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Author Topic: Where to buy paper in Toronto?  (Read 6718 times)
Aristoc
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« Reply #20 on: February 15, 2011, 03:15:04 PM »
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if  you increase the number of boxes of paper you are going to buy, then it's still cheaper at B&H.  With the dollar = US dollar there should be no excuses.  Don't forget that the Canadian stores are buying this stuff from the USA and adding a nice profit on it payed for by you and me.

This has nothing to do with supporting Canadian stores. I don't mind supporting Canadian stores who dont gouge. They need to be considerate and bring to prices in line.

CCBC might be worth checking out, but it's still more expensive. Over time, it adds up.
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Mark D Segal
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« Reply #21 on: February 15, 2011, 03:23:21 PM »
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if  you increase the number of boxes of paper you are going to buy, then it's still cheaper at B&H.  With the dollar = US dollar there should be no excuses.  Don't forget that the Canadian stores are buying this stuff from the USA and adding a nice profit on it payed for by you and me.

This has nothing to do with supporting Canadian stores. I don't mind supporting Canadian stores who dont gouge. They need to be considerate and bring to prices in line.

CCBC might be worth checking out, but it's still more expensive. Over time, it adds up.

Are you certain of your facts that Canadian stores are buying from the USA? Ilford is a Swiss company which manufactures GFS in Germany and Canson is a French company which manufactures Baryta Photographique in France. Vistek is the Canadian distributor for Canson. Did you ask them whether they import it from France or the USA and at what price? Amplis is the Canadian distributor for IGFS. Did you ask them whether they bring it in from Europe or the USA? Do you really know much about how the manufacturers price the stuff to the distributors, the distributors price it to the retailers and the retailers to us? I'd be surprised. But for us, the bottom line is how much we need to pay for it, what's the shipping risk, and what's worthwhile doing all things considered, including perhaps SOME consideration to the value of our local retail outlets surviving, just for the service we get - not only for papers, but a host of other things too, where on-the-spot personal rapport matters.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
Author: "Scanning Workflows with SilverFast 8....." http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/film/scanning_workflows_with_silverfast_8.shtml
mikev1
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« Reply #22 on: February 15, 2011, 03:41:59 PM »
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To sum it up... It pays to shop around.

Sometimes B&H works for me.  Sometimes Vistek (rarely). Sometimes The Camera Store works.

For Epson canvas and Luster I usually order from whatever computer drop shipper offers the best price. 

I usually buy several rolls at once so paying for shipping costs still results in a cheaper final price than buying from one of the local stores.

Unless of course I have a rush order and haven't minded my stock.  Then I pay through the nose to get what I need.
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Aristoc
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« Reply #23 on: February 15, 2011, 03:57:57 PM »
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Are you certain of your facts that Canadian stores are buying from the USA? Ilford is a Swiss company which manufactures GFS in Germany and Canson is a French company which manufactures Baryta Photographique in France. Vistek is the Canadian distributor for Canson. Did you ask them whether they import it from France or the USA and at what price? Amplis is the Canadian distributor for IGFS. Did you ask them whether they bring it in from Europe or the USA? Do you really know much about how the manufacturers price the stuff to the distributors, the distributors price it to the retailers and the retailers to us? I'd be surprised. But for us, the bottom line is how much we need to pay for it, what's the shipping risk, and what's worthwhile doing all things considered, including perhaps SOME consideration to the value of our local retail outlets surviving, just for the service we get - not only for papers, but a host of other things too, where on-the-spot personal rapport matters.

I dont give a darn who is the distributor. That's really their problem not mine. They can make up whatever story they want to try to convince you that they are not gouging you. Same thing happened with books remember?
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Mark D Segal
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« Reply #24 on: February 15, 2011, 05:21:19 PM »
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Books is a whole other talk-show. Amazon.com fixed that mess.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
Author: "Scanning Workflows with SilverFast 8....." http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/film/scanning_workflows_with_silverfast_8.shtml
Luca Ragogna
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« Reply #25 on: February 15, 2011, 05:27:13 PM »
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If it's as much of a hassle for you guys to buy paper as it is for me, let the manufacturers know. If enough of us Canadians complain the manufacturers may consider adding more distributors. More distributors means more competition and better pricing... or better service at least.
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Luca Ragogna
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« Reply #26 on: February 15, 2011, 05:29:07 PM »
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Also interested in where to get ink at a good price.

