Ad
Ad
Ad
Pages: « 1 [2]   Bottom of Page
Print
Author Topic: Fuji X10 camera  (Read 8969 times)
aaron
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 135


WWW
« Reply #20 on: November 06, 2011, 06:15:23 PM »
ReplyReply

There's no mention of the X10's optical viewfinder in Michael's report other than o say its better than the G12 etc.. Can anyone who has experienced it comment on its performance?

Thanks!
Logged
Mark D Segal
Contributor
Sr. Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 7054


WWW
« Reply #21 on: November 06, 2011, 06:40:12 PM »
ReplyReply

I bought a Sony NEX-5N so I'm not in the market for the Fuji X-10, but I read Michael's - as usual - lucid, practical review, and my conclusion is that if I were buying a camera in or around that class today, it would not be this one. If I understand correctly, the lack of Lightroom support for its raw files makes it a deal-breaker.
Logged

Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
Author: "Scanning Workflows with SilverFast 8....." http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/film/scanning_workflows_with_silverfast_8.shtml
michael
Administrator
Sr. Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 4916



« Reply #22 on: November 06, 2011, 08:11:28 PM »
ReplyReply

Whether a camera is supported by Lightroom or Camera Raw is a matter of timing. The X-10 simply came out right after the last update. Just give it a little while till the next rev.

Michael
Logged
Mark D Segal
Contributor
Sr. Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 7054


WWW
« Reply #23 on: November 06, 2011, 08:20:48 PM »
ReplyReply

Oh - OK; I read more into that statement in your review than justified. I was left with the impression that their raw format would not be amenable to processing in LR or ACR period; but clearly it's a better story given time.
Logged

Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
Author: "Scanning Workflows with SilverFast 8....." http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/film/scanning_workflows_with_silverfast_8.shtml
AlexRobinson
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 17


« Reply #24 on: November 07, 2011, 01:57:06 AM »
ReplyReply

wow, my first post!

Review was excellent, pretty much summed up what I thought the camera would be like in the field.

I was lucky enough to handle one todayóit's been a number of months since I got to briefly play with several preproduction ones (the only ones in the southern hemisphere at the time). Sadly, only 20 made it to New Zealand in the first shipment and I know we sold our 5 long before they arrived here. Needless to say, just like the X100 it'll be a hot ticket item for some months. I really love the feel of it, after spending yesterday finally properly shooting with the X100 after selling dozens of them and never using one out of store the appeal of them has increased significantly. Everything I saw on the preproduction X10 (only indoors and night shots) led me to believe it would be very good and the fit and finish of the production one seems very nice.

Up until now all the so-called serious compacts I've used have always left me feeling somewhat disappointed, they always felt like they were made to sit just below the company's headline cameras for marketing reasons whereas it seems like Fuji actually genuinely made the best hardware they could at the price point. Yes it's expensive now but as time goes on it'll come down, sadly at $899 NZD it's about $100 USD more than buying it in the US.

I just can't wait for their mirror less APS camera next year, I'm still tossing up between buying the next Nikon D800 or whatever it's called or ditching the lot and going mirror less with Fuji or Samsung.
Logged
edhombre
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2


« Reply #25 on: November 07, 2011, 07:13:51 AM »
ReplyReply

Just a little note on the Fuji EXR sensor. I used to have a F200EXR as my point and shoot and that did not shoot raw. The EXR implementation tends to be effective if overcomplex but if you are shooting you can get all the benefits of shooting EXR by simply changing the image size to medium. The processor seems to do all the pixel binning magic (higher dynamic range, improved highlight retention, better high iso performance) so you can continue to shoot PASM etc without having use crippled EXR modes and keeping full control. You will of course be limited to 6mp but that isn't really a limitation for a lot of shooters whose fundamental delivery is online. Tests showed that certainly in the point and shoot world the 6mp pixel binned results retained more detail even when resized to 12mp than shooting at full resolution.

