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Author Topic: OS X 10.7 (Lion) and 10.8 (Mountain Lion)  (Read 17641 times)
Ellis Vener
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« on: February 17, 2012, 11:08:08 AM »
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Have all general photo problems people were encountering earlier  been resolved for Lion? Has anyone tried the developer preview of Mountain Lion with Adobe, Epson, Canon, Nikon, Capture One, etc. applications?
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Ellis Vener
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Creating photographs for advertising, corporate and industrial clients since 1984.
StuartOnline
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« Reply #1 on: February 17, 2012, 11:53:24 AM »
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Have all general photo problems people were encountering earlier  been resolved for Lion? Has anyone tried the developer preview of Mountain Lion with Adobe, Epson, Canon, Nikon, Capture One, etc. applications?

Ellis

I had printer problems (Epson 3880) when I first installed Lion. However I have resolved those issues after Epson released newer print drivers. Also have an Canon IOF5000 that I had no real issues. I think most issues (printers) as far as I can tell have been resolved with Lion. Unable to speak on Mountain Lion as I will wait until Apple releases the upgrade. Of course I may wait to see if there are any printer problems before I do upgrade.

Best,

Stu
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BernardLanguillier
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« Reply #2 on: February 17, 2012, 05:34:57 PM »
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I find the fast pace of OSX releases together with the remarkable ability of Apple to generate issues in terms of application compatibility to be a real pain.

It seems that my 8 core Mac Pro, only 4 years old will not be supported by 10.8 according to this source: http://www.anandtech.com/show/5544/apple-releases-os-x-108-mountain-lion-preview

Frankly, if more compatibility issues are found between 10.7 and 10.8 on key applications like Adobe CS I will probably give up on OSX and move back to Windows for good. By the time the issues have been ironed out on the previous OS iteration we are only a few months away from the release of the next version.

Cheers,
Bernard
« Last Edit: February 17, 2012, 06:23:06 PM by BernardLanguillier » Logged

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Schewe
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« Reply #3 on: February 17, 2012, 06:58:44 PM »
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Frankly, if more compatibility issues are found between 10.7 and 10.8 on key applications like Adobe CS I will probably give up on OSX and move back to Windows for good. By the time the issues have been ironed out on the previous OS iteration we are only a few months away from the release of the next version.

Actually, you may want to seriously consider doing this...the chances of "Big Iron" being updated and staying current at Apple is diminishing...a recent problem with the EU regarding energy star ratings (I may have this slightly wrong, but it had to do with some sort of change with EU laws and power consumption) seems to have bitten Apples towers. Which would be the perfect excuse for Apple to drop the tower line up entirely.

Personally, I'm worried...and so is Chris Sanderson (and some Apple employees I know). People who need big iron are a diminishing group and Apple tends to drop diminishing groups from their lineups. Even though they have $90 billion in the bank, it's due largely to iPhone/iPad sales. Real computers is a diminishing %. Big iron is falling even faster.

If you need 4+ drives and 32-64GB of ram and really fast I/O and multiple PCI slots, then you should be worried. I'm worried...

HD+ video and large format digital imaging (really big files) are not gonna be in Apple wheelhouse in the near future.

The upside is Windows 7 64-bit doesn't suck nearly as much as anything named Vista...
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Josh-H
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« Reply #4 on: February 17, 2012, 08:41:14 PM »
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Quote
If you need 4+ drives and 32-64GB of ram and really fast I/O and multiple PCI slots, then you should be worried. I'm worried...

Same and +1.

I have no desire to move away from OSX, but at the same time I need my Mac Pro with 32 gig RAM, RAID and lots of room for hard drives. The lack of an update to the mac pro has me quite concerned; not because I need to update my machine at the moment (I don't) - but because I will want to upgrade it at some stage in the future. If Apple drop it, then I am going to be forced to move back to win blows...

It looks like OSX Mountain Lion requires your computer to be using 64-bit Kernel. An easy way to check if your mac will be supported by OSX LION is to:

How do I tell if I'm using the 64-bit kernel?

Use the System Profiler to determine if you're running a 64-bit kernel.

From the Apple () menu, choose About this Mac, then click More Info.
In the Contents pane, select Software.
If 64-bit Kernel and Extensions is set to Yes, you are running a 64-bit kernel.
Note: A 64-bit kernel is not the same thing as a 64-bit processor.


In my case, I am ok as my mac pro is late 2008 is using the 64 bit kernal. Which is fine for this upcoming update.. who knows about the next.....
« Last Edit: February 17, 2012, 08:47:19 PM by Josh-H » Logged

Chris Sanderson
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« Reply #5 on: February 17, 2012, 10:58:46 PM »
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Personally, I'm worried...and so is Chris Sanderson (and some Apple employees I know). People who need big iron are a diminishing group and Apple tends to drop diminishing groups from their lineups. Even though they have $90 billion in the bank, it's due largely to iPhone/iPad sales. Real computers is a diminishing %. Big iron is falling even faster.

