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Author Topic: Please help!! Very Urgent! Epson 9880 colours blocking up  (Read 13661 times)
NickCroken
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« Reply #40 on: August 16, 2011, 11:06:02 PM »
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If it is the cartridge how do you suggest I clear the air from the lines once I put a new cartridge in?
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irvweiner
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« Reply #41 on: August 16, 2011, 11:47:16 PM »
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tell Visitek to read my post--if necessary read it to them--til they get it!
Make certain they check the integrity of the cart-printer interface--especially for dirt,debris or disaster!!!

good luck    irv weiner
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NickCroken
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« Reply #42 on: August 17, 2011, 12:35:29 AM »
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Irv,
How do I purge the air in the cyan line that is causin the problem. Or does the cartridge with a fresh seal do that on it's own.  I'm picturing a system similar to brake lines and bleeding but I'm probably wrong   
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irvweiner
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« Reply #43 on: August 17, 2011, 02:06:31 AM »
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Normally, except that this may not be a norm sit, several gentle cleaning cycles should do it-avoid any heavy duty cleaning runs for now. Remember, we don't know yet where the leak is--my worry is possible damage to the cyan inlet ink port to the printer. I'm running a 3880, a smaller brother to your 9880, the function is the same but the physical hardware is 'different'.

I assume your 'fuel system' is pressurized as is the 3880, therefore the ink is 'pushed' down the lines and then 'sucked' into the printhead. This is probably occurring but after some active printing, the ink is being blocked 'somewhere', and I now realize that there can be some debris in the cart exit port, the cart pressure inlet port or ink inlet port on the printhead.
I re-note that you were successful in printing several small test prints--now that sounds reasonable. In between test prints while you're sweating it out the 'possible' debris settles down--wherever it is. But when you retry the big pic, the debris is disturbed and starts building up blockage of Huh-this blocked location then drastically reduces the cyan flow or stops it. When you stop printing the debris 'settles' down. Nice!!

Could the debris be in the exit port of the cart--and then migrated into the input port of the printhead resulting in 2 active debris sites? Could the debris be located further in the printhead? The key note here is your printer mechanically and electrically is functioning-good! I think the problem now is to find the 'shmutz'. If this were a car brake system, you can easily unbolt and look-but it isn't.

The search path becomes clear-but how to for 'us' is not. A first step is to replace the cyan cart, if still no change, its possible that cyan cart had debris and spread its cancer-put it aside. It is quite possible that the check valve in the cart's exit port is flakey-let's hope. Now if the input port to the printer has debris in it--how do we clean it? Thirdly, if there is debris in the printhead-how do we clean it?? BTW, do not shake the carts vigorously, you will cause foaming.
What we do know is that the 'clog' is usage dependent--the longer the continuous print time, the greater the chance of a clog--in your case 100% in x minutes. I'm quite certain if you tried to print 10+ 4X6 at once. you wont make it.
If you are in warranty or have a repair contract, this is a job for Epson techs, now that you can inform them of the actual most probable cause.

BTW, what do YOU mean by posterization, if you are losing cyan during printing, your image should show a very warm cast but still have normal detail. Is this so? If not, what does your 'bad' part of the image look like, are you seeing blocks of pixels?

Let us know what happens when you use a new cyan cart.

irv weiner
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Ernst Dinkla
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« Reply #44 on: August 17, 2011, 02:22:32 AM »
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Nick,  it's not ink starvation per se, it's air leaking into the system and 'replacing' the ink in the ink path. I have had this problem previously with cart(s) that 'leaked' air into the 'fuel system'. I would do a simple clean or nozzle check and all looked OK--even print a small test print-also OK. However, when I re-reprinted my image, I saw that cantankerous cart misbehaving again. What is actually happening? For a small test print, after a clean, the 'fuel system' starts out 'mostly' refilled and the print is OK. But now when you re-print the big print, you're still OK, except for the air leaking into the fuel system while printing occurs. Once the leaked air replaces the ink in that 'fuel line' you will be in starvation mode--no or little ink will be further delivered from that cart(s). This are the 'horror' cycles I believe you are experiencing--until you find the entrance for the leaked air this problem will repeat.
Obviously, you will need to check the integrity of the 'fuel lines', the seal in the cart and even the surface region where the cart seals against the printhead assy. even if I'm dead wrong I dont know why Epson never brought this topic up.