I was very charmed by the results on the F200 and it did indeed have a cracking little lens.... Fuji are very good at doing these things. 
Logged
jenbenn
Jr. Member
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 69


WWW
« Reply #26 on: November 07, 2011, 11:50:05 AM »
ReplyReply

Michael,
how does the x10's IQ compare to an APS-C DSLR at low ISo (100-400). I wonder wether I could use the x10 as a secondary camera to supply images to my agency, which only accepts DSLR-like quality.
Thanks
Logged
edhombre
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2


« Reply #27 on: November 07, 2011, 11:54:46 AM »
ReplyReply

Here's a little bunch of FINE looking F200exr shots... You should be able to exceed this quality with the x10. Only you can say if that will be good enough.

http://nickbland.zenfolio.com/?q=f200exr
Logged
BernardLanguillier
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 8361



WWW
« Reply #28 on: November 07, 2011, 01:11:01 PM »
ReplyReply

Who are the rivals of the X10? I believe that to answer this question, we first need to decide whether the X10 be seen as a photographic tool or as a potential object of love for camera lovers.

At the risk of being controversial, I believe that these are mostly 2 different things. Why am I saying so?

I believe that controls are mostly used in compact digital cameras to enable the photographer to expand the range of manageable photographic situations where automation isn't smart enough to get the image right by itself. Controls have mostly a different meaning for DSLRs where they are a creative door opener. Indeed, DoF control is basically non existent in compacts and focus control is therefore not a super relevant contributor to the look of images unless you focus on maco like images. This doesn't mean that you cannot mess up a picture with poor AF, it means that focusing on something in the scene is mostly enough most of the time. Enhanced range finder like usage if you will.

Assuming we are looking at the X10 as a photographic tool, and therefore measure it by its ability to get the picture right in a wide set of situations for a given cost... then my view is that the Nikon J1 might be the most dangerous rival for the X10: much better AF, similar bulk, more flexibility thanks to choice of lenses, better image quality at a similar price point.

On top of this, I much prefer a clean Apple like interface if I don't need controls most of the time, which you just don't with the J1, it just gets the image right.

Now, it you are looking at the X10 as a potential object of love for camera lovers, then things get very different and the Nikon J1 isn't a competitor at all.

Since the J1 is not mentioned among the alternatives of the X10, my personal reading of the article is that it doesn't focus on photographic results, but more on the pleasure of using a nice UI.

Wrong reading/interpretation?

Cheers,
Bernard
Logged

A few images online here!
AFairley
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1199



« Reply #29 on: November 07, 2011, 02:47:47 PM »
ReplyReply

I love these new high-end compacts, but in terms of a carry-always camera that I can use for more than snapshots, the sensors are still too small for me to be able to print the way I want (my minimum acceptable sensor size being 4/3).  The only camera with a similar form factor and an integrated OVF/EVF is the NEX7, and there's nothing close to the size of the Panasonic pancake 14-42 X zoom, so the NEX7 ends up not being portable enough for me.  The Panny GX-1 is a great disappointment to me b/c of the lack of an integrated VF.  Right now I have my hopes set on the Fuji interchangeable lens mirrorless that's supposed to come out next February.  It's really frustrating see very otherwise terrific offerings that come out fall short in one area for me, forcing the choice between lugging DSLR and inability to print large.  (Large sensor, integrated VF, compact zoom: pick any two)
« Last Edit: November 07, 2011, 05:18:11 PM by AFairley » Logged

Mark D Segal
Contributor
Sr. Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 7054


WWW
« Reply #30 on: November 07, 2011, 03:24:55 PM »
ReplyReply

I love these new high-end compacts, but in terms of a carry-always camera that I can use for more than snapshots, the sensors are still too small for me to be able to print the way I want (my minimum acceptable size being 4/3).  The only camera with a similar form factor and an integrated OVF/EVF is the NEX7, and there's nothing close to the size of the Panasonic pancake 14-42 X zoom, so the NEX7 ends up not being portable enough for me.  The Panny GX-1 is a great disappointment to me b/c of the lack of an integrated VF.  Right now I have my hopes set on the Fuji interchangeable lens mirrorless that's supposed to come out next February.  It's really frustrating see very otherwise terrific offerings that come out fall short in one area for me, forcing the choice between lugging DSLR and inability to print large.  (Large sensor, integrated VF, compact zoom: pick any two)

