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Author Topic: Schneider TS lenses  (Read 29358 times)
geesbert
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« on: September 19, 2010, 02:42:22 PM »
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http://www.robertwhite.co.uk/images/pages/Tilt_Shift_engl.pdf


Man, this is what I was waiting for for years! I am making 95% of my substantial income with a canon 90mm TSE and nearly at every shooting I hate it's shortcomings

Advantages of the Schneider over the Canon:
Tilt and shift axis independantly movable
Macro design (hopefully close range to 1:1)
Lens can be attached to a tripod, not camera

it would be nice if the filter ring wouldn't turn while focussing, but I doubt that.

f4 is a tad slow, but I can live with that...
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Chris_Brown
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« Reply #1 on: September 19, 2010, 03:08:04 PM »
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This is good news. I lament the lack of independent tilt/shift function, and a non-circular aperture on the Canon 90 TS-E. Hopefully we'll see these on the marketplace soon.
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Dick Roadnight
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« Reply #2 on: September 19, 2010, 04:11:06 PM »
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http://www.robertwhite.co.uk/images/pages/Tilt_Shift_engl.pdf

Man, this is what I was waiting for for years! I am making 95% of my substantial income with a canon 90mm TSE and nearly at every shooting I hate it's shortcomings
Why not get a proper Medium Format Digital View Camera?
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geesbert
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« Reply #3 on: September 19, 2010, 04:27:34 PM »
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I tried, spent € 30.000 on it, fought with it for months. I really hated it. what a glorious waste of time and resources.

none of my clients saw any quality improvements once printed in a magazine or on a billboard. I challenge anyone to show me the difference.

MF' shortfalls for my kind of work: pathetic live view, pathetic high ISO, pathetic screens which makes them unusable untethered, really tough ROI, prone to technical difficulties, slow workflow, difficult to have backup if not spending another fortune... just to name a few....

on my screen I see a quality improvement for sure, but once it went through post processing and into print I don't see any. and clients don't see it either. at least mine don't, and I am not dealing with small fish.





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Craig Murphy
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« Reply #4 on: September 19, 2010, 06:01:44 PM »
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I hope the make one for the Sony Alpha's.
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wolfnowl
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« Reply #5 on: September 19, 2010, 11:39:00 PM »
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At Photokina Schneider's expected to have a 50mm f/2.8 and a 90mm f/4 T/S lens for Canon, Nikon, Sony and Pentax, and a 28mm 2.8 for Mamiya/Phase One.

http://www.photoscala.de/Artikel/photokina-2010-Drei-Tilt-Shift-Objektive-von-Schneider-Kreuznach

Schneider Kreuznach stellt auf der photokina mit dem PC-TS Super-Angulon 2,8/50 mm HM und dem PC-TS Makro-Symmar 4,0/90 mm HM zwei neue Tilt-Shift-Objektive mit Anschlüssen für Kleinbildkameras von Canon, Nikon, Sony und Pentax vor. Weiterhin wird das PC-TS Apo-Digitar 5,6/120 mm HM Aspheric für Mittelformatkameras von Mamiya / PhaseOne angekündigt:

Die Jos. Schneider Optische Werke GmbH können auf eine gewisse Tradition zurückblicken, was Tilt- und Shiftobjektive angeht. Da gab es einst das PA-Curtagon 4/35 mm und das PCS Super-Angulon PQ 4,5/55 mm; das Shiftobjektiv PC Super-Angulon 2,8/28 mm ist nach wie vor auf der Webseite gelistet.

Auf der photokina 2010 nun stellt das Bad Kreuznacher Unternehmen drei neue Tilt-Shift-Objektive vor:

    * PC-TS Super-Angulon 2,8/50 mm HM
      mit Anschlüssen für Canon EOS, Nikon, Sony Alpha, Pentax K
      Preis ca. 2.800,00 € (UVP)
    * PC-TS Makro-Symmar 4,0/90 mm HM
      mit Anschlüssen für Canon EOS, Nikon, Sony Alpha, Pentax K
      Preis ca 2.700,00 € (UVP)
    * PC-TS Apo-Digitar 5,6/120 mm HM Aspheric
      für Mamiya / Phase One
      Preis von ca 3.900,00 € (UVP)
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erickb
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« Reply #6 on: September 19, 2010, 11:55:42 PM »
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no wide angle ...
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geesbert
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« Reply #7 on: September 20, 2010, 02:36:10 AM »
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2700 is not really a bargain, but schneider Glass never was.

0.6m close focus distance is not too great, though. that means even more fumbling with tubes for me...
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Dick Roadnight
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« Reply #8 on: September 20, 2010, 04:46:27 AM »
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MF' shortfalls for my kind of work: pathetic live view, pathetic high ISO, pathetic screens which makes them unusable untethered, really tough ROI, prone to technical difficulties, slow workflow, difficult to have backup if not spending another fortune... just to name a few....

on my screen I see a quality improvement for sure, but once it went through post processing and into print I don't see any. and clients don't see it either. at least mine don't, and I am not dealing with small fish.
All good points...

¿Would it not be nice if they did decent colour live view on the back of the digiback (with a magnifying pseudo-SLR type viewer)?

Decent high-ISO on budget MFD would be nice.

