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Author Topic: Hawthorn Tree..English lake district  (Read 6634 times)
shaunw
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« on: December 28, 2011, 09:55:00 AM »
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Poor weather in UK this is from a trip to the Lakes last Sept, i was interested in capturing the light on/near the tree...WDYT


The Hawthorn Tree...English Lakes.                     Explored 28.12.11 by Shaunwalby Photography, on Flickr
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Chairman Bill
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« Reply #1 on: December 28, 2011, 10:19:57 AM »
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The composition reminds me of a shot I took of a tree on Dartmoor, with Steeperton Tor providing the backdrop. I liked my compostion, so unsurprisingly, I like your's too.
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wolfnowl
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« Reply #2 on: December 28, 2011, 04:39:12 PM »
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Intriguing.  Not sure if I like it, but there's definitely a lot of tension there.  Even the clouds look like they're dipping into the 'V' of the valley.

Mike.
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Slobodan Blagojevic
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« Reply #3 on: December 28, 2011, 04:56:49 PM »
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I somehow wish to see a color version, if for no other reason then to alleviate the nagging feeling present in b&w that the lower right-hand corner has been dodged a bit too much in post-processing. Also, there seems to be a halo just above the top of the hill on the left.
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shaunw
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« Reply #4 on: December 29, 2011, 03:20:31 AM »
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The composition reminds me of a shot I took of a tree on Dartmoor, with Steeperton Tor providing the backdrop. I liked my compostion, so unsurprisingly, I like your's too.

Thanks Bill
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shaunw
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« Reply #5 on: December 29, 2011, 03:22:01 AM »
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Thanks Mike intriguing is good for me..lol

regards Shaun
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shaunw
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« Reply #6 on: December 29, 2011, 03:26:47 AM »
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I somehow wish to see a color version, if for no other reason then to alleviate the nagging feeling present in b&w that the lower right-hand corner has been dodged a bit too much in post-processing. Also, there seems to be a halo just above the top of the hill on the left.

Thanks Slobodan....i have this nagging feeling you may be right on both counts....definitely the dark bottom left and not totally sure about the halo though? has it been introduced (process error Halo) or was it there.....i shall check the RAW

spot on thanks very much...i have a feeling i shall be tweaking it

Shaun Walby
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shaunw
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« Reply #7 on: December 29, 2011, 04:04:48 AM »
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I think the darker bottom left needs a lift as for the poss halo...iam more inclined to think its the increased contrast ive but in that has caused the separation of light and dark....thoughts?


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francois
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« Reply #8 on: December 29, 2011, 05:53:43 AM »
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I prefer the B/W version. To me, it's offers a more dramatic view of a tilted world.
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Francois
shaunw
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« Reply #9 on: December 29, 2011, 09:32:35 AM »
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I prefer the B/W version. To me, it's offers a more dramatic view of a tilted world.

Hi Francois

The colour is RAW unprocessed file re the previous discussion...darkening/halo?? Looking again, iam not sure their is a processing halo as such i think the contrast ive added has further separated the lighter area above the hill/cliff?

The mono is the finished image which iam glad you prefer; for me in terms of a conveying the message/communications the mono is clearly more powerful, drama of the scene, emotive content; i think the mono is stronger all round really.

thanks for your thoughts and merry xmas

Shaun
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Chairman Bill
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« Reply #10 on: December 29, 2011, 09:50:07 AM »
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I think the colour image indicates that there is some haloing around the top of the mountain in the B&W image.
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sdwilsonsct
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« Reply #11 on: December 29, 2011, 10:45:05 AM »
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Glad you posted both versions. Comparisons are very interesting. The B+W is very striking but a little artificial-looking for my taste. If it were me I would follow your processing as far as enhancing the tree but without introducing "new" shadows. Scott
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JohnBrew
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« Reply #12 on: December 29, 2011, 06:35:28 PM »
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Shaun, I think Sloboban nailed it. Both in criticism and editing. Not to take away from your original which was very good, I'm glad you posted it.
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Eric Myrvaagnes
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« Reply #13 on: December 29, 2011, 08:31:26 PM »
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Shaun, I think Sloboban nailed it. Both in criticism and editing. Not to take away from your original which was very good, I'm glad you posted it.
I agree with John and SB.

