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Author Topic: Please help!! Very Urgent! Epson 9880 colours blocking up  (Read 13730 times)
Farmer
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« Reply #60 on: August 30, 2011, 02:29:21 AM »
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Yes, Dean, we all know you don't like Epsons.  Thanks.

There's no particular need to constantly shake the cartridges if the printer is in regular use.  The agitation of the ink flowing through the tubes to the head is plenty to ensure that the pigment particles are properly suspended.  Unless the cartridges are left unused for many months, or unless you actually see a problem (and what you're seeing has nothing to do with pigment separation) then there's no need to shake them.

Also, placing an ink cartridge "valve down" doesn't remove the need to pump the ink to the head.  The Canons and HPs don't rely purely on gravity to feed ink (if they did, it would fail, since the entire cartridge is not above the print head).

To the OP - can you make the file available somewhere for someone else with the same printer to test for you?
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deanwork
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« Reply #61 on: August 30, 2011, 10:56:08 AM »
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Actually I like Epsons, and their great dither and gamut beats everything. What I don't like is all the hassle people have with missing nozzles and the unsatisfactory method they have created for pressurizing these carts when they had a pressurized cart/head design that worked great with the 10K a decade ago. And IF you don't use your printer regularly you should shake the carts. With the Canon it  does a thorough job of suspending the inks without taking them out whether you are printing for months or not.
« Last Edit: August 30, 2011, 11:35:17 AM by deanwork » Logged
davidh202
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« Reply #62 on: August 30, 2011, 12:18:59 PM »
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Nick,
You say that the Epson file works fine, you still have not told us if this is problem related to only this 1 file of your own?

Have you checked to see if the color space you originally saved the file in has somehow been converted to a smaller gamut color space, unable to render the smooth gradient tonalities effectively?
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NickCroken
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« Reply #63 on: August 30, 2011, 12:52:20 PM »
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The epson test file was a simple colour swatch grouping.  I could email someone the file in jpeg form. 

This is happening with one of my files with the cyan gradient as well as one of my clients files where there are cyans in the clouds.  PM and I can send the file to the address.
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NickCroken
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« Reply #64 on: September 04, 2011, 10:39:15 PM »
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UPDATE

I have just determined that Qimage is the problem.  I let the printer manage colour instead of Qimage (opposite of what I have been told to do all along) and the gradient went away. I have sent Mike @ Qimage an email with the new findings.

As soon as he responds I'll fill you in on what is happening.
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Farmer
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« Reply #65 on: September 04, 2011, 11:11:03 PM »
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Hmmm - I hope this is the case so that you can get some assistance, but back in mid August you mentioned that you printed directly from Photoshop and got the same results, so it more seems like a profile error/issue than Qimage or driver.

I did suggest using canned profiles from Epson to test - did you have a chance to try that?
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NickCroken
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« Reply #66 on: September 04, 2011, 11:13:25 PM »
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I had tried that and they didn't jive.  Qimage was spitting out the weird gradient.  Now, with the printer managing the colour it works fine.  I didn't think it was profile based because it affected all of my substrates and their respective profiles.
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scuba_d
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« Reply #67 on: September 05, 2011, 02:05:59 AM »
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Just to report that Qimage has a trouble managing some of my colour munki profiles.
I print on Epson 4880 and latest Qimage Studio edition 2010.202.

On images with highly saturated colours a strong colour shift occurs. It happens in a place of few square mm. where the most saturated colour is.  It is very rare to happen and I have not mentioned it to Mike at Qimage.
Printing the same image from PS – no colour shifts.

I thought my case is isolated one, but it seems Qimage has an issue applying some colour profiles.



Atanas
« Last Edit: September 05, 2011, 07:56:45 AM by scuba_d » Logged

Atanas Petrov
Ernst Dinkla
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« Reply #68 on: September 05, 2011, 02:49:11 AM »
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UPDATE

I have just determined that Qimage is the problem.  I let the printer manage colour instead of Qimage (opposite of what I have been told to do all along) and the gradient went away. I have sent Mike @ Qimage an email with the new findings.

As soon as he responds I'll fill you in on what is happening.

Could you mention in what Qimage DDIsoftware forum you posted the new findings, I like to follow the thread there.


met vriendelijke groeten, Ernst

New: Spectral plots of +250 inkjet papers:

http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm

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NickCroken
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« Reply #69 on: September 05, 2011, 10:54:40 AM »
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I have been posting here exclusively and emailing Mike directly.

Mike replied saying that my profiles were the issues and that when he used my profile to print in photoshop he had the same issue.  When I print from photoshop my images are perfect.  At this stage I believe that something in Qimage has potentially corrupted and is now not reading my profiles properly.
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Ernst Dinkla
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« Reply #70 on: September 06, 2011, 02:05:06 AM »
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I have been posting here exclusively and emailing Mike directly.

Mike replied saying that my profiles were the issues and that when he used my profile to print in photoshop he had the same issue.  When I print from photoshop my images are perfect.  At this stage I believe that something in Qimage has potentially corrupted and is now not reading my profiles properly.

If that is the case it would be good to discuss it at the Qimage forum so we leave no stone unturned to solve this.


met vriendelijke groeten, Ernst

Try: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Wide_Inkjet_Printers/
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NickCroken
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« Reply #71 on: September 06, 2011, 12:04:42 PM »
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I still don't believe that my profile is the issue.  I have generated a new one.  Would someone be kind enough to test my profile and a small crop of the trouble issue?  I could email you the profile and the image.
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jc1
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« Reply #72 on: September 13, 2011, 10:50:50 PM »
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I still don't believe that my profile is the issue.  I have generated a new one.  Would someone be kind enough to test my profile and a small crop of the trouble issue?  I could email you the profile and the image.
If you can send it to my Dropbox or pm me a download link.