Carey

Tiger Direct has pretty good pricing on ink if you set up a business account.
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chez
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« Reply #27 on: February 15, 2011, 06:17:14 PM »
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I've found many Canadian stores are very willing to price match B&H...just have to ask. They truly want your business and if you are willing to bring your business to them, they are very willing to make deals for you.

I've shopped Canadian for the majority of my printer supplies and have made out costing less than what I could have bought it from the US. B&H is the easy solution...until a shipping problem occurs and then the couple bucks saved does not seem worth it at all.
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D_Clear
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« Reply #28 on: February 15, 2011, 11:55:48 PM »
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I have dealt with many of the paper resellers mentioned already; Camera Store (Calgary), Tricera, CCBC and Vistek. I have also dealt with Amplis but not for paper.
From a service standpoint there is no question in my mind that Bradley at CCBC will give you the best service and the best price if he has, or can get stock. He has gone out of his way to get me product; inks, ink heads and paper in rush-service situations. I can't say enough about the place.
Though Vistek gets a lot of criticism for customer service and pricing issues, I have found them to be pretty good with respect to stock and pricing. Given what they offer overall I think they do a great job and maintain their place at the top of the supply chain in Toronto in many respects. Without them and a few others I'd be unable to properly run my business. I know from personal experience the cost differences in running a business both sides of the border, I'm fine if they charge a bit more for some products it's worth it to me.
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« Reply #29 on: February 16, 2011, 03:20:59 PM »
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I always thought prices on just about everything were more in Canada because of the taxes, not higher store profits?  Am I wrong?  My cousins live in Ottawa (I was there for Canada Day July 1st) and it seemed like everything was more expensive there than the states, but I saw what I was paying in taxes there and it was a huge difference.  However, don't they add a custom tax to your purchase from the states? 
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Aristoc
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« Reply #30 on: February 16, 2011, 03:37:48 PM »
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Canada is switching over to an all enclusive tax / VAT called the HST. It's one tax. Even if I buy from the USA, I still have to pay it.
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RFPhotography
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« Reply #31 on: February 16, 2011, 05:22:01 PM »
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Not quite.  Only some provinces have the HST.  Ontario is one and, along with BC, the newest. 

Prior to the HST, if you lived in Ontario, you still had to pay GST on imported goods and in some cases PST as well.  Or at least you were supposed to.  Sometimes things would slip through without the tax.

Taxes alone are most definitely not the reason for the difference in prices.  Taxes are excised at the time of purchase; not included in shelf pricing.  Much international trade is now without duties so that doesn't play into the equation really to any extent today.

In some cases, prices are higher here simply due to volume.  Not even Vistek or Henrys can approach the sales and ordering volume of a B&H or Adorama or other large U.S. outlets.  Lower volume means lower volume discounts and higher end prices to customers. 
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Darrel
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« Reply #32 on: February 16, 2011, 05:49:47 PM »
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Businesses get the HST/GST back when they remit, so they do not really pay it in the end.
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mikev1
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« Reply #33 on: February 17, 2011, 01:32:34 AM »
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Part of the reason why we pay higher taxes is due to things already mentioned like demand and purchasing power.  However another big reason is a fancy economic term called price stickiness.  Companies are quick to adjust prices upwards due to changes in exchange rates but are a heck of a lot slower in reducing them back down. 

Remember when it cost $1.50 CDN to buy $1 US?  Back then a lot more goods reflected purchasing power parity,  that is when exchange rates were accounted for the price of the item was roughly the same.  We just got used to paying higher costs for the most part.  You also see this mentioned a lot when oil prices fall and we still are paying higher gas prices.  Oil companies like to say that we are still paying for the old gas produced at the higher prices but I bet there is an artificial lag in the change in prices.