From what I see on my display I think Michael is quite correct that a high quality A3 can be printed from a Sony NEX 5n. It has an APS-C sensor and 16.1 MP. That's a lot of resolution with a decent enough pixel pitch. I've made flash exopsures at ISO3200 and the quality seen at 100% in Lightroom is remarkable. As for portability, the camera with its kit lens, the flash, the EVF and the battery charger can all fit into a fairly small airline toiletry bag which drops nicely into a brief case. There are always compromises with whatever one buys, but this Sony is quite a remarkable little package.
Logged

Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
Author: "Scanning Workflows with SilverFast 8....." http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/film/scanning_workflows_with_silverfast_8.shtml
bjanes
Sr. Member
****
Online Online

Posts: 2868



« Reply #31 on: November 07, 2011, 03:58:50 PM »
ReplyReply

Hello,

Now this is going to be the camera I am getting the Christmas.

It has every thing the Fuji X100 has plus a zoom lens. Its traditional in looks and functionality with its old style controls which suits a old bugger like me and most of all a view finder so I donít need my glasses, perfect.

Looks like my Canon G10 is going on Trade Me (New Zealand's version of EBay)

It appears to have everything except for an APS sized sensor. I would wait to see if the IQ meets your needs.

Regards,

Bill
Logged
barbibul
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2


« Reply #32 on: November 07, 2011, 04:11:02 PM »
ReplyReply

I love these new high-end compacts, but in terms of a carry-always camera that I can use for more than snapshots, the sensors are still too small for me to be able to print the way I want (my minimum acceptable size being 4/3).  The only camera with a similar form factor and an integrated OVF/EVF is the NEX7, and there's nothing close to the size of the Panasonic pancake 14-42 X zoom, so the NEX7 ends up not being portable enough for me.  The Panny GX-1 is a great disappointment to me b/c of the lack of an integrated VF.  Right now I have my hopes set on the Fuji interchangeable lens mirrorless that's supposed to come out next February.  It's really frustrating see very otherwise terrific offerings that come out fall short in one area for me, forcing the choice between lugging DSLR and inability to print large.  (Large sensor, integrated VF, compact zoom: pick any two)
Well, Michael wrote "There's No Free Lunch" !
I'm just wondering how it actually compares to the Canon G12, and what's next for Canon.
My favorite (small) camera is a G10. I want to believe that the G12 is not the last G. This X10 is tempting, but I had a very bad experience with Panasonic and micro 4:3. I'm so used to Canon interface and ergonomics that my non-Canon experiences are usually bad.
Logged
uaiomex
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1008


WWW
« Reply #33 on: November 07, 2011, 07:54:10 PM »
ReplyReply

Sony still winning the race with Nex 7. Nothing is even near. GX1 + VF, just about the same price for both cameras. Features, IQ way better in the Sony. I'd love Panasonic to come with a m43 G camera just like the Nex 7 and that's is because of the power collapsable zoom lens. Other than that, not much to desire. Let's wait for better fit glass from Sony. They have to be around the corner.
Eduardo
Logged
HarperPhotos
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1252



WWW
« Reply #34 on: November 07, 2011, 10:01:53 PM »
ReplyReply

Hello,

Well after a day with my new Fuji X10 I can say there are two things I donít like about this camera. The first is way canít I put a filter directly on the lens so I can protect the front element from dirt and scratches. Yes I know there is a lens hood/filter attachment which is still coming, but its an extra bit of kit to carry around. Having the ability to have a uv on the front would have so been much easier.
Second the neck strap is ridicules in its design what these technicians where thinking. Firstly you have to attach a triangle eyelet then you need to go thought the rigmarole of treading the strap thought the eyelet. Now instead if they supplied spring snap clips/J clips (sample attached) attached at the end of the camera strap you could quickly and easily attach and remove the strap thought the eyelet lugs on the side of the camera. Some things are to bloody obvious to the camera designers IMO.

