because of licence restrictions on the codecs needed, so rendering times can seem insane. So you only really get to see how good PP CS5 is after it's fully paid for. With the right hardware, it's the best solution to HD H264 editing and makes HD editing as reliable and easy as one would hope for.

As I said in my first post in this thread, it IS possible to use cheaper software such as Sony Vegas Movie studio, but don't expect to be able to use it without understanding how to configure it and use it. These cheaper products often don't work too well on their defaults and may need to use proxies or transcoded video to work acceptably well. Both of those last approaches need an understanding of the technology to be able to use.

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Les Sparks
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« Reply #11 on: July 30, 2010, 11:02:41 AM »
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A good source for information about video editing software is HV20 forum. The forum covers a lot more than the Canon HV20/30 camcorders. You'll find discussions of both PC and MAC editing software and hardware.
Magix's Movie Edit Pro 16 Plus (be sure to get the plus version and if possible get the boxed not the download version) Magix's website is another good low cost video editor (about $90). Best Buy often has it for less than that.
All video editing software can be frustrating to use (more so than photo editing software) but if you stick with it and take advantage of the online forums you can get past your problems and have lots of fun.
Unless you have pro desires,  you should be able to do everything you want with any of these:
Movie Edit Pro 16 Plus website
Sony Vegas Movie Studio HD Platinum Website
Sony Vegas Movie Studio HD Platinum 10 Production Suite Website
Adobe Premiere Elements 8 Website (now at $30 off)
You can download trial versions of these and see which you like.
All these companies have higher priced pro versions if you decide you need more.
Microsoft's free Movie Make for Vista/Windows 7 Website is a simple free alternative. I'm not sure if it supports your camera but you can start with it and then see if you want to move on.
Good luck.
Les
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canmiya
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« Reply #12 on: July 30, 2010, 01:18:31 PM »
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Quote from: Les Sparks
A good source for information about video editing software is HV20 forum. The forum covers a lot more than the Canon HV20/30 camcorders. You'll find discussions of both PC and MAC editing software and hardware.
Magix's Movie Edit Pro 16 Plus (be sure to get the plus version and if possible get the boxed not the download version) Magix's website is another good low cost video editor (about $90). Best Buy often has it for less than that.
All video editing software can be frustrating to use (more so than photo editing software) but if you stick with it and take advantage of the online forums you can get past your problems and have lots of fun.
Unless you have pro desires,  you should be able to do everything you want with any of these:
Movie Edit Pro 16 Plus website
Sony Vegas Movie Studio HD Platinum Website
Sony Vegas Movie Studio HD Platinum 10 Production Suite Website
Adobe Premiere Elements 8 Website (now at $30 off)
You can download trial versions of these and see which you like.
All these companies have higher priced pro versions if you decide you need more.
Microsoft's free Movie Make for Vista/Windows 7 Website is a simple free alternative. I'm not sure if it supports your camera but you can start with it and then see if you want to move on.
Good luck.
Les
I forgot about Magix Software and it does support 24 fps-although I believe it is a true 24fps and not 23.96-- The reason I did not mention Windows Movie Maker is that it requires the MOV files to be converted to a Windows friendly container like AVI. I have actually tried all of the under $150 PC editing solutions mentioned here for a project I recently completed.  All have tutorials to help video editing virgins get through the process.  Some of the software is pretty intuitive while others are more difficult to navigate.
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