Ad
Ad
Ad
Pages: « 1 ... 5 6 [7] 8 »   Bottom of Page
Print
Author Topic: MAC OSx Lion and printers  (Read 25540 times)
Richard Ripley
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 16


WWW
« Reply #120 on: July 16, 2011, 06:40:44 PM »
ReplyReply

I take heart that EpsonNet was recently updated to a Universal application (updated 6/29/11). I'll be contacting Epson today to see if there are plans to update the Epson LFP Remote Panel to a Universal app. I will be sure to post what I find out from my query. Keep the faith!
Logged
MrIconoclast
Jr. Member
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 83


« Reply #121 on: July 18, 2011, 12:32:42 PM »
ReplyReply

All of the discussion about Apple and how it handles change in interesting.

But, let's get back to the basic issue.

Which, if any, printer manufacturers have announced they will provide update drivers for LION?   Quality, professional printers are an expensive device, often costing more than the computers they are attached to.  The drivers need to be updated for all current printers and those sold in the past 5 years or so.   Older printers?  Well, I guess that is a matter for discussion.
Logged
MrIconoclast
Jr. Member
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 83


« Reply #122 on: July 18, 2011, 12:37:32 PM »
ReplyReply

For what it is worth, if the manufacturer of my less-than-two-years-old printer does NOT provide a LION driver I will do two things:

1.  Keep running Snow Leopard on my computer.

2.  Take an oath to never buy another printer from the manufacturer again.

Fool me once........

Logged
Alan Goldhammer
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1632


WWW
« Reply #123 on: July 18, 2011, 01:06:08 PM »
ReplyReply

For what it is worth, if the manufacturer of my less-than-two-years-old printer does NOT provide a LION driver I will do two things:

1.  Keep running Snow Leopard on my computer.

2.  Take an oath to never buy another printer from the manufacturer again.

Fool me once........


...or how about #3, I will buy a Win7 computer and never by from Apple again.  Why do you think the printer manufacturer should be at fault when it is clearly the vendor of your computer that is making it difficult?
Logged

Randy Carone
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 543


« Reply #124 on: July 18, 2011, 01:33:19 PM »
ReplyReply

Alan,

My thoughts exactly. I was considering a Mac laptop to replace my Windows laptop. I'm no longer considering it. I have yet to see a Mac that can offer me the value of my i7 powered Windows box.
Logged

Randy Carone
digitaldog
Sr. Member
****
Online Online

Posts: 9008



WWW
« Reply #125 on: July 18, 2011, 02:49:00 PM »
ReplyReply

...or how about #3, I will buy a Win7 computer and never by from Apple again. 

Well as someone on a Mac since 1988 and who just purchased his first Windows machine, I’ll pass and stick with Snow Leopard.  Less painful <g>
Logged

Andrew Rodney
Author “Color Management for Photographers”
http://digitaldog.net/
Alan Goldhammer
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1632


WWW
« Reply #126 on: July 18, 2011, 03:32:30 PM »
ReplyReply

Well as someone on a Mac since 1988 and who just purchased his first Windows machine, I’ll pass and stick with Snow Leopard.  Less painful <g>
Do Photoshop and Lightroom run differently (aside from the one control key difference)? Wink  This has always been weird to me that folks will pay a significant premium for a computer that really doesn't do anything any differently.  I've always been agnostic about the OS and my bottom line is that I was able to save $1000 when I last upgraded computers which allowed me to buy two new lenses for my Nikon.
Logged

digitaldog
Sr. Member
****
Online Online

Posts: 9008



WWW
« Reply #127 on: July 18, 2011, 03:38:14 PM »
ReplyReply

Do Photoshop and Lightroom run differently (aside from the one control key difference)? Wink 

Once in both app’s a tiny bit but that’s not the issue or point.

