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Author Topic: Canson Infinity Platine Fibre Rag  (Read 11560 times)
narikin
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« Reply #60 on: June 16, 2011, 06:26:40 PM »
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Then there is the great divide between all Baryta/Fiber/RC/Foil/Film qualities set against all matte Fine Art/plain matte coated inkjet/uncoated papers if is about MK or PK. With few exceptions.

Very much agree.  It is deeply frustrating that the new Ultrasmooth Matt Papers have all the qualities I like, zero reflection/bronzing; look good from any angle; very smooth surface; can be pure cotton; can be no OBA's, but... they are Matte Black, so have poor black density, compared to a Baryta's.

Is there a reason why we can't have a PK Ultrasmooth Matt Surface?



 
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Light Seeker
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« Reply #61 on: June 17, 2011, 12:13:24 AM »
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Is there a reason why we can't have a PK Ultrasmooth Matt Surface?

narikin, it's all comes down to physics. The deeps blacks and vivid colours that gloss surfaces produce happen because they are efficient light reflectors. The surface is smooth, and light striking a smooth surface at 90 degrees is directly reflected back. It's coherent light. This is also why there is glare, for when you view a gloss image at an angle the light is also efficiently reflected. Well positioned lighting is critical for viewing a gloss image at it's best.

A matte surface conversely, is designed to scatter light. It's "bumpy" or irregular, and and there is less light reflected directly back, and less coherent light. That's the reason that matte black is less punchy and the colours have a smaller gamut. It's also why there is no glare, for the same light scattering properties hold true when you view the image at an angle.

Bottom line, we can't have out cake and eat it too!

Terry.
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Sven W
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« Reply #62 on: June 17, 2011, 04:09:26 AM »
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Yes, true.
And you will find the deepest black from black solid glass, with 45˚ light angel.

/Sven
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« Reply #63 on: June 17, 2011, 07:01:32 AM »
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There is actually much more going on, and much of ithas to do with coating technology.
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Andy Biggs
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deanwork
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« Reply #64 on: June 17, 2011, 08:17:16 AM »
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I just tried the Harmon Gloss Baryta on the IPF 8300 yesterday and there is no bronzing and no gloss differential. There is not even the necessity to apply a couple of coats of uv spray unless you want greater surface protection. It just works.

john

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narikin
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« Reply #65 on: June 17, 2011, 08:42:03 AM »
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I just tried the Harmon Gloss Baryta on the IPF 8300 yesterday and there is no bronzing and no gloss differential. There is not even the necessity to apply a couple of coats of uv spray unless you want greater surface protection. It just works.

Could not agree more. It works great in an 8300, but not quite so well in Epsons, due to pressure marks on the paper when the roll rests between prints. Canon does not do this.

and you are not mentioning its large Gamut and very long life in Aardenberg, excellent stability.

it has stubborn curl, that is my only criticism. Oh and it doesn't come in 60" rolls. Great Paper otherwise.
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narikin
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« Reply #66 on: June 17, 2011, 08:46:56 AM »
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narikin, it's all comes down to physics. The deeps blacks and vivid colours that gloss surfaces produce happen because they are efficient light reflectors. The surface is smooth, and light striking a smooth surface at 90 degrees is directly reflected back. It's coherent light. This is also why there is glare, for when you view a gloss image at an angle the light is also efficiently reflected. Well positioned lighting is critical for viewing a gloss image at it's best.

A matte surface conversely, is designed to scatter light. It's "bumpy" or irregular, and and there is less light reflected directly back, and less coherent light. That's the reason that matte black is less punchy and the colours have a smaller gamut. It's also why there is no glare, for the same light scattering properties hold true when you view the image at an angle.

Bottom line, we can't have out cake and eat it too!

Terry.