"They" seem to be unaware of what the market wants... how about a 20Mpx pseudo-SLR point-and-shoot with built-in movements that you could use with 90 degree lenses?
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Dick Roadnight
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« Reply #9 on: September 20, 2010, 05:05:35 AM »
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no wide angle ...
Wide angles have short focal lengths, and quality wide angles are as short as their focal lengths (non retro-focus), and they cannot be used on SLRs. (I think there were SLRs on which you could lock up the mirror to allow you to use non-retro-focus WA lenses

See Doug's post
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michaelbiondo
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« Reply #10 on: September 20, 2010, 04:08:22 PM »
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I like that they can be mounted directly to the tripod, IMHO it is much better for stitching. Move the camera back, not the lens. Still need something wider than a 50...
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Chris_Brown
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« Reply #11 on: September 20, 2010, 04:46:57 PM »
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MF' shortfalls for my kind of work: pathetic live view, pathetic high ISO, pathetic screens which makes them unusable untethered, really tough ROI, prone to technical difficulties, slow workflow, difficult to have backup if not spending another fortune... just to name a few....

I agree. The few times I've rented a Phase back with a view camera (Sinar), the shutter system seemed like a kludge, sync'ing the Copal shutter to the back. It worked, but for the money I wanted something more integrated, less ghetto. The other thing I didn't like was focusing, and manipulating the tilts & shifts. It was nothing like a 4x5 or 8x10, where a loupe and a hand on the controls quickly placed the plane of focus.
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dirkpieters
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« Reply #12 on: September 22, 2010, 05:15:33 AM »
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All you guys will one day look back at this as the day that the first real nail in the coffin of MFDB
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dirkpieters
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« Reply #13 on: September 22, 2010, 05:23:02 AM »
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All good points...

¿Would it not be nice if they did decent colour live view on the back of the digiback (with a magnifying pseudo-SLR type viewer)?

Decent high-ISO on budget MFD would be nice.

"They" seem to be unaware of what the market wants... how about a 20Mpx pseudo-SLR point-and-shoot with built-in movements that you could use with 90 degree lenses?

MFDB is great to make your clients think that you're good;"you must be good if you can afford the big expensive camera,Its always been like that.

Mind you, Its like that with women too.The better the car the more interest they show.
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BernardLanguillier
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« Reply #14 on: September 22, 2010, 07:22:43 AM »
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MFDB is great to make your clients think that you're good;"you must be good if you can afford the big expensive camera,Its always been like that.

Mind you, Its like that with women too.The better the car the more interest they show.

Difficult to be selective about the former but there are definitely ladies who don't care about cars. Smiley

Cheers,
Bernard

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BJNY
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« Reply #15 on: September 22, 2010, 07:37:13 AM »
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Related Zoerk goodies [in German] :

http://www.photoscala.de/Artikel/Zu-Besuch-bei-Zoerk
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Guillermo
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« Reply #16 on: September 22, 2010, 10:53:59 AM »
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Wide angles have short focal lengths, and quality wide angles are as short as their focal lengths (non retro-focus), and they cannot be used on SLRs. (I think there were SLRs on which you could lock up the mirror to allow you to use non-retro-focus WA lenses
That's the conventional wisdom, and it's true to a certain extent; but it doesn't preclude the existence of wide-angle T/S lenses. Canon's latest 17mm and 24mm TE-2's certainly proved that.

Schneider does make a 28mm Super-Angulon PC, but it's shift-only and optically a dud (not to mention massively over-priced given its performance). Frankly, the quality of the 28mm SA-PC doesn't inspire much confidence that these new lenses will be worth their price tag. They may be newer designs but that doesn't necessarily mean they're any better optically than the Nikkor PC-E's.
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JeffKohn
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« Reply #17 on: September 22, 2010, 10:54:47 AM »
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All you guys will one day look back at this as the day that the first real nail in the coffin of MFDB
How do you figure? Tilt/shift lenses are nothing new for 35mm format.
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dirkpieters
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« Reply #18 on: September 23, 2010, 06:54:23 AM »
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I have also been using the Canon TS 90 but its not quite good enough with the close-up macro stuff whereas the 120mm Zeiss on Hasselblad is sharp enough but shooting MFDB is too much of a mission and its too expensive.When Canon brings out its next 1DS mk IV the combination with the Schneider will allow me to never have to shoot MFDB again.
I was convinced that the dynamic range would be better on MFDB so I tried a P25 to compare roughly the same pixels and was surprised that only with the 120mm macro could I notice the diffs.At the moment my 90 with the 5D MKII is not good enough for jewelery but I'm hoping that the Schneider will be as good as the Hasselblad 120mm macro
I did a very brief test here:Let me know your opinion
http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=192650&id=753183824&l=a93dd98c3c
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Dick Roadnight
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« Reply #19 on: September 23, 2010, 09:00:12 AM »
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I have also been using the Canon TS 90 but its not quite good enough with the close-up macro stuff whereas the 120mm Zeiss on Hasselblad is sharp enough but shooting MFDB is too much of a mission and its too expensive.When Canon brings out its next 1DS mk IV the combination with the Schneider will allow me to never have to shoot MFDB again.
I was convinced that the dynamic range would be better on MFDB so I tried a P25 to compare roughly the same pixels and was surprised that only with the 120mm macro could I notice the diffs.At the moment my 90 with the 5D MKII is not good enough for jewelery but I'm hoping that the Schneider will be as good as the Hasselblad 120mm macro
I did a very brief test here:Let me know your opinion

The Hasselblad is very obviously superior,
even with a lowly P25
even well out of the 1:1 comfort zone of the lens (or you cropped)

I am thinking about doing some jewelery photography,
with an H4D-60 and a
Sinar P3 and
Zeiss Luminar Macro lenses and
a Sinar eShutter and
auto bracket focusing...

¿What do you call "good enough"?
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