Its a lot like someone who’s worked in Aperture and switches to Lightroom (or vise versa). The process of doing all kinds of stuff other than working in the app;s themselves is just different and not as easy/expected/logical as I want simply because I’m used to a fixed way of working. This isn’t to say going the opposite direction (PC to Mac) wouldn’t be just as disagreeable. My point is, given the option to work with a Windows OS or stick with Snow Leopard (instead of upgrading to Lion), its an easy choice for me, I’ll stick with Snow Leopard.
Logged

Andrew Rodney
Author “Color Management for Photographers”
http://digitaldog.net/
Shane Webster
Jr. Member
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 73


« Reply #128 on: July 18, 2011, 03:57:37 PM »
ReplyReply

Quote
Why do you think the printer manufacturer should be at fault when it is clearly the vendor of your computer that is making it difficult?

If the printer is less than two years old, the printer manufacturer is at fault, IMO, because they released a product with software not native to the chipset contained with the then-shipping Apple computers (and had not been shipping in Macs for at least three years when the printer shipped). 
Logged
Alan Goldhammer
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1632


WWW
« Reply #129 on: July 18, 2011, 04:23:56 PM »
ReplyReply

Once in both app’s a tiny bit but that’s not the issue or point.

Its a lot like someone who’s worked in Aperture and switches to Lightroom (or vise versa). The process of doing all kinds of stuff other than working in the app;s themselves is just different and not as easy/expected/logical as I want simply because I’m used to a fixed way of working. This isn’t to say going the opposite direction (PC to Mac) wouldn’t be just as disagreeable. My point is, given the option to work with a Windows OS or stick with Snow Leopard (instead of upgrading to Lion), its an easy choice for me, I’ll stick with Snow Leopard.
That's a fair point if you are doing a lot of other stuff that may involve native Apple OS applications designed for that machine.  99% of my work is on LR, PS, Excel, Word, Outlook for e-mail, and Firefox for Internet.  I'm pretty sure all of these programs work on a Mac OS with the same functionality as on a Win machine (at least they do on my daughter's Macbook Pro (or what ever it's called).  I had no problem using her computer at all so for me the value proposition is not the design features of the OS (which are easy to learn in about 1 hour for either system) but the price of the hardware.  Anyway, I doubt that Win users will convince Mac users to switch and vice versa.  Bottom line is for both Apple and Microsoft to behave like good corporate citizens and not neglect we the customer.
Logged

Farmer
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1630


WWW
« Reply #130 on: July 18, 2011, 06:00:52 PM »
ReplyReply

Which, if any, printer manufacturers have announced they will provide update drivers for LION?   Quality, professional printers are an expensive device, often costing more than the computers they are attached to.  The drivers need to be updated for all current printers and those sold in the past 5 years or so.   Older printers?  Well, I guess that is a matter for discussion.

Let me start by saying, I think they all will.  Perhaps not five years (I'll get into that in a moment), but certainly all current and immediately past models are likely from the main 3 vendors at least.

Now let me ask something.  Why would you expect a printer vendor to provide an update, for free, for a previously unannounced/unavailable/unknown operating system for a model that is more than 2 generations old when the OS vendor won't even provide spare parts or hardware compatability for their upgraded OS with their older hardware?  You expect Epson, Canon and HP to support the older hardware on the newer OS, but not Apple?

Again, I think the reality is that they will support all current and immediately previous models and quite possibly back a little further.  5 years, though, is a long time and many generations of product.  They will end up providing more backward compatability than Apple itself.  The pritner vendors can not know Apple's (or Microsoft's) 5 year road map but you expect them to support it?

You don't have to upgrade your OS (unless your mac fails and you have to buy a new one, but then who is creating the onus of upgrade then - Apple) to continue doing what you're doing right now.  If you choose to upgrade, then you may need to upgrade other components.
Logged

Richard Ripley
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 16


WWW
« Reply #131 on: July 18, 2011, 06:33:48 PM »
ReplyReply

Just got off the phone with tech support at Epson. The drivers for the Epson 3880 will work in Lion. The EPSON LFP Remote Panel will not work and currently there are no plans to update that software so that it works in Lion. It may be updated if there are enough support calls but the functionality of that software can also be found on the top panel of the printer according to Epson tech support. Hope that helps folks who use the 3880 and are thinking of moving to Lion at some point.
Logged
Light Seeker
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 255


« Reply #132 on: July 18, 2011, 07:21:16 PM »
ReplyReply

Now let me ask something.  Why would you expect a printer vendor to provide an update, for free, for a previously unannounced/unavailable/unknown operating system for a model that is more than 2 generations old when the OS vendor won't even provide spare parts or hardware compatability for their upgraded OS with their older hardware?  You expect Epson, Canon and HP to support the older hardware on the newer OS, but not Apple?