Apple sold more iOS devices in 2011 than total Macs in 28 years
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Christopher Sanderson
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Schewe
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« Reply #6 on: February 17, 2012, 11:16:52 PM »
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Yep...the opening line is telling A new breakdown of Apple's blockbuster 2011 notes that the company sold more iPhones, iPads and iPod touches in the 12-month span than it has sold Mac computers in the company's history.

So, I'm keeping my ears open–and resigned to running a top end Win 7/8 machine for the main apps I need; Photoshop & Lightroom...for other stuff I figure I can hold out for a while on 10.6.8 or 10.7.X before I need to switch to 10.8+ (on my main machine I'm still at 10.6.8 and looking at 10.7.X).
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rogan
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« Reply #7 on: February 17, 2012, 11:18:43 PM »
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But with thunderbolt raids and such, why do we "need" 4 built in drives?(or is it just what we want or are use to) Yes thinderbolt has been slow but seems to be slowly picking up. To me the big tower seems so outdated. I would love a mini tower that is more mobile and keeps all the drives externally.
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John.Murray
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« Reply #8 on: February 17, 2012, 11:30:56 PM »
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The upside is Windows 7 64-bit doesn't suck nearly as much as anything named Vista...

I'm in agreement with your points - curiously i'm building higher end machines that when idle are running nearly stone cold - not even the CPU fan runs....  surely Apple can accomplish that

I'm also worried in that Intel (since Apple has gone x86) has let Apple introduce major new workstation platforms ahead of others - now I'm not so sure....

I make a living at supporting Enterprise Windows, Active Directory, Exchange, Managed Desktops...  but have really enjoyed the approach OS X has taken toward basic tasks - it's made a difference in my approach.

I hope that over the next 2 years we still have a choice.....
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Schewe
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« Reply #9 on: February 17, 2012, 11:33:57 PM »
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Regarding Thunderbolt...yes, looks promising...let me know when there's a hub that can surpass 8 daisy chained devices. I run currently with 3 external displays and two external eSata drives via port multipliers and an external FW 800 RAID) which I think takes me out of the discussion regarding iMacs or Minis–regardless of the attractiveness of those solutions...

Some of us still need Big Iron and that's what Apple is close to killing, I think...
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Farmer
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« Reply #10 on: February 18, 2012, 12:00:35 AM »
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It's a pity that Apple isn't prepared to release OS X without the hardware requirement in the EULA - even on a "no support" basis.  That would allow Hackintosh to become legitimate and let people who need "big iron" as Schewe puts it continue on their OS of choice (albeit without direct support, but then the community could likely keep it going quite well and Apple would still make software sales).

Competition is always good, and less isn't really going to help anyone.
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Chris_Brown
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« Reply #11 on: February 18, 2012, 04:36:45 PM »
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I can understand Apple's attention to iOS hardware, and the chart in this article makes things pretty clear where the profits are for Apple. In addition, many of my friends who use computers in their work and/or play agree that a custom-built, "big iron" Windows box can provide better performance benchmarks than a Mac Pro for about the same amount of money.

In 1995 I chose to stay with Apple products (my flavor du jour being the Power Mac 8500) for the simple reason that ColorSync provided me with color accuracy in my workflow. Microsoft was not remotely interested in a color-accurate workflow at that time, and I have no idea where they stand on this issue today.
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Schewe
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« Reply #12 on: February 18, 2012, 06:19:00 PM »
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Microsoft was not remotely interested in a color-accurate workflow at that time, and I have no idea where they stand on this issue today.

That was then and this is now. It might be argued that the lack of Colorsync on Windows is a good thing. Win CM doesn't get in the way like CS does on Mac.

I actually saw Colorsync running on a Windows box at Apple mid 1990's–just after Steve came back to Apple. Steve "Steve'ed" it and it never shipped. Steve thought Colorsync was a critical Mac only tech. But as time has gone by, Win OS's since Vista really have no color management issues other than the obscure places where x32 and x64 keep the darn profiles...

No, there's no platform advantage to color management on Macs now and as we saw, Snow Leopard was a Colorsync disaster...

No, really, at this point the biggest drawback to Windows is really hardware standardization...there's just so many different potential components out there that configuring a Win box is daunting...compared to the relative ease of the Mac. Oh, yeah, the other thing that drives me nutz are the keyboard shortcuts for Window; ok, option is alt, command is control so what the heck is control from Mac to Win? Other than the rather drab environment of Win 7, that's my biggest problem switching between OS X and Win 7.
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schrodingerscat
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« Reply #13 on: February 18, 2012, 08:38:22 PM »
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There is this - http://www.apple.com/macpro/

Seems plenty enough to carry one well into the next decade. They've also been making noises about the next Pro, so this all may be a continuation of these stories that have dogged Apple from almost the beginning. One thing to remember is their stuff just keeps on chugging along. I've got a Cube that I picked up cheap to practice repair and upgrading on, as well as having wanted one due to being interested in industrial design. I use it for referencing manuals on the bench and occasionally watching tutorials. It's had the CPU upgraded, as well as the vid card, ram, and HDD, and is running 10.4 and QT despite being 'unsupported'. How many PCs from 1984 are still in actual use? The design of the MacPro not only lends itself to easy user friendly upgrading, but also longevity.

