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Author Topic: Flickr standards  (Read 10025 times)
Rob C
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« Reply #40 on: November 29, 2010, 03:47:28 AM »
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My apologies Rob, I did indeed get it the wrong way round. Just as a further note here in Ireland if you are self employed and your business goes belly up then you get no unemployment benefit at all. There is no safety net for entrepreneurs, hardly the greatest incentive if you are looking to new businesses to help the economy along.

One of the great criticisms of the now infamous four year plan is that there is nothing in it to encourage recovery, it's all cuts to the minimum wage, public spending reductions, tax hikes, interest rates, repayment schedules and so on. The purpose is clear,  saving the banks is foremost and naff all about putting the country back on its feet again. The Irish are to be squeezed to save the rest of Europe it feels to us. Will it work? Of course not, this is just the beginning of a European meltdown.


Justin, I simply can't follow your logic.

Ireland is bust; Europe + UK are trying to lend them the money to eat. Somehow, you see that as saving Europe at the expense of an already bankrupt Ireland. Or did you expect a gift, rather than a loan? And at the same time, the previous handouts and easy living can continue on - er - what? Long sold as the lowest tax haven around for 'artists' of all colours, probably con included, minimal taxation was thought of as a commercial weapon. Now, with the fruits of nothing much coming to the govt. coffers, suprise stalks the land!

The same applies to this Wikileaks business. If there were the extensive cloak and dagger, behind the scenes machinations that the press and the mouth-open public believes, can anyone expect, in parallel, that the 'dirty business' boys wouldn't have long disappeared the nutter doing this damage? They know his name, and, famously, where he lives. He's also being chased on rape charges... the thought that we are dealing with an embittered madman comes to mind.

This morning, Sky News informs me that the Saudies were trying to get the States to vanish Iran; well, for a country that's blamed for acts of agression everywhere, one will note that the States did not comply with that request, which seems to have been backed by the other local Arab states too. So much for the idea that America is run by maniacs with Desert Eagles stuck down their belts.

In reality, thank God for America. It has saved our nuts more than once. Despite everything.

Rob C
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stamper
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« Reply #41 on: November 29, 2010, 04:06:52 AM »
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Ireland is bust;

Unquote.

I don't think Ireland is bust.....the banks are. A lot of the money that the government has drawn in regarding taxes will be going to the banks instead of being spent on the necessities of life. The government AND THE PEOPLE will be refinancing the banks. Unfortunately there isn't enough in the coffers to do this and they have to borrow more. Rob make no mistake ordinary working people that lived within their means are blameless in this mess. The ones who took out loans to buy bigger than needed houses and bigger than needed cars etc etc have to look at their selves in the mirror. Ireland clobbered the workers on the minimum wage in reductions and left the better off alone. At the end of the day it is everyone - unfortunately - for themselves and there won't be a mass resistance to this because some aren't affected and some will profit out of it? Angry
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Justinr
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« Reply #42 on: November 29, 2010, 05:45:53 AM »
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I feel that we may be reaching something of an impasse here Rob so I'll just make a couple of quick points.

1. The UK's motives may not be as altruistic as one supposes. 7bn is a lot cheaper than sending the troops back to a fractious Ireland for it will not have not have escaped the notice of the the British government that peace came with prosperity. Cameron has also rather honestly pointed out that a poor Irish economy means mass emigration as folk go looking for work, mainly to the UK.

2. Brian Lenihan, our finance minister, as quoted by RTE news -

"The Minister also said that subordinated bondholders would be dealt with aggressively but said the European partners had ruled out making senior bondholders pay as it would have a spill over effect on the euro."

Which roughly translated means that only the minor lenders are going to be chased not the big boys in an effort to save the precious euro. The fact that any lenders are going to be dealt with at all suggests that it is not entirely the Irish people at fault.

Justin.
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Riaan van Wyk
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« Reply #43 on: November 29, 2010, 10:36:02 AM »
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Something that has been bothering me for some time is my country's "dole" system. Specifically the child grant system. To qualify for the grant you need to be female, single and unemployed. Easy enough criteria as that is how things work here, as childhood pregnancy is no more frowned upon, hell, highschool going kids can now even apply for maternity leave. The mind boggles. Being personally involved with paying out these grants ( I manage a retail store by the way) I have noted that the age of the people qeueing for mentioned grants to have dropped quite drastically over the last two years.

The point struck home last month when kids still in school uniform were in line for their grants, most of them for two to three children. I did some research and found to my horror that this has become a sort of easy money scheme, with unemployed parents forcing their schoolgoing daughters to have children  (as soon as they can) as it is an income for the household. And invariably the child drops out of school to look after these children. Fueling the education and unemployment fire. It is creating a dependency on government and furthermore, stiffling the real drive to go out and actively look for employment as there are other options than real work. A noble thought I guess from government ( or maybe they want the rural constituency that makes up a huge part of the voter base in their pockets) but one that is being abused currently. And the real losers are the children born under these circumstances. My thoughts on this are probably garbled, I have just sat down with a glass of good red after a 13 working day and still have the hum of the qeues in my ears.
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Rob C
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« Reply #44 on: November 29, 2010, 02:21:48 PM »
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Well, life is never viewed in the same manner by more than one man and his dog at the same time - assuming both man and dog have two eyes each and in perfect alignment; what chance here on LuLa? And in Ireland and Scotland, none whatever even with eyes well aligned. Understand Rangers and Celtic and you have understood Scotland. Understand Ireland and you have understood Iraq.