I would answer your questions in two ways. First, the printer vendors you mention have been at this for a long time and know / plan for period updates driven by operating system changes. Planning for this would likely have been taken into account in the initial product costing model. Second, I do expect Apple to behave in the same manner, and I'm disappointed with some of what I've read in this thread.

Just got off the phone with tech support at Epson. The drivers for the Epson 3880 will work in Lion. The EPSON LFP Remote Panel will not work and currently there are no plans to update that software so that it works in Lion. It may be updated if there are enough support calls but the functionality of that software can also be found on the top panel of the printer according to Epson tech support. Hope that helps folks who use the 3880 and are thinking of moving to Lion at some point.

That's good to know, and encouraging. I have a 3800 that has been cascaded from doing general colour work to doing dedicated b/w printing. My old 2200 is still working fine as a b/w test bed under Snow Leopard, and it would boggle my mind if I were to find out that my 3800 was not supported under Lion.

Terry.
Logged
MrIconoclast
Jr. Member
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 83


« Reply #133 on: July 18, 2011, 08:26:22 PM »
ReplyReply

Farmer,

I would expect both the printer vendor and the computer vendor to realize that I am its customer, that I have spent a good amount of my monehy to purchase their products, and that it is not unreasonable to expect to be able to use them for more than a year or two.  I would expect them to work together to ensure that reasonably current products are supported (0-5 years old), and more if possible.

If they don't want to provide new drivers then I would expect them to give the specs to some 3rd party operation that would be willing to write the drivers.  i would pay the 3rd party for the drivers.  But, I would also be very disspointed that the manufacturer chose to not provide the support.   
Logged
Mark D Segal
Contributor
Sr. Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 6904


WWW
« Reply #134 on: July 18, 2011, 08:32:03 PM »
ReplyReply

Yes, I have been raising in various threads for years now the dismal state of cooperation and coordination in this industry. One can go back and forth blaming Apple or blaming Epson or blaming Adobe, but it all boils down to a major state of disconnect affecting the performance of the whole industry. I don't know whether there is a solution to it, but the ways things (don't) work as well as they should now, customers are being under-served in serious ways and somehow it should be cleaned-up. The technical and commercial aspects of it are difficult, but that makes it all the more a useful challenge.
Logged

Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
Author: "Scanning Workflows with SilverFast 8....." http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/film/scanning_workflows_with_silverfast_8.shtml
mfryd
Jr. Member
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 93


« Reply #135 on: July 18, 2011, 08:41:40 PM »
ReplyReply

Farmer,

I would expect both the printer vendor and the computer vendor to realize that I am its customer, that I have spent a good amount of my monehy to purchase their products, and that it is not unreasonable to expect to be able to use them for more than a year or two.  I would expect them to work together to ensure that reasonably current products are supported (0-5 years old), and more if possible.

If they don't want to provide new drivers then I would expect them to give the specs to some 3rd party operation that would be willing to write the drivers.  i would pay the 3rd party for the drivers.  But, I would also be very disspointed that the manufacturer chose to not provide the support.   


If you want your computer investment to last a long time, you should consider this when choosing your platform.

If you always upgrade your computers at every opportunity, and always upgrade to the latest and greatest, than either Mac or Windows will work.

Perhaps you have some software that you use rarely, and don't need the latest version.  Perhaps you have a very expensive printer and want it to last five or ten years.  If you fall into this category, you should research the policies and track histories of the platform before investing.

