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Author Topic: LR 4 Newbie  (Read 2954 times)
FrankG
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« on: September 02, 2012, 08:10:08 PM »
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I am purchasing LR 4 & PS CS6 (Mac).
Never used LR before.

I have used Bridge (& earlier PS) for a long time.
Where do I start....

I usually d/l files (RAW) from camera with EOS Utility to a dated folder and then start sorting in Bridge & opening in ACR. Saving to Tifs in a sub-folder

Appreciate a Quick Start lesson (recommendation to a link?) to make the transition.
Thanks
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FrankG
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« Reply #1 on: September 02, 2012, 08:59:03 PM »
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...I should have added...
that my main concern is what to do with all my existing images in terms of integrating them into LR, as opposed to new images after installation.
I have not previously keyworded them. Just filed them in folders that are meaningful to me - names of places, people etc
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Tom Frerichs
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« Reply #2 on: September 02, 2012, 10:10:19 PM »
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Like you, I used PS/Bridge for a long time, but then I came to the dark side: Lightroom, and I don't regret it at all. I still use PS (CS6 these days) for some work that requires layers. For example, portrait retouching is much easier in PS.  However, it is not my primary tool to import, process, and print photographs.

Like you, I had placed my files in semi-meaningful directories. I must say that I didn't do an explicit conversion to TIFF, but kept them as RAW files until I had need to use them in some other application, e.g. InDesign, or process/print them with PS. Also, I was terrible about keywording. Translate that to "Keywords?  Too much trouble."

When I started using LR, I realized that my "sort by directory hierarchy" wasn't nearly as transparent or useful as I thought. Further, I decided to move my photographs to another drive with better data redundancy.

I ended up creating a new LR root directory on the new drive, then I used LR's import, selecting "COPY" to suck in the files that I wanted from their original storage location to my LR catalog and LR directories. I also let LR use the default (I think) directory structure of <base>/<year>/<year-month-day> format.  With LR's cataloging I find that I don't use even miss having separate, specially named directories.

The only fallout from that is that I noticed that I had some very old shots taken with a camera where the date/time was incorrectly set.  Amazingly enough, I find I have some photographs that I will apparently be taking in 2099.

As I selected the photographs to import, I did some minimal import keywording. In effect, the keywording was nearly the same as the failed directory structure that I had earlier used. As time permits, I have gone back and added additional, more specific keywords to photos, but I found that even with the minimal work that I did on import that I am able to find a shot using LR's filters faster than my previous "let's find the directory" approach.

The reason I used "copy" instead of "move" was because I'm a coward. I wanted to make sure that all photographs were correctly stored on the new drive before I erased them off the old drive.

This was the approach I used. However, there will now follow several posts telling you that I'm a complete idiot. (grin). There are those that advocate for multiple catalogs...Michael Reichman, I believe, among them. There are some who still store their files in a named directory hierachy. Finally, there are some who have import directories, then move files to other directories as appropriate. In fact, there are probably more ways of using LR than there are of photographing landscapes.

I am explaining what I did and that I find it sufficient for my needs.

By the way, I see no reason to do a conversion to TIFF or PSD when using LR. I keep my RAWs...and there's another variation with some folks converting to DNG on import...and use LR to develop/print them. If necessary, I'll export as TIFF if I'm going to do some work in PS or some plug in such as Silver Effects Pro. That export can be handled seemlessly with LR.

Tom Frerichs
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FrankG
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« Reply #3 on: September 03, 2012, 06:54:38 AM »
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Thank you for this Tom.
I will digest it as I go - the software will arrive this week and hopefully it'll become clearer once installed.
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Alan Goldhammer
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« Reply #4 on: September 03, 2012, 07:30:51 AM »
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By the way, I see no reason to do a conversion to TIFF or PSD when using LR. I keep my RAWs...and there's another variation with some folks converting to DNG on import...and use LR to develop/print them. If necessary, I'll export as TIFF if I'm going to do some work in PS or some plug in such as Silver Effects Pro. That export can be handled seemlessly with LR.