Cheers

Simon
Logged

Simon Harper
Harper Photographics Ltd
http://www.harperphoto.com
http://www.facebook.com/harper.photographics

Auckland, New Zealand
AlexRobinson
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 17


« Reply #35 on: November 07, 2011, 10:59:07 PM »
ReplyReply

I'm surprised they went with a neck strap for it, I know I wouldn't want to use one on a camera that small. I guess I'll just use a wrist strap from another camera when I get mine. Disappointing about the filters too, its annoying to see it omitted from it since there's no technical reason they couldn't put one on since the lens doesn't retract like the G12 and similar cameras. It's not like Fuji hasn't done plenty of bridge cameras with normal filter threads over the years either and small filters are readily available for camcorders.
Logged
PeAK
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2


« Reply #36 on: November 08, 2011, 04:41:36 PM »
ReplyReply

...I can say there are two things I donít like about this camera. The first is way canít I put a filter directly on the lens so I can protect the front element from dirt and scratches...Second the neck strap is ridicules in its design what these technicians where thinking. Firstly you have to attach a triangle eyelet then you need to go thought the rigmarole of treading the strap thought the eyelet....

I also agree with you about the inability to stick a simple filter on most compact digital cameras but this may have to due with the delicate cams typical of lens that retracts into  the body...not the case here!  The eyelets are a nod to cameras from the Seventies and seem to have creeped back into more of the digital cameras, even SLRs.

Previous Cameras:
Years ago, I started off with a Fujica ST-701 which gave rise to a slew of smaller cameras with brighter viewfinders than the Spotamatic (i.e. OM-1). Until I sold that camera, I've never had a lens as sharp and natural as the 55mm F1.8 that came with it. It might have been a combination of the black velvet flocking in the mirror chamber along with the EBC multicoating. I almost made the move to digital SLR with the Nikon D3100, last year, for improved  image quality  but was willing to  tradeoff some of excess amount for a slightly larger sensor than 1/2.3".

The x10, as Michael put it, has hit a "sweet spot" with a great effort at coupling lens quality to a much improved sensor (it is not just the size). Overall, from the shots I've seen, I love the way it renders natural and realistic looking images (Sensor coating, processing, film-like grain, BSI, EXR, etc all coming to the fold).

Lens size relative to sensor size:
One thing that I should point out is that for a given lens (X elements in Y groups at F2.0), the sensor size it critical to defining the mass/volume of the lens.  The size of the lens is roughly proportional to the "(ratio of the sensor diagonal)2" , or equivalently, to 1/(ratio of crop factor)2

Lets see how this translate into the size of the "equvalent design" lens(relative to the x10):

Sensor           Crop_factor         Volme/Mass_ratio     Result
1/2.3                                    (2.3/1.5)2         0.42
x10_sensor         4                     (4/4)2             1
4/3_sensor         2                     (4/2)2             4
APSC_sensor        1.5                   (4/1.5)2           7.1

The equiavlent  7.1x factor for an APSC seems a little out of place but it might give you an idea of complexity of the lens design that Fujifilm was going after. Simarly, the Pentax Q lens would have been about 60% smaller. Ever wonder why Nikon chose !" for their new ILCs ?

Graphically this can be seen below(taken from Wikipedia Page on Sensor sizes:






Last it would have neat if they resurrected the old  Fujica banner for this series of retro cameras...I be all over it...   

P.S. A similar review to Michaels by Peter Burian (Photo Life) and another by Shawn Low (some nice x10 eye-candy shots along with ISO comparisons).

P.P.S. Steve Huff has just put up his review and had this to say:
"When compared to cameras like the Canon G12 and other advanced P&S cameras, the X10 wins on usability, image quality and build and feel"


Tongue
PeAK



« Last Edit: November 09, 2011, 06:49:40 AM by PeAK » Logged
Pages: « 1 [2]   Top of Page
Print
Jump to:  

Ad
Ad
Ad