With Apple, there are no published policies.  Apple has been issuing security updates for both the current and one previous version of the OS.  They have made no commitment to continue this.  Apple has no published policy on how long software or hardware will be supported, and has been known to discontinue technology without any advance official notice.  Apple also has a history of aggressively eliminating outdated technology and embracing new technology.  New Macs won't run older OS versions.  When you replace a Mac, you may be forced to upgrade a large percentage of your software.

For many people, Apple's behavior is a good fit.  Others find that they need to update hardware and software far more frequently than they like.


The Windows platform has a different history.  Modern computers can run old operating systems, and new operating systems can run old software.  If you want to run old software, the Windows platform is more likely to allow this.

Again, for some this is a disadvantage, and for some it's an advantage.


Of course, this isn't the only difference between the two platforms.  Any rational decision should take the other factors into account as well.

Logged
Farmer
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1630


WWW
« Reply #136 on: July 19, 2011, 05:42:14 AM »
ReplyReply

To be honest, Mark, you don't see this issue on Windows.  I think it's a little obvious, therefore, to draw some conclusions about where the problem lies...

That said, it's not a problem for a lot of users, so it shouldn't be blown up to be more than it is, but for those for whom it is an issue, they are not Windows users.
Logged

Alan Goldhammer
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1632


WWW
« Reply #137 on: July 19, 2011, 06:33:53 AM »
ReplyReply

Yes, I have been raising in various threads for years now the dismal state of cooperation and coordination in this industry. One can go back and forth blaming Apple or blaming Epson or blaming Adobe, but it all boils down to a major state of disconnect affecting the performance of the whole industry. I don't know whether there is a solution to it, but the ways things (don't) work as well as they should now, customers are being under-served in serious ways and somehow it should be cleaned-up. The technical and commercial aspects of it are difficult, but that makes it all the more a useful challenge.
Mark, we photographers with our special needs are a drop in the bucket (maybe more like a single grain of sand on the beach) in terms of ultimate market size.  Apple does have Aperture as it's photo processing software and may also believe that most of its Mac users just want to do snapshots or at most letter size prints.  This can be accomplished by small multi-purpose printers using glossy dye based inkjet printers (that are cheap and can be replaced as necessary if the OS requires it).  Niche markets are always a difficult place to operate particularly when one party is dependent on another to insure things work.  The behemoths may not care much for cooperation particularly if it diverts resources for a minimal financial gain.  Too bad really.
Logged

Mark D Segal
Contributor
Sr. Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 6904


WWW
« Reply #138 on: July 19, 2011, 06:59:40 AM »
ReplyReply

About 50% of the graphics arts market including photography is on Apple computer systems and the total number of people world-wide is not small. I don't know what fraction of it needs to know or care about colour management, but I'll bet a very high proportion want and expect consistent colour from their displays to their printers. I agree that much of the grief can be laid at the door of Apple Computer Inc., but all that does is add emphasis in their direction to the general point I was making.
Logged

Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
Author: "Scanning Workflows with SilverFast 8....." http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/film/scanning_workflows_with_silverfast_8.shtml
Alan Goldhammer
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1632


WWW
« Reply #139 on: July 19, 2011, 07:45:45 AM »
ReplyReply

About 50% of the graphics arts market including photography is on Apple computer systems and the total number of people world-wide is not small. I don't know what fraction of it needs to know or care about colour management, but I'll bet a very high proportion want and expect consistent colour from their displays to their printers. I agree that much of the grief can be laid at the door of Apple Computer Inc., but all that does is add emphasis in their direction to the general point I was making.
I know that a lot of design people use Photoshop and other Adobe tools for non-photographic purposes and maybe they are in corporate environments where these incremental costs are more easily handled than by a sole practitioner photographer.  I don't have a good feeling about how the Mac sales break down regarding the different sectors.  I know the Apple store near me is always crowded whenever I am in the neighborhood but this is mostly a student/individual crowd.
Logged

Pages: « 1 ... 5 6 [7] 8 »   Top of Page
Print
Jump to:  

Ad
Ad
Ad