I hope my comments will be of some aid-ring Epson's bell once again, wake them up, this not an unknown phenomenon!

irv weiner


It is true that piëzo heads become very ineffective in pumping ink when air is in the lines. While there could be a relation between the new cart and the problem I am a bit curious whether you had your issue with a 9900.  Air leaking into an ink channel usually happened at the damper connection at the head side or when air had been trapped in a new cart. But the 9900 carts have a sensor in the ink outlet that should be triggered with any air being in that cart and flowing out. I think exchanging the cart with a new one may help but more likely because a small hole in the cart's pressure chamber keeps the overall air/ink pressure too low but not low enough to trigger the pressure sensor. In the past air in the lines at least showed in bad nozzle check prints, fast changes in "blocked" nozzles for every new nozzle check print. Perfect nozzle checks but lousy prints were usually the result of bad ink flow: dirty dampers and issues closer to the carts like cart slot needles being blocked or low pressure.

met vriendelijke groeten, Ernst

Dinkla Gallery Canvas Wrap Actions for Photoshop

http://www.pigment-print.com/dinklacanvaswraps/index.html


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irvweiner
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« Reply #45 on: August 17, 2011, 01:31:34 PM »
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Nick, I suggest you contact Art and discuss this problem. He is very familiar with the printer world and publishes a group of free guides concerning  the survival and repair of printers. He is a very frequent contributor to the Yahoo printer forums.

 "Arthur Entlich" e-printerhelp@shaw.ca   eprinterhelp


irv weiner
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NickCroken
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« Reply #46 on: August 17, 2011, 02:16:24 PM »
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Hi Irv,
I just installed the new cartridge, did a couple of cleanings and had the same result.  Samples of what the prints are looking like are presented on the first page of this thread.  I really had my fingers crossed that this would  be the ticket but it appears not to be.
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Farmer
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« Reply #47 on: August 17, 2011, 05:17:54 PM »
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With all due respect to Irv, there's no way that was the problem based on the sample print you showed here.  Posterisation is not the result of a missing nozzle (or nozzles) here.  The colours are true, just posterised.

I think several of us have suggested various paths of actions and asked various questions.  I would suggest reviewing and go through a thorough testing process of elimination rather than waiting for a "magic bullet" answer.

Get some help from Qimage, do some testing with the straight driver, respond to queries about output PPI etc, consider creating a large set of gradations (CMYK) and look to see if any of them posterise.
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cybis
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« Reply #48 on: August 18, 2011, 12:20:08 AM »
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Here's something else to try assuming nozzles do indeed drop out during printing. Perform a nozzle check before and after a large print, if they are both fine then it's probably not the issue. If on the other hand you loose nozzles while printing, try this:

Quote from: Epson
Nozzle drop out while printing indicates a ink supply issue. The Print Head demands ink during the printing process, and the Ink System does not deliver it properly. The Print Head slowly “starves” for Ink. A cleaning cycle delivers a much stronger demand on the Ink System and will refill the Print Head with Ink. The process of printing will once again “starve” the Print Head.

1. Determine the amount of printing that it takes for the Nozzles to drop out.
    1.1 Note that interval.

2. Perform a Power Cleaning cycle.
    2.1 Perform a nozzle check and ensure that all of the nozzles are working.
        The purpose of the Power Cleaning cycle is to remove any air in the Dampers that might restrict ink flow.

3. Print until the interval in step 1 has been exceeded (2 times the interval is recommended).

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Ernst Dinkla
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« Reply #49 on: August 18, 2011, 02:18:53 AM »
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With the samples shown I would not think of ink supply issues either. You did not see any of this in the image at pixel size zoom? Did you make softproof checks with the profile, something out of gamut in that area? Even then there should be a better representation of the image colors so check whether there is no double profiling done etc. A bad profile is still possible. Try perceptual and relative colormetric rendering with a profile for the 9880 from the paper manufacturer etc. I hope you are not using a 9900 profile for a 9880. Qimage's color should not differ from Photoshop color if all the settings are correct, no odd print filter interfering in Qimage?


met vriendelijke groeten, Ernst


Dinkla Gallery Canvas Wrap Actions for Photoshop

http://www.pigment-print.com/dinklacanvaswraps/index.html
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davidh202
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« Reply #50 on: August 21, 2011, 12:00:29 PM »
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Ok Nick It's been a week.
As Paul Harvey used to say...


" And now for the rest of the story" ?