Myself, I've no plans in turning a computer into a giant iPad, nor turning my data over to the cloud. Have had no problems with 10.6.8 and will stay with it until forced to by hardware, which I don't see happening in the foreseeable future.
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Farmer
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« Reply #14 on: February 18, 2012, 08:50:34 PM »
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No, really, at this point the biggest drawback to Windows is really hardware standardization...there's just so many different potential components out there that configuring a Win box is daunting...compared to the relative ease of the Mac. Oh, yeah, the other thing that drives me nutz are the keyboard shortcuts for Window; ok, option is alt, command is control so what the heck is control from Mac to Win? Other than the rather drab environment of Win 7, that's my biggest problem switching between OS X and Win 7.

Stick with a brand name manufacturer and you can avoid any real configuration issues.  You can still have a lot more options than Mac, but it doesn't need to be and certainly doesn't need to be confusing.  Sure enough you'd be limiting yourself to a degree, but just as with Mac, you gain the advantage of known hardware configurations, drivers and so forth.

And for keyboard shortcuts, try this in reverse:

http://www.myfirstmac.com/index.php/mac/articles/ultimate-switcher-guide-windows-pc-to-mac-keyboard-shortcuts

or look here:

http://xahlee.org/emacs/apple_pc_kb_diff.html

The pages seem a little dated, so perhaps there are some changes, but should give you the general gist of it.  Oh, and your mouse will have two actual buttons (or more if you like) and a scroll wheel that's actually a wheel most of the time rather than a microscopic ball ;-)
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Schewe
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« Reply #15 on: February 18, 2012, 10:09:43 PM »
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Oh, and your mouse will have two actual buttons (or more if you like) and a scroll wheel that's actually a wheel most of the time rather than a microscopic ball ;-)

Oh, I've been using multi-button mice for almost 2 decades...the first thing I do with a new Mac is buy a Logitech. Current is a 5 button mouse with scroll and tilt scroll. I've always hated Mac mice...
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Farmer
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« Reply #16 on: February 18, 2012, 10:15:48 PM »
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Oh, I've been using multi-button mice for almost 2 decades...the first thing I do with a new Mac is buy a Logitech. Current is a 5 button mouse with scroll and tilt scroll. I've always hated Mac mice...

There's hope for you yet in the Windows world, Schewe ;p
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Schewe
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« Reply #17 on: February 18, 2012, 11:03:29 PM »
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There's hope for you yet in the Windows world, Schewe ;p

Yeah...Win 7 doesn't suck too much...like I said, the main issue in use is keys...but for my main apps-Word, InDesign, Illustrator, Photoshop & Lightroom, Win vs Mac is really 6 of one, 1/2 dozen of the other...would I prefer Mac? Yes...am I worried about Mac Big Iron? Yes...can I get the work done that I need to do with Win 7/8? Yes.

Time will tell, but it's not looking great for Mac power users...
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John.Murray
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« Reply #18 on: February 19, 2012, 12:31:38 AM »
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Schewe:
I'm similarly challenged getting around quickly on OS X.... Wink

A lot of things in Windows are buried behind hidden folders, a quick way to access is via the shell command;
http://www.osattack.com/windows-7/huge-list-of-windows-7-shell-commands/

For color profiles
[Windows Key]+[R] shell:system, spool\drivers\color

As far as named brand systems, my experience is that most systems are seriously compromised by marketing agreements with various software vendors, including AV, and Media players, along with re-packaged "alternatives" to built in O/S capabilities such as wireless or even DVD players (DVD playback is native in Win7).  Many systems seem to ship with some form of "mac dock" utility which is senseless on windows......

Microsoft is actually taking a select few systems and reloading the O/S with only the necessary drivers at their Retail Locations.  If you plan on name brand, budget an extra hour or two of a professional's time to get you to a clean system.  Or you can spend that extra with a qualified custom builder, and get precisely what you want....
« Last Edit: February 19, 2012, 12:36:01 AM by John.Murray » Logged

Farmer
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« Reply #19 on: February 19, 2012, 12:53:45 AM »
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With keys, there are also apps that let you remap them - I found this on a quick Google:

http://www.howtogeek.com/howto/windows-vista/map-any-key-to-any-key-on-windows-xp-vista/

Or, you can really take advantage of keyboard shortcuts by using a gaming keyboard.  I like the Logitech G15 (original, but the version 2 is also good).  Any number of functions for PS or LR in a single key, without having to do any finger gymanstics.  You also get keyboard control of your volume, MP3s playing in the background, etc etc.  And, it's a good quality Logitech keyboard - mine has had years of use and abuse and is still working perfectly.
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