Your first version looks much like what I might have tried in an attempt to bring out the drama inherent in that gnarled tree. But SB has accomplished the drama while retaining a sense of plausibility.

Quote from: Slobodan Blagojevic
When I process my own images, I often let them sit for a while, sometimes in front of me, sometimes away. It might take a few hours or a few days or, yes, a few years sometimes, before I return to the image and see it with fresh eyes, correct it further, and let it sit again. I do it until I finally give up and accept the last result as final.

That's describes my approach as well.

Eric
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ScottWylie
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« Reply #14 on: December 30, 2011, 07:46:21 AM »
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Comparing the colour and B&W versions, it looks as if the sky and ground were masked and adjusted (B&W conversion colour mix and/or levels) seperately, and the halo around the top of the mountain is from feathering of the mask. This has caused the brightening of the mountain to affect the bottom of the sky, the rest of has been made very dark by pushing the contrast/levels. The reason I think this is what has happened is that the halo is most pronounced over the part of the bottom of the cloud that was originally darkest.

I could very well be wrong of course!

I really like the B&W version and if the process was as above then it would probably look great with much less feathering.
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ixania2
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« Reply #15 on: December 30, 2011, 03:59:39 PM »
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My humble pov is: it's so easy to get "drama" into everything. Just push those sliders and here we are. I would like to see the drama without pushing, inherent to the content and design of the scene. Iow: a little bit (much) more henry cartier-bresson in landscape photography...
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shaunw
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« Reply #16 on: December 31, 2011, 03:05:51 AM »
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Hi Slobodan

Well after the genuinely very interesting critique, which i believe was a genuine attempt to help better the image...i have to say the edited version does nothing for the image at all, come on look at it again its dreadful devoid of everything that made the original appealing in the first place. If that edit is technically correct, iam very happy to stay technically incorrect....for me its flat lifeless and bland, for those who have reviewed both images and consider the edit a better image...id stick to colour lol.

Two issues have been useful, the possibility of the halo and the dark left and corner FG which i may look at. Some of the opinions trotted out as critique are just funny i guess that's the inherent trouble with a large site and web based crit in general....just what are the credentials of the people doing the talking? (not aimed at any one particular person for those who will no doubt decide what i mean by that).

  I would say that for the time being i definitely will not be posting my images in the crit section, (as this one wasn't) as iam not at all convinced it will help me make better images.

 As this image wasn't posted in the crit section i would ask that the edit is removed.

Shaun
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churly
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« Reply #17 on: December 31, 2011, 10:01:08 AM »
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It strikes me that you are being a bit overly sensitive about this.  I certainly wouldn't suggest that you should agree with all of the critiques offered by others but it seems to me they were offered in good faith.  Obviously you need to make your own stylistic choices.  However reducing comments/critiques to the critique forum only doesn't really serve anyone.  I prefer lively discussion in this forum as well - even if I don't agree with the discussion.

Cheers.
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Chuck Hurich
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« Reply #18 on: January 03, 2012, 03:37:39 AM »
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As this image wasn't posted in the crit section i would ask that the edit is removed.
If you post an image and put the acronym WDYT (What do you think) in the first line, I think most people would regard that as seeking comment or critique. You can't complain if some of the comments aren't positive.

Removing parts of a thread (eg images) just make a mockery of any later references to them.

The irony in this case is that the alternative edit someone else posted was quite different in feel and was, in my opinion, inferior to your own interpretation.
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luxborealis
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« Reply #19 on: January 06, 2012, 07:58:32 AM »
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The original B&W is a wonderful interpretation of a dramatic landscape. Yes, it has some technical flaws (e.g. halo over far hill and perhaps overly dark "stripe" of cloud) BUT - the image is truly artful. This point is reinforced when we see the colour raw image. Shaun has done an amazing job of bringing his vision to the image. This is a great example of an artist at work, not being satisfied with the machine image, but crafting the raw image to represent his original intent.

While we, as artists and crafts-people must continually learn from constructive criticism (the whole idea of this forum), we need to balance the negative criticism with the positive kudos that many of these works and photographers deserve. Start with the positives, then introduce the constructive criticism.
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