Tom Frerichs

You don't need to do an export as TIFF if you are going straight to PS from LR.  As long as your PS and LR programs are current with updates, this is seamless and all your LR changes go with the file.  At the end of PS editing, you do save as a TIFF and that file is returned and seen by LR in the same location in your LR library.
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JeanMichel
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« Reply #5 on: September 03, 2012, 08:25:43 AM »
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Happy labour day!
At the risk of sounding like a salesman for this site, I strongly recommend purchasing the Luminous Landscape LR4 video tutorial and spending some quality time with them. That will get you up and running in LR very quickly. I completely moved my photographic workflow and file management to LR;  Bridge continues to be my main tool to manage my design and publication files as they include everything from Word, InDesign, Illustrator... But for images LR is booth powerful and 'darkroom guy' friendly.
Jean-Michel
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FrankG
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« Reply #6 on: September 03, 2012, 08:23:16 PM »
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Thanks.
No doubt there is a learning curve and a video may well have to be in my future.
But I first want to get my feet a little wet and then I'll be better positioned to ask the right questions and learn from a video.

My initial confusion is what do do with my current files/folder structure which I now browse in bridge [& either open in ACR (cr2's) or PS (tifs/psd's)]
And how to integrate (or not) them with LR.
I am unsure of "Catalogues" and "Library"

I do a lot of work on the photos in PS and have no doubt that'll remain
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aduke
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« Reply #7 on: September 03, 2012, 09:10:34 PM »
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I believe that the first hurdle is to really understand the difference between the Catalog and the Folders and to fully understand what is happening during import.

To me, the thing to recognize is that the images, in their folders, can be where-ever you want them. They do not exist in the Catalog. That being said, I do keep my images folder inside the same folder as the Catalog. it seemed to make sense to do it that way and I've seen no reason to change.

Alan
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Robert-Peter Westphal
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« Reply #8 on: September 04, 2012, 04:26:14 AM »
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Hi,

I strongly recommend not to start by yourself, but first take a look at the videos provided by Michael and Jeff.

If you start working with lightroom in the wrong wasy, it will be much more difficult to correct the way. And becasue Lr is great and intuitive, but completely different from most other applications, you yould give Lr and yourself a chance to staart from the right position.



Robert
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Eric Myrvaagnes
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« Reply #9 on: September 04, 2012, 08:23:00 AM »
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Hi,

I strongly recommend not to start by yourself, but first take a look at the videos provided by Michael and Jeff.

If you start working with lightroom in the wrong wasy, it will be much more difficult to correct the way. And becasue Lr is great and intuitive, but completely different from most other applications, you yould give Lr and yourself a chance to staart from the right position.



Robert

I completely agree. I speak from experience, having tried to use LR 1.0 out of the box with no instruction. I couldn't imagine why people were enthusiastic about it. The LuLa videos and the threads on this forum have helped me make sense of it.

I have very gradually adapted my workflow to the more efficient LightRoom one, and I couldn't have done it without Michael and Jeff's videos. They are a great bargain, excellent tutorials, and very entertaining as well.
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-Eric Myrvaagnes

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Tony Jay
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« Reply #10 on: September 07, 2012, 12:20:33 AM »
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Apart from the Lr video tutorials I also STRONGLY recommend the tutorial 'Where #$@! are my pictures' since this will help immensely in understanding digital asset management in Lr.

Regards

Tony Jay
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lfeagan
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« Reply #11 on: September 07, 2012, 04:11:32 AM »
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We are the LuLa borg, you will assimilated to our LR ways. Grin

If you are generally able to self teach and be successful with software, you can get through using LR acceptably on your own without the videos. I did with LR3 for a year. When the LuLa LR4 videos came out I picked them up and learned quite a few tricks and techniques that have come in handy. I certainly became far more efficient in my usage in the short time spent watching the videos than I had in the previous year. My learning would have been accelerated had I watched the LuLa LR3 videos, but I enjoyed learning through experimentation. If you need to get up to speed in a hurry, the videos are the way to go. If this is a hobby and you enjoy tinkering, then do what makes you happy.
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Lance