Damn somedays you hate science.
I want a matte cake!
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deanwork
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« Reply #67 on: June 17, 2011, 09:11:26 AM »
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When I tested the fiber gloss Harmon when it first came out a few years ago it was super glossy and looked no different than an rc plastic print so I never thought twice about it again. But they totally redesigned it and now it can pass for Ilfobrome silver paper. It is even great for very small prints which is the first I've found that was not too textured. It has the best gloss characteristics of all the fiber gloss papers I've used with the Z3100 also, but if you look closely there is a tiny bit of bronzing than can give you a rainbow effect. But the Canon is perfect. This is the very first time I've been totally happy with these kinds of papers with pigments. I have to say I haven't tested the Platine yet with this printer but have seen it from an Epson 9880 and the Z and there were still some slight issues, but it's a nice paper.

j
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narikin
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« Reply #68 on: June 17, 2011, 09:47:42 AM »
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When I tested the fiber gloss Harmon when it first came out a few years ago it was super glossy and looked no different than an rc plastic print so I never thought twice about it again. But they totally redesigned it and now it can pass for Ilfobrome silver paper. It is even great for very small prints which is the first I've found that was not too textured. It has the best gloss characteristics of all the fiber gloss papers I've used with the Z3100 also, but if you look closely there is a tiny bit of bronzing than can give you a rainbow effect. But the Canon is perfect. This is the very first time I've been totally happy with these kinds of papers with pigments. I have to say I haven't tested the Platine yet with this printer but have seen it from an Epson 9880 and the Z and there were still some slight issues, but it's a nice paper.

Agree.

IMHO - Harman Gloss Baryta (ex FBAL) has the true air-dried low gloss surface out there - no stipple - works well at angles and in small prints. I wish for the love of god that Canson had copied that surface with Platine.

Similar great surfaces are Epson Exhibition Fiber, (aka Innova IFA49 Fibaprint UltraSmooth) where they got it dead right too, BUT... filled the things with bad OBA's so it has terrible longevity. Avoid.

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Light Seeker
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« Reply #69 on: June 17, 2011, 02:00:56 PM »
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I want a matte cake!

For many years I had matte cake, but the gloss cake has been getting better and better.   Wink

Terry.
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Light Seeker
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« Reply #70 on: June 17, 2011, 02:07:50 PM »
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IMHO - Harman Gloss Baryta (ex FBAL) has the true air-dried low gloss surface out there - no stipple - works well at angles and in small prints. I wish for the love of god that Canson had copied that surface with Platine.

I like that Platine has a bit of texture, but I have also been enjoying the smooth surface of Epson Exhibition Fiber (but not the OBA's). The old Harman had a pretty delicate surface. How is Harman Gloss Baryta in that regard?

Terry.
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deanwork
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« Reply #71 on: June 17, 2011, 08:59:11 PM »
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Greatly improved. The original Harmon was the only paper that I ever had roller marks on the Z with. None of that with the Z or the Canon on this Gloss Baryta. Can't comment on the Epsons. They also offer a warmer version that is perfect for those warm toned gloss prints that mimic Portriga. They deserve an award for nailing both of these. I'm standardizing on this as my only fiber gloss media from now on. Damn it's about time. I've wasted thousands on all these others over the years with mediocre results at best for black and white.

j
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Sharon Van Lieu
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« Reply #72 on: June 17, 2011, 09:06:28 PM »
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I use the Harman Gloss Baryta also. The only downside in our climate is it has to be dry mounted. Even 18x12 inch prints buckle with professional hinge mounting.

Sharon
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Light Seeker
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« Reply #73 on: July 07, 2011, 05:34:32 PM »
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I'm standardizing on this as my only fiber gloss media from now on. Damn it's about time. I've wasted thousands on all these others over the years with mediocre results at best for black and white.

John. . . .  what media setting have you settled on for the 8300 and the Harman paper? I'm going to pick up some sheets to try.

Are you as happy with the warmtone version as you are with the regular one?

Thanks.

Terry.
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narikin
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« Reply #74 on: July 17, 2011, 03:25:18 PM »
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They deserve an award for nailing both of these. I'm standardizing on this as my only fiber gloss media from now on. Damn it's about time. I've wasted thousands on all these others over the years with mediocre results at best for black and white.
j

They got an award: 

http://harman.hahnemuehle.com/news/en/822/398/harman-by-hahnemuehle-series-honoured-as-world-best-fine-art-inkjet-paper-by-tipa.html

and well deserved too imho
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