Thanks

jc1
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jc1
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« Reply #73 on: September 14, 2011, 04:44:07 AM »
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I still don't believe that my profile is the issue.  I have generated a new one.  Would someone be kind enough to test my profile and a small crop of the trouble issue?  I could email you the profile and the image.

Your files were received.
 
Check if this profile helps < download >
I can only verify it with CS (windows) and with the help of some test patches. I have no idea on the actual color reproduction with this profile.  < click to view>
where
1 and 4: your profile, RelCol and Perceptual
2 and 5: original
3 and 6: jc1's profile, RelCol and Perceptual

Regards,
jc1
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NickCroken
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« Reply #74 on: September 14, 2011, 10:20:53 AM »
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See your profile looks way better in the gradients but the colours seem a bit dark. 
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jc1
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« Reply #75 on: September 14, 2011, 07:59:00 PM »
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See your profile looks way better in the gradients but the colours seem a bit dark. 
A bit dark, are you comparing it with the actual printout?
 
There are strange behaviors with your printer profile.
a. The absolute gamut (AtoB) seems to be alright but not the rendered gamut (BtoA).
    The rendered gamut volume cannot be calculated though it can be displayed on screen.
    The rendered gamut of your printer (profile) appears much smaller than its absolute gamut, see (b) for reasoning.

     Reference: absolute vs rendered gamut
     http://www.colorwiki.com/wiki/Color_Management_Myths_26-28

b. The printer gamut was rather small compared with that for sRGB or the printer profile generated by jc1, when viewed with Gamutvison.

c. Change in hue after conversion, as demonstrated below.
    The images were converted to the printer color space with Relative Colorimetric intent.
   

 

Latest and newer profilers may solve your problem, just a suggestion.

jc1
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NickCroken
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« Reply #76 on: September 15, 2011, 10:26:01 AM »
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Please forgive my lack of experience in this situation.  Is the magenta where I am losing integrity? The profile I sent was the most recent one.  What are you using to make your profiles?  I am considering purchasing this kit from i1 http://xritephoto.com/ph_product_overview.aspx?ID=1464 although I'd like to know for sure that my profiles are the issue not any of the software handling them.  Also, with that kit, I don't need the monitor calibrating software as I have a NEC spectraview setup. Are there any alternatives that would do as good of a job for potentially less money?
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Alan Goldhammer
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« Reply #77 on: September 15, 2011, 11:08:33 AM »
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Please forgive my lack of experience in this situation.  Is the magenta where I am losing integrity? The profile I sent was the most recent one.  What are you using to make your profiles?  I am considering purchasing this kit from i1 http://xritephoto.com/ph_product_overview.aspx?ID=1464 although I'd like to know for sure that my profiles are the issue not any of the software handling them.  Also, with that kit, I don't need the monitor calibrating software as I have a NEC spectraview setup. Are there any alternatives that would do as good of a job for potentially less money?
Depending on how much time you want to spend learning the system, ArgyllCMS is free software and delivers exceptional results.  You would need at a minimum a ColorMunki though an i1 Pro would be preferable since it's easier to read patches with.
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NickCroken
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« Reply #78 on: September 15, 2011, 11:33:00 AM »
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I have a patch reader already but I'm starting to think that the reader/my software from spyder is garbage.  I am in the process of trying to communicate with the lead developer at spyder but he appears to have ceased communication with me since I have sent him the profiles generated with his software.
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jc1
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« Reply #79 on: September 16, 2011, 12:15:57 AM »
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Is the magenta where I am losing integrity?
The profile I sent was the most recent one.  What are you using to make your profiles?
Refer to the earlier 2D gamut plot.

The test image (from you) was converted with RelCol (Relative Colorimetric, CS5) and its xyz co-ordinates were plotted in the xyY space.
a) Points in RED represent the original data.
b) Points in GREEN (mostly convered up by RED) represent the data after converting with jc1 profile (see below, Profile4)
c) Points in MAGENTA were data after converting with your profile (see below, Profile1). They were shifted slightly towards the red primary, compared with the original data points. IMHO, the shift towards the Red primary is small and might be insignificant. I compared it with profiles built by other profilers, generally they are very similar (Gamut boundary, neutrality and so on).

The profile that I created earlier was derived from the AtoB tag of the your profile, and that was before the measurement data was received. The measured data file was non-standard and  I edited and recreated it for further use. The RGB reference was derived from the supplied target tiff image.

More Tests
Profile1: custom profile by nick
Profile2: profile generated with PM5, with measured data supplied by nick
Profile3: profile generated with another profiler, with measured data supplied by nick
Profile4. profile generated with  the profiler used to creat Profile3, with measured data derived from AtoB of Profiler1.

Test patches: 4096, RGB with 17-pitch, similar to this

Comparison of the 4 profiles

                           ΔE2000
              Avg    90%  95%   Max error   
Profile1     0        0       0        0            (reference)
Profile2     1.02   1.67   1.93    3.98
Profile3     0.68    1.04  1.14    2.07
Profile4     0.08    0.18   0.23   0.86


Comments
1. No flaw was detected on Profile1 with the test sample, though its (absolute) gamut with Relcol exhibits abnormal behavior.
    Note: gamut observed with Perceptual intent is normal for profile1.
2. Only profile1 exhibits the boundary effect with the test image.

Profiles are available upon request.

jc

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