After so much anguish, and a cry for help, I think we all deserve a follow up, if you have figured out your problem?
I'd like to think this would be a learning experience for all.
David
 
« Last Edit: August 21, 2011, 12:02:22 PM by davidh202 » Logged
NickCroken
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« Reply #51 on: August 21, 2011, 12:13:04 PM »
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Sorry, I have been out of reception In the mountains for a couple days.  The issue is still not fixed, Epson Canada is now looking into.  I'm about to be getting  on a sailboat where I'll be out of reception as well.  I'll be back Monday!
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davidh202
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« Reply #52 on: August 27, 2011, 04:47:13 PM »
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Bump...  another week gone by ?
Sure seems like Sailing and Vacationing took precedence over your printing  "Urgency"
Hope you had a swell time  Roll Eyes

Any news?
  David
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NickCroken
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« Reply #53 on: August 27, 2011, 05:07:31 PM »
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I'm sorry guys, I meant Monday the 29. The printer urgency has been on my mind the entire time and am hoping to have it fixed by next Wednesday as I have a large backlog of work.  I'd have stayed home to fix the printer had the trip not been planne for 8 months. 

I just arrived in Vancouver, I'll report back as soon as I hear something from Epson or try more test. 
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davidh202
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« Reply #54 on: August 27, 2011, 05:46:31 PM »
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Hi Nick, hope you did have a good time.Not trying to bust chops just real curious.  Unfortunately many of us can turn other peoples problems into a  learning experience. ;-)

David
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NickCroken
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« Reply #55 on: August 29, 2011, 04:26:02 PM »
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Here is an update.  I have been talking with an Epson professional throughout the day and still am not really getting anywhere.  I've printed an epson diagnostic file perfectly.  I did however try printing a gradient of the two trouble areas and ended up with a couple weird white areas on the print.  I have attached the sample below.
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deanwork
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« Reply #56 on: August 29, 2011, 06:44:33 PM »
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Do you realize that these Epson inks, combined with the way the carts are inserted into the machine, have a way of becoming separated from the base.

What I really like about the Canon and HP printers is the way the ink carts are always inserted with the opening facing down. The carts drain completely this way and don't need any odd pressure situations to move the ink flow smoothly.

Do you shake your carts occasionally? The pigments need to be suspended in a uniform blended way. You could still see a good nozzle check but have unsuspended pigments in the carts, lines, and dampers.

If you haven't taken the carts out and shaken them well, I would definitely do that. Then if it were me I'd do a couple of deep cleanings, or print out a purge color gradient in a big size on cheap paper to purge all the channels. This happens all the time when people think their dampers are clogged or their heads are bad when in reality their inks are not in  adequate suspension. Epson never told me to shake my carts except when installing them. That is a mistake.

j
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davidh202
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« Reply #57 on: August 29, 2011, 09:49:03 PM »
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I agree with what you say about the need to keep the inks in suspension (makes sense) but that doesn't account for the considerable amount of ink already in the tubes feeding the print head.
Your solution would require frequently removing and shaking the carts. Doesn't that run the risk of prematurely  wearing of the carts insertion seal and the possibility of pressurization problems from leaking, and also introducing air into the feed tubes?
« Last Edit: August 29, 2011, 09:54:40 PM by davidh202 » Logged
deanwork
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« Reply #58 on: August 29, 2011, 10:08:31 PM »
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Look man, if that is the case then this is one hell of an over engineered, frustrating, back assward piece of equipment. They never got figured out. I don't know how they could go from the perfectly engineered heads they designed for the Rolands, the Mimakis, the 10K series a decade ago that never had these issues to this crap. It just baffles the mind.



I agree with what you say about the need to keep the inks in suspension (makes sense) but that doesn't account for the considerable amount of ink already in the tubes feeding the print head.
Your solution would require frequently removing and shaking the carts. Doesn't that run the risk of prematurely  wearing of the carts insertion seal and the possibility of pressurization problems from leaking, and also introducing air into the feed tubes?
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davidh202
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« Reply #59 on: August 29, 2011, 10:31:54 PM »
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Nick,
The areas your showing us now do not appear to be related to the original pics you posted that did appear to be posterized.
 Unless I'm nuts these appear to be damaged areas of the paper (scuffs), or a bad 'emulsion' (for lack of a better term), on the  paper surface that has not absorbed any ink. Is this EX Fiber paper?
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