Reading what you write, Riaan, reminds me of living in India, where some babes were bound at birth to produce cripples with added begging potential. I'm told that in parts of the UK, if Miss Teenage gets pregnant, the council gives her an apartment... no longer living there, I can't vouch for it. Well, not that I'm a teenager nor likely to be able to get myself (not probably anyone else, for that matter) pregnant, but you know what I think I mean.

Yes, it is all a mess; and the vote is supposed to fix things? Who gets to vote? You have to be seventeen and tested to drive a friggin' car but any illiterate idiot of sixteen or so can, or soon will be able to, vote and change governments. Cool; I like that, smacks of progressive thinking. I can see is attractions. Must make canvassing simple, too.

Here in Mallorca it's freezing cold but not yet snowing; maybe up in the mountains, but not at sea level.

Rob C
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Justinr
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« Reply #45 on: November 30, 2010, 02:41:07 AM »
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The key to understanding Ireland is to appreciate that English society developed in a completely different way to that of this country, certainly here in the western half outside of the pale, and the mistake that many make (including myself it must be said) is to assume that just because the English are generally Caucasians who use the same primary language then we are just both part of the same western tip of Europe really. Not so, not at all and the cultural differences pre date and are separate from the Church. It's a big and fascinating subject and I doubt that I'll ever get to the bottom of it.

No idea about Iraq though.
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Rob C
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« Reply #46 on: November 30, 2010, 03:03:58 AM »
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The key to understanding Ireland is to appreciate that English society developed in a completely different way to that of this country, certainly here in the western half outside of the pale, and the mistake that many make (including myself it must be said) is to assume that just because the English are generally Caucasians who use the same primary language then we are just both part of the same western tip of Europe really. Not so, not at all and the cultural differences pre date and are separate from the Church. It's a big and fascinating subject and I doubt that I'll ever get to the bottom of it.

No idea about Iraq though.



In simplistic terms: whereas in the one it's 'christian' hating 'christian', in the other it's 'muslim' hating 'muslim' and in the case of the latter, had we left the iron man to get along with it, they would have remained calm as under all dictatorships. It's a mistake to assume that all peoples can use democracy.

In a dictatorship you go the way of the leader; in a democracy you go the way of the lowest common denominator. Pick your poison - six of one and half-a-dozen of the other.

As for the basic alternatives of structure - there is capitalism and there was communism. The latter imploded and it seems the former may follow in the same direction. Nobody 'won' the Cold War; internal events simply overtook one of the warriors, but it's always nice for the ratings to scrape some credit where it isn't due...

Rob C
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BernardLanguillier
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« Reply #47 on: November 30, 2010, 04:20:46 PM »
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Yet, Flickr has reached such a mass that most issues related to it are about navigation more than about quality.

It has become a world vast enough to sweep aside any possible doubt in terms of statistical relevance. The best photographic work in the world must be on Flickr just as certainly as the worst one.

The key is to be able to find it.

Now, the truth of the matter is that many Flickr users aren't really looking for anything but an immediate outlet at the end of their own photographic editing process. Click upload and the work is somehow done.

Cheers,
Bernard
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A few images online here!
Rob C
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« Reply #48 on: December 01, 2010, 03:07:41 AM »
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Yet, Flickr has reached such a mass that most issues related to it are about navigation more than about quality.

It has become a world vast enough to sweep aside any possible doubt in terms of statistical relevance. The best photographic work in the world must be on Flickr just as certainly as the worst one.

The key is to be able to find it.

Now, the truth of the matter is that many Flickr users aren't really looking for anything but an immediate outlet at the end of their own photographic editing process. Click upload and the work is somehow done.Cheers,
Bernard





Good observation: it serves much the same function as some threads here, then; an extension to, or substitute for a website. In the end, one might question the value of either.

Rob C

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BernardLanguillier
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« Reply #49 on: December 01, 2010, 05:50:22 AM »
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Good observation: it serves much the same function as some threads here, then; an extension to, or substitute for a website. In the end, one might question the value of either.

Isn't it all about expression? Expressing something is often less important that expressing oneself.

Don't know whether that makes sense in English though.  Huh

Cheers,
Bernard
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A few images online here!
Rob C
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« Reply #50 on: December 01, 2010, 09:58:16 AM »
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Isn't it all about expression? Expressing something is often less important that expressing oneself.

Don't know whether that makes sense in English though.  Huh

Cheers,
Bernard




No, it makes perfect sense, but the trouble, then, is that what one may be expressing turns out to be an empty thought. Wish I had a euro for each of those that I've had. Alternatively, a million for each of the other type... and I'd still be nervous.

