Ad
Ad
Ad
Pages: « 1 ... 7 8 [9] 10 11 12 »   Bottom of Page
Print
Author Topic: New to site and DMF... Just in time with H5D ! Help Please.  (Read 27125 times)
ErikKaffehr
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 7332


WWW
« Reply #160 on: October 14, 2012, 10:36:08 PM »
ReplyReply

Hi Eric,

Yes I am aware of that. But analyzing color rendition with the tools of the trade may help understanding some of the issues. I'm very much aware that human vision system can recognize several million colors and the color checker has just 24, but if you cannot reproduce those 24 you won't be able to reproduce the remaining million colors either.

I'd also say that the CC tells us how much each raw converter oversaturates on each camera.

The over saturation is intentional. Correct reproduction of color is boring. So it is quite normal that both saturation and midtones are pushed a bit when rendering raw files. I'm a bit surprised that color saturation differs between Hasselblad and Nikon so much in LR, I would expected saturation to be the same.

As far as I understand you are doing a lot repro work, and I presume that keeping colors correct is important for your work. I assume that you use different saturation settings on repro and landscape?

Best regards
Erik



Erik,
With all respect my comment and TMARK's had to do with skin color and not a color checker which is an entirely different thing.  

« Last Edit: October 14, 2012, 11:30:13 PM by ErikKaffehr » Logged

FredBGG
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1651


« Reply #161 on: October 14, 2012, 10:49:43 PM »
ReplyReply


@ Fred,

Nice try  Wink, SLR contain single lens + mirror + prism. My Hy6 have WLF, no prism.  Grin


Best regards,
Anders


Before you shoot your mouth off you might want to do some research. Roll Eyes

You could start here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolleiflex

Rollie made many TLR and SLR cameras. Most without a prism.

You might also want to look here too:

http://www.dhw-fototechnik.de/rolleiflex-slr.html

While you claim your camera is not an SLR, the manufacturer says it is......  Roll Eyes
Logged
FredBGG
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1651


« Reply #162 on: October 14, 2012, 11:10:27 PM »
ReplyReply

Quote
You bring up and interesting point. I shot for many years with Canon's and you are right that MFD files from phase and Hasselblad were more robust.
+1Not seen any big camera companies here lately...Just 10 posts earlier you called it "Typical marketing BS"...

I was referring to the monologue about how the photographer says he does everything to see if he can break a camera and that he could not break
or get a Phase One to freeze or fail. We all know the DF has issues. But for Yaya's sake I'll be more precise in the future.

I'd file that video under Fiction along with quite a few others from Phase One.

Like this one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=91KqEfi23FU&feature=youtu.be

The video shows a Phase One guy shooting moving action with strobe and WIDE OPEN
with fast focus. Yet the very manual of that cameras states that you need to shoot at f8 in order to achieve focus
with fast focus.

From page 99 of the pdf manual.

Quote
C-19 AF Priority [AF_2]
Accuracy of auto-focusing priority (default setting) or speed priority can be
decided.
0: Speed
(Aperture to f/ 8 is recommended when using this function.)[/quore]



The claims of faster focusing are somewhat over rated.
buried deep in the manual it states that the faster focusing setting is only accurate enough at f8 or more.
No mention of that in there video plugging their new focusing.
Logged
ErikKaffehr
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 7332


WWW
« Reply #163 on: October 14, 2012, 11:37:46 PM »
ReplyReply

Hi,

I looked at the video.

It's an obvious advantage of leaf shutters that you can use flash to balance daylight.

Regarding focusing, stopping down doesn't help focus, it just masks defocus.

A you tube video will not demonstrate sharpness, anyway.

Best regards
Erik



I was referring to the monologue about how the photographer says he does everything to see if he can break a camera and that he could not break
or get a Phase One to freeze or fail. We all know the DF has issues. But for Yaya's sake I'll be more precise in the future.

I'd file that video under Fiction along with quite a few others from Phase One.

Like this one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=91KqEfi23FU&feature=youtu.be

The video shows a Phase One guy shooting moving action with strobe and WIDE OPEN
with fast focus. Yet the very manual of that cameras states that you need to shoot at f8 in order to achieve focus
with fast focus.

From page 99 of the pdf manual.

Quote
C-19 AF Priority [AF_2]
Accuracy of auto-focusing priority (default setting) or speed priority can be
decided.
0: Speed
(Aperture to f/ 8 is recommended when using this function.)[/quore]



The claims of faster focusing are somewhat over rated.
buried deep in the manual it states that the faster focusing setting is only accurate enough at f8 or more.
No mention of that in there video plugging their new focusing.
Logged

yaya
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1124



WWW
« Reply #164 on: October 15, 2012, 12:20:27 AM »
ReplyReply

I was referring to the monologue about how the photographer says he does everything to see if he can break a camera and that he could not break
or get a Phase One to freeze or fail. We all know the DF has issues. But for Yaya's sake I'll be more precise in the future.

I'd file that video under Fiction along with quite a few others from Phase One.

FWIW BC shoots Contax and in the video he talks about his Phase backs. But as usual you found a way to turn it around...
Where would you file your Tamrac video?

Logged

Yair Shahar | Product Manager | Mamiya Leaf |
e: ