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Author Topic: Processing Camera Raw  (Read 4702 times)
Alan Klein
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« on: January 09, 2011, 09:38:43 PM »
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I'm shooting Olympus E-PL1 and have Photoshop Elements 8. Elements opens the ORF Olympus files in Camera Raw 5.7. There are two auto buttons: Default and Auto. What are the differences? How best to adjust from this point? Thanks. ALan
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NikoJorj
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« Reply #1 on: January 10, 2011, 04:32:34 AM »
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Well, the best is to try them : non-destructive editing means you can always step back to the import state with no quality loss, with the "Default" button.
"Auto" tries to guess which settings to apply ; like many contemporary tries in AI, it is more often than not deceiving I find.

The best is simply to go from top to bottom with the ACR sliders :
- adjust WB first,
- then adjust exposure to have the right rendition of highlights,
- Recovery may help with burnt highlights too,
- open the shadows if needed with fill light,
- adjust black point with Blacks (often needed after a significant Fill light adjsutment),
- shift the midtones to where they fit with Brightness,
- boost the contrast if needed now,
- etc...

You still can go back and forth (eg, you'd want to have decently exposed midtones to fine tune WB), but I find this top-down approach quite sensible.
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Nicolas from Grenoble
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Alan Klein
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« Reply #2 on: January 10, 2011, 10:27:12 AM »
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Thanks.  I wonder if there is a way to set up default or auto to automatically adjust the RAW picture to match what the camera does to use that as a start point.  I have Irfanview a free image processing program.  It automatically adjust the RAW ORF picture so that it matches the JPEG out of the camera OOC- so close that you really can't see the difference when you look at both side by side.  The problem is Irfan only provide a jpg from that point so you cannot do any more RAW adjustments.

If Irfanview can do this, there must be some parameters that are relatively easy to Set up that would give me an OOC picture which I can then add more RAW adjustments.  Does anyone know how?  Alan.
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NikoJorj
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« Reply #3 on: January 10, 2011, 11:49:47 AM »
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- AFAIK Irfan does show you the jpeg preview embedded in the raw file... as it's made by the camera it's of course identical to the jpeg file.

- A way to mimic the camera settings (which have absolutely no character of truthness, only one development choice among many others) could be to use "camera profiles" in ACR, but I'm not sure whether you have access to them in PSE ("Calibration" tab) or if there are any at all in ACR 5.7.

- to set some settings as new defaults, see here
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Nicolas from Grenoble
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Alan Klein
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« Reply #4 on: January 10, 2011, 12:31:47 PM »
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Thanks for the link description.  Regarding your first point, I'm a little confused.  Are you saying that my RAW file has the jpg file also.  I shoot jped + raw.  When I open the jpg with IRfan, and then open the RAW orf files, they both look the same.  How does theRAW file contain the OOC jpg data?
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elied
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« Reply #5 on: January 10, 2011, 05:49:39 PM »
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A RAW file is not an image file; it is merely a record of the voltage output by each sensel (photo-site) on the sensor plus a notation of that sensel's position in the grid. In order to be able to show you a review of your photo on its LCD screen the camera does a conversion and creates a jpg, which, just to keep it handy, it then embeds in the metadata section of the file. This same jpg is, therefore, available for use by quick viewing photo browsers. They are also used by more advanced conversion programs to plug the gap until they can prepare a display based on their own defaults, often a matter of several seconds. So in fact when you shoot RAW + jpg, you are actually producing RAW + 2 jpgs.
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k bennett
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« Reply #6 on: January 10, 2011, 07:09:53 PM »
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Thanks.  I wonder if there is a way to set up default or auto to automatically adjust the RAW picture to match what the camera does to use that as a start point.


Yes. Shoot a typical photo in both raw and JPEG, open the in ACR, and use the sliders to match the JPEG. Then choose Save New Camera Raw Defaults (it's in a little drop down menu.) Some things to consider:

1. You'll probably need to boost saturation and contrast to match the jpeg.
2. You'll want to change the default Noise and Sharpening settings. They aren't very useful as is.
3. I keep "As Shot" as my White Balance for my ACR defaults. I'll tweak the white balance for most images as I process them.

Note that you can save different ACR defaults for each ISO setting that you use -- this is very handy if you want different noise reduction settings for each ISO. This is a Preference setting in ACR.
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Alan Klein
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« Reply #7 on: January 10, 2011, 07:51:37 PM »
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If the JPEG metadata is stored in the RAW file, is that metadata available to IRfan, ACR or anyone else so that you can create the jpeg in ACR?  IN other words why can't the metadata be used by ACR to create the OOC results in ACR as a start point?
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jeremypayne
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« Reply #8 on: January 10, 2011, 08:07:56 PM »
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If the JPEG metadata is stored in the RAW file, is that metadata available to IRfan, ACR or anyone else so that you can create the jpeg in ACR?  IN other words why can't the metadata be used by ACR to create the OOC results in ACR as a start point?
It isn't jpeg metadata in the raw ... It is a jpeg.
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k bennett
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« Reply #9 on: January 10, 2011, 08:23:50 PM »
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For whatever reason, it doesn't work that way. Sorry.
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Alan Klein
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« Reply #10 on: January 10, 2011, 09:07:46 PM »
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I guess the mfr wants to keep there processing under wraps.  TOo bad!  Curious though.  How big is the jgped inside the RAW file?  When I take jpg + RAW, the jpeg is around 8mb and the raw is about 12mb.
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sniper
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« Reply #11 on: January 11, 2011, 01:26:51 AM »
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I think it varies from camera to camera, as far as I have been able to tell canon  and nikon put a small or medium size jprg (you can extract the embedded jpeg) but I don't know what compression is used on these but an 8mb canon comes out around the 1mb ish (will vary with image content)
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stamper
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« Reply #12 on: January 11, 2011, 04:21:58 AM »
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IMO you are approaching this from the wrong angle. Forget what the camera does. The jpeg is a rendering from the camera that isn't based on what you saw. It is a wild guess. In ACR zero out all the sliders so that the information looks flat. Then process the image using all of the controls to mimic what you saw - if you can remember - or to something that pleases you. If you choose the latter forget about the original scene and try for something that pleases you. You have subconscious likes that is different from others, so use them. It is your image so please yourself first and then possibly think about what others may think, but you FIRST.  Smiley
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jeremypayne
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« Reply #13 on: January 12, 2011, 03:28:19 PM »
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IMO you are approaching this from the wrong angle. Forget what the camera does. The jpeg is a rendering from the camera that isn't based on what you saw. It is a wild guess. In ACR zero out all the sliders so that the information looks flat. Then process the image using all of the controls to mimic what you saw - if you can remember - or to something that pleases you. If you choose the latter forget about the original scene and try for something that pleases you. You have subconscious likes that is different from others, so use them. It is your image so please yourself first and then possibly think about what others may think, but you FIRST.  Smiley

http://www.luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?topic=49941.msg415066#msg415066
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