You also see a spike in Canadians buying vehicles from the US when our dollar strengthens.  It was so bad a few years ago a few of the manufacturers started to prohibit their US dealers from selling to Canadians or refusing to perform warranties.

Canon lens prices from time to time have been out of sync to varying degrees between Canada and the US.  Sometimes it makes sense to buy from a US retailer and other times not.
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Aristoc
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« Reply #34 on: February 17, 2011, 06:32:56 AM »
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Ihave to admit I have noticed in the last 6 months or so that there are some lenses and equipment on sale in Canada listed cheaper than the USA price.
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kenben
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« Reply #35 on: February 17, 2011, 08:42:18 AM »
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You folks in Toronto have more options than I do.Living in Sudbury Ontario we only have Henry's.I order all of my printing paper from mail order.I like using the Moab Somerset Museum Rag.Vistek is the only place in Ontario I can find it.

I came across this price for Museum Rag in the US,does anyone know of this company.I called and a salesperson quoted me 106.00 but I referred him to the website and he comfirmed that price.Makes me a little leery.

http://www.atlex.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=I98-SMR300131925
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RFPhotography
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« Reply #36 on: February 17, 2011, 09:24:05 AM »
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I was really hoping this wouldn't degrade into a discussion of economics.  Having published numerous articles over the years dealing with economics in professional publications (not photography publications, obviously) in a former life it's often sad when I see people start trying to address the subject.

WRT prices being higher when the exchange rate was weaker, keep in mind that prices are set for products months in advance.  Look at what happened when the exchange rate strengthened and people were up in arms because book prices were way out of sync.  Businesses (producers) can, if they desire, make special pricing adjustments through rebates or credits to retailers which they can demand retailers pass on to customers but if this doesn't happen then there's nothing the retailer or consumer can do.  The retailer can decide to lower its profit margins but isn't compelled to do so.  The business cycle, unfortunately, doesn't react as quickly as the markets can.  Further, to suggest that prices were about right when the CAD was at $1.50 is flat out incorrect (see below paragraph on PPP).  I've saved literally thousands of dollars over the years buying bodies, lenses and other sundry gear (less on bodies, more on lenses) from the U.S. when the CAD was weaker and that's after factoring in exchange rate differences, shipping costs and taxes.

PPP really doesn't play a part either.  PPP theory is based on a basket of common goods that are traded and consumed by a broad sector of a population across countries.  PPP theory doesn't necessarily hold for highly specialised goods which photography gear would be considered as.  There's also no set definition of what the 'basket' of goods should be so PPP is nothing more than an estimate rather than a hard and fast number.  Additionally, PPP is a long term indicator and is not intended to be used as an indicator for shorter term fluctuations and volatility.  When we talk 'long term' in economics, we're talking about 15, 20 or more years.  There are also two forms of PPP; absolute and relative.  Absolute PPP deals with absolute price differences.  Relative PPP deals with inflation and rates of change of prices. 

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Aristoc
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« Reply #37 on: February 17, 2011, 09:35:20 AM »
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I was just checking and Atlex does not ship to international spots. So buy from B&H. When you add it to your cart, you will see the new reduced price of $72 which would be the same as ATlex anyways.
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neile
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« Reply #38 on: February 17, 2011, 09:40:14 AM »
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Atlex is a reputable company, I've purchased from them several times. Other good sources in the US are Shades of Paper, ITsupplies, and ColorHQ.

Personally I'm buying lately from Shades of Paper due to their excellent customer service. You have to call for pricing though, their website doesn't list the best they can do.

Neil
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Neil Enns
Dane Creek Folio Covers. Limited edition Tuscan Sun and Citron covers are now in stock!
kenben
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« Reply #39 on: February 17, 2011, 10:02:40 AM »
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I just purchased Moab Somerset Museum Rag from B&H.It was listed at 96.00 but when I clipped on lower price It said 72.00.I went to check out and selected Purolator for 11.00 and I good go no further as I was told to choose another method which was 32.00.I called them and placed my order for 11.00 shipping.
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