Rob C
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Justinr
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« Reply #51 on: December 03, 2010, 12:40:50 PM »
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Postscript on the Irish situation-

Sorry

Humorous enough although it let's the err.... whole wretched crew (struggling to remain polite here) off far too lightly.
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William Birmingham
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« Reply #52 on: February 15, 2011, 03:07:03 PM »
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Dear Gentleman,

You all have been very vocal on the subject at hand.. and others.
I can acknowledge the emotions that are connected with all those views.
Know that I have sympathy and empathy.

To echo what was said..
I have had a Flickr account which I closed for reasons I won't detail.
A year later I started up a new Flickr account with new material.
Within the period of my absence I could clearly see how the standard has dropped.
Not only in photo quality vs the quantity but also the subject material of discussions.

It would seem as though most of the works are built around having your ego boosted.
Each day it gets harder for me to find photos that speaks to me.
And more and more the Flickr groups need to be defended from corporations looking for free photos.

To get to the core of why I chat to you..
I am a hobby photographer with a busy day time job.
Photography for me is an escape, a search for inner peace and expression.
Expression however looses its influence if it is not shared; becomes powerless if it does not grow from feedback.
Growth is only possible when you learn from other's opinions.

My Flickr experience brings me many (10's & 20's) visitors but there is no feedback.
The creative expression is seen but is not understood -- the feedback left empty.

So Flickr is not the way and standards have made a nosedive.
How do those who practice this art as a hobby break our bounds to become better artists?
We do not wish to compete, photography is but our escape.
Yet some of us do wish to be the best we can be.

If not Flickr, what is our alternatives?
In LuLa it seems (at my 1st glance) it is more talk than task.
I have also read that one is also not assured 100% honest opinion if you post a photo for critique.
If not Flickr, how do I become a better (practical) photographer?

I thank you for your opinion.
Greetings from the new guy.
-- Will
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stamper
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« Reply #53 on: February 16, 2011, 04:50:56 AM »
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Quote

have also read that one is also not assured 100% honest opinion if you post a photo for critique.
If not Flickr, how do I become a better (practical) photographer?

Unquote

I think the 100% opinion isn't available anywhere. Do you always give one? Huh
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Rob C
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« Reply #54 on: February 16, 2011, 08:24:26 AM »
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Quote

have also read that one is also not assured 100% honest opinion if you post a photo for critique.
If not Flickr, how do I become a better (practical) photographer?

Unquote

I think the 100% opinion isn't available anywhere. Do you always give one? Huh



Only a Scot could be so accurately direct!

Luvvit.

Rob C
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William Birmingham
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« Reply #55 on: February 16, 2011, 09:33:40 AM »
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Quote
I think the 100% opinion isn't available anywhere. Do you always give one? Huh
[smile]
Okay I'll give you that one. It has been overstated.. I'll lower the percentage.
But it is good policy to be honest.. balanced with diplomacy.
I hope however you all see the spirit of the idea I wish to get across.

Holding back all your punches is not too good when trying to learn from critique.
Just see how that forum punch of the above quote hit me on the nose to put me on my place.
Sometimes that is needed to grow -- or am I wrong?

Thanks for some response.
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Slobodan Blagojevic
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« Reply #56 on: February 16, 2011, 09:50:14 AM »
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... In LuLa it seems (at my 1st glance) it is more talk than task.
I have also read that one is also not assured 100% honest opinion if you post a photo for critique...

So far it seems you are true to your own expectation: more talk than task  Wink

Two posts, one poem, 457 words and zero photos for critique!?

"Truth!? You want truth? You can't handle the truth!" Smiley
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Slobodan

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wolfnowl
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« Reply #57 on: February 16, 2011, 10:39:05 AM »
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Quote
As HCB also said, you can learn all the mechanics of photography from the manual that comes along with your camera and its nice leather case. (You don't get the case nowadays.)

And if you purchase an Alpa they don't even supply a manual!   Grin

Mike.
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If your mind is attuned to beauty, you find beauty in everything.
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William Birmingham
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« Reply #58 on: February 16, 2011, 10:49:47 AM »
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So far it seems you are true to your own expectation: more talk than task  Wink

Two posts, one poem, 457 words and zero photos for critique!?

"Truth!? You want truth? You can't handle the truth!" Smiley

ouch! I have heard of this..it is death by forum stone throwing.
My apologies to everyone -- I have offended and that was not my intention.

I was aiming with my long-winded monogram to ask:
"What steps are there for people who wish to better themselves and they wish to kick off the Flickr habit?"

It was aimed generally and I as new LuLa member was feeling the temperature of water.
Let me see what I can find to put up for critique by the weekend.
I'll add my Flickr account on my profile just to be a fair amateur.

Please look beyond my apparent self interest.

-- Will
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Slobodan Blagojevic
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« Reply #59 on: February 16, 2011, 11:09:54 AM »
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Isn't it all about expression? Expressing something is often less important that expressing oneself...

Hmmm... reminds me of the quote attributed to Plato: "A wise man talks because he has something to say; a fool talks
because he has to say something."

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Slobodan

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