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Author Topic: Printing on Metal  (Read 8224 times)
Sven W
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« Reply #20 on: February 11, 2011, 04:35:24 PM »
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Sven;
I am waiting for my metal to dry.  I followed your workflow and so far, no problems.  I did use 0000 steel wool to clean the metal.  Some of the schmutz just wouldn't come of with just the alcohol.  If I use the premium gloss profile, should I use the matt or the photo ink.   

I bought the metal from Metal by the inch, https://metalbytheinch.com/index.html?searchstring=aluminum%20sheet  and spoke with Scott.  Very helpful and anxious to please.

I will continue to post progress.

Other comments more than welcome.  Have a safe weekend.  Down with Mubarek!!
David
Mubarak is down and out !
The old rule about Pk for glossy media and Mk for matte, seems to be the answer here too.
I used Pk. And the InkAid's Q&A states:
Q. Which Epson Ultrachrome inks are most compatible with inkAID products?

A. Both matte and photo black Epson Ultrachrome inks work well. With the clear inkAID™ products (Clear Semi-Gloss, Clear Gloss, and Clear Gloss Type II), artists sometimes prefer to use the photo black ink.


/Sven
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douvidl
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« Reply #21 on: February 12, 2011, 05:09:06 PM »
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Sven;
It worked!!! Joy.
The image came out great.  I just need to remember that the metal will tend to dull the colors.  Hence I suspect tht saturation rather than perceptual print setting is the way to go.  I also observe that whites or lights don't do well and that deep, rich colors do splendidly.
thanks for the help.
David
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RFPhotography
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« Reply #22 on: February 12, 2011, 05:42:57 PM »
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David, I'd strongly advise against using Saturation as your rendering intent.  It can do very odd things.

Keep in mind that while the colours may look a bit muted now, you still need to overcoat with some form of protectant.  Many of these will work to enhance colours and overall impact of the image.  Wait till you've finished coating the image to see how colours end up.
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Sven W
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« Reply #23 on: February 13, 2011, 10:42:40 AM »
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Sven;
It worked!!! Joy.
The image came out great.  I just need to remember that the metal will tend to dull the colors.  Hence I suspect tht saturation rather than perceptual print setting is the way to go.  I also observe that whites or lights don't do well and that deep, rich colors do splendidly.
thanks for the help.
David

Nice !
I think color printed on metal is.....ugly. IMHO. I prefer b&w. I saw some beautiful b&w portraits printed on copper.
Almost like a daguerreotype !
You have to do some tests for brightness & contrast. Esp. contrast, think newspaper printing, and increase quite a lot.

/Sven
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douvidl
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« Reply #24 on: February 13, 2011, 10:20:03 PM »
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I did print a black and white and you are correct, the effect is striking.  I did print another color, but this time, one with deep blue, sky blue etc.  but no oranges  or red and the effect is mucho wonderful!!!
The only question is how to frame the suckers.
BTW, Booksmart Studio has posted a profile to go with their metal papers.  I did use their profile on the last two prints and it was considerably better than the glossy from Epson.
David
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neile
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« Reply #25 on: February 13, 2011, 11:00:52 PM »
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Why frame them at all? Go another route! Perhaps drill a hole in each corner and mount them to the wall using stainless steel screws and standoffs?

Neil
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Neil Enns
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Sven W
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« Reply #26 on: February 14, 2011, 05:34:05 AM »
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The only question is how to frame the suckers.
David

A small alu-frame glued on the back is quite nifty. (See attached image)
Gives the much appreciated "floating" effect.
And must be done after printing  Grin

/Sven
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« Reply #27 on: February 14, 2011, 06:22:09 AM »
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I've done the same as Sven but with wood.  It does make a nice presentation.  Care has to be taken with the corners and edges with this type of approach.

A metal frame also works well.  1 1/2 to 2" flat profile, matte finish, grey or black.  Back the print with a piece of foamcore or gator board.
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Damir
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« Reply #28 on: February 20, 2011, 08:01:27 PM »
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Well, I just finished my firs experiments with printing on metal. I did it on used plates for offset printing. Printer is HP Pro B9180.

I got some really fascinating prints, also some lousy prints. For now my greatest problem is black ink in deep shadows of black and white printing. Best results are color prints made from pictures in medium and high tonality. High key photos are delicate and beautiful.

I will try to make better B&W - any advice about type of paper to use as starting point for printing?
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douvidl
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« Reply #29 on: February 20, 2011, 10:10:03 PM »
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What are high key  or high tonality photos?
David
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Damir
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« Reply #30 on: February 21, 2011, 04:42:02 AM »
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Photos in which dominate light tones are high key photos.
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douvidl
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« Reply #31 on: February 24, 2011, 01:26:33 PM »
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Sven;
Another question.  I notice that the print/film on the metal seems to be separating from the metal.  I 'm not sure what I've done wrong or not done at all.  I did not use a varnish coat as a final coat.  I did use the Clear Jet coating, but not the varnish. 
Any thoughts or suggestions?
David
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douvidl
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« Reply #32 on: February 24, 2011, 01:27:49 PM »
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Dan; I just posted this note to Sven. 
I would appreciate your input.
Thanks
David