Nikon: D700, D800E, PC-E 24mm f/3.5D ED, PC-E 45mm f/2.8D ED, PC-E 85mm f/2.8D, 50mm f/1.4G, 14-24 f/2.8G ED, 24-70 f/2.8G ED, 70-200 f/2.8G ED VR II, 400mm f/2.8G ED VR
Fuji: X-Pro 1, 14mm f/2.8, 18mm f/2.0, 35mm f/1.4
FrankG
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« Reply #12 on: September 07, 2012, 06:44:38 AM »
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Thanks guys. No doubt the videos are great. I'm not arguing the point. But I was asking about very elementary things which I found the answers to online e.g. Julienne Kost's adobe videos - such as that you can either import from card/camera with LR or you can drag or copy/pate the files to your HD, or use eos utilty to import to HD, and then go to LR & tell it where they are. This answered my question about what to do with my exisiting images on my HD that are in folders that mean something to me.
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FrankG
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« Reply #13 on: September 07, 2012, 10:50:10 AM »
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I just bought the introductory series of videos. I'm off......
Video 1 contains 'Introduction to Library'.
There is no mention of  "... multiple catalogs..." in this video as suggested in an earlier post that MR is one of many who advocate this ?
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Tom Frerichs
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« Reply #14 on: September 07, 2012, 01:09:30 PM »
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It may have been in the Camera to Print & Screen videos that MR said he used multiple catalogs and JS talked about using only one...with 4,785,395.5 images as I recall.  However, since I'm old, don't trust my memory on the exact number.

Tom Frerichs
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lfeagan
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« Reply #15 on: September 07, 2012, 04:04:20 PM »
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My initial confusion is what do do with my current files/folder structure which I now browse in bridge [& either open in ACR (cr2's) or PS (tifs/psd's)]
And how to integrate (or not) them with LR.
I am unsure of "Catalogues" and "Library"

I do a lot of work on the photos in PS and have no doubt that'll remain

Hi Frank,

At a basic level, a catalog is a database that contains references to media files (images, videos) and meta-data about those files. When thinking about how the catalog can be used during import, there are two basic scenarios:
1) Referencing existing files where you are happy with their location
2) Importing new files after a shoot.

In the first scenario, because you are happy with the current on-disk locations, you are going to have LR import by simply adding the files to the catalog without moving or copying them. This means you get the benefits of the catalog while maintaining the familiarity with the files on-disk locations.

In the second scenario, you want LR to copy the files from the flash card to another location. LR can automatically create a folder hierarchy using one of three organization techniques (by original folder, by date, and into one folder). With the by date schema, there are about a dozen date formats you can choose from for the folder naming convention.

Just to point it out, you could have LR move all your existing files around to match with a particular by-date convention if you want to. But, the key thing is that you are not compelled to do so.

Catalog and library are synonyms.

Final Thoughts: Start off using a single catalog. There are few use cases where multiple catalogs are beneficial. For any user not truly needing multiple catalogs, having to deal with multiple catalogs will merely be a nuisance and hinder productivity.
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Lance

Nikon: D700, D800E, PC-E 24mm f/3.5D ED, PC-E 45mm f/2.8D ED, PC-E 85mm f/2.8D, 50mm f/1.4G, 14-24 f/2.8G ED, 24-70 f/2.8G ED, 70-200 f/2.8G ED VR II, 400mm f/2.8G ED VR
Fuji: X-Pro 1, 14mm f/2.8, 18mm f/2.0, 35mm f/1.4
Tony Jay
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« Reply #16 on: September 07, 2012, 04:40:21 PM »
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... For any user not truly needing multiple catalogs, having to deal with multiple catalogs will merely be a nuisance and hinder productivity...

Could not agree more!
Learn how to use collections and especially smart collections to further organize your images from within Lr. Once you get the collections thing you will be away - so simple, so brilliant. The library module in Lr is worth the purchase price alone.

Regards

Tony Jay
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FrankG
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« Reply #17 on: September 08, 2012, 10:39:39 AM »
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Thanks for clarifying the two different import scenarios (existing and/or new files) and for the tips.

And the third scenario of changing my existing folder/file structure (naming) to match the new by date convention (which is probably a good idea but a bit complex to start off with). That way everything is the same.

Reading that single little line "Catalog and library are synonyms." was so helpful :-)

I will stick to 1 catalog for now and I assume that one should follow the prompt to back it up (at any location of choice ) even if I'm already using Time Machine to make incremental backups.
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