Sven;
Another question.  I notice that the print/film on the metal seems to be separating from the metal.  I 'm not sure what I've done wrong or not done at all.  I did not use a varnish coat as a final coat.  I did use the Clear Jet coating, but not the varnish.
Any thoughts or suggestions?
David
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Dan Berg
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« Reply #33 on: February 24, 2011, 02:52:46 PM »
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David,
You put a topcoat of solvent based clearjet on your print more then likely before the ink was dry. That ink needs to dry a minimum of 24 hours before any type of top coating. In some of my earlier tests I sprayed the topcoat after about 6 hours. Quite a mess,the ink lifted right off the metal. All is not lost. Take the metal into a sink and rinse all the ink and receptor coat off. Dry and then recoat with Inkaid or Dass. Reprint and let dry at least 24 hours to make sure all of the glycol has completely dried. Mist a light coat of the Clearstar 2000 and let dry. It will make for a nice sealer coat. Now your ready to spray 2 nice topcoats and you should be good.
« Last Edit: February 24, 2011, 07:27:54 PM by Dan Berg » Logged

douvidl
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« Reply #34 on: February 24, 2011, 03:09:10 PM »
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Fascinating!!.  I left them to dry overnight. My guess about 16 hours.
Thanks for the help.
David
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Sven W
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« Reply #35 on: February 24, 2011, 03:58:44 PM »
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As Dan's tip; at least 24h drying. I would wait even two days.
It's not like a Kodak Picture Kiosk, working with metal printing Cheesy

/Sven
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douvidl
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« Reply #36 on: February 24, 2011, 04:16:21 PM »
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Dan;
I use ClearJet AFR Coating after the ink dries.  Is there something else.  If so, could you tell me what the label says.
Much appreciated.
David
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douvidl
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« Reply #37 on: February 24, 2011, 05:04:28 PM »
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Sven;
Message received!!  But what coatings or sealer do you use after the metal dries for two day?
David
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ednazarko
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« Reply #38 on: March 04, 2011, 09:05:03 AM »
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Just ran across this here.  I've printed on metal for several years - aluminum, stainless steel, and copper - using InkAid for the coating.  Metal purchased from a supply house has been a lot easier for me than working with flashing.  I found a local place that supplies metal to roofers and light manufacturers.  They'll cut to specification, and that means you can select a big sheet of exactly the surface type and thickness you want, specify the sizes you want cut out of the sheet, and go home happy with metal plates that cost a fraction of buying pre-coated metal.  The one problem with this approach is that the metal distributors are not used to people wanting perfect, unscratched, unmarred surfaces - they assume if that matters, you'll be buffing and surfacing yourself, and that's a total pain in the posterior, especially with stainless steel.  Metal polishing is an acquired skill.  By doing a lot of begging and whining  Wink I've been able to get the shop to be more careful, and now I get mostly perfect surfaces with a few pieces marred, and I use those pieces for experiments in texturing the metal before coating - swirls or texturing that follows the shapes of the image I'll be printing later.

There are bonuses for finding a local metal distributor to buy from.  They have a lot of scrap pieces from other orders that are pretty good sized, although not to a specific perfect size, and if you're fine with that, they'll usually GIVE those pieces to you, or sell them for what a metal recycler would pay.  About half of what I print on now is scrap - I put a standard image size on the nonstandard size pieces, even in some cases on geometrically odd pieces which can be really lovely.  The other bonus is, odds are they've never had an artist customer.  The local shop was fascinated at what I told them I was doing, and when I brought in some examples of printed images, they bought two to hang in their offices.  I've since given them a couple more to display, and the result has been some sales of my images on metal to their customers.

I've also worked on aluminum flashing purchased at the home improvement stores, initially because I had some large panoramas I wanted to try on metal.  (14x144 inches.)  While both purchased metal sheets and flashing require pretty finicky cleaning - I use TSP if the surface is really slick, metal cleaners and solid sponges at minimum - the flashing seems to be the trickiest to prep.  I wish I knew why, but it just is.

When I coat with InkAid, I do two or three coats usually, with 24 hours of drying time. I use brushes since I don't have an industrial sprayer. My biggest issue is getting that many coats on huge surfaces over several days without accidentally getting a stray piece of dog hair or dust in the surface.  I have a room in the house now that I have sealed, that I use for coating, which helps a lot.  After printing, I wait at least 24 hours, then coat with a couple layers of one of the spray coatings, the nasty smelling varnish types.  I tried NOT doing that, and the surfaces were incredibly touchy.  If I spray coat, they're not much more touchy than some of the Hahnemuhle papers.

Some day I am going to try the pre-coated metal options, because for work I sell, the extra cost is well covered by the price of the prints I sell, and I'm a photographer, not a print surface maker.  I'd still use my own coated surfaces for proofing and tweaking prints, but once I had what I wanted, I can wash off the metal, re-coat, and re-use for proofing again.
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douvidl
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« Reply #39 on: March 04, 2011, 09:16:18 AM »
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Ednazarko;
Thanks for the report.  I 've tried to find a metal supple house near me to no avail.  As I live in a small house with little space, precut sheets are critical.  But as you say, the surface isn't perfect and they generally require work with steel wool.  I  worked with aluminum with success and want to try copper, but the price is just prohibitive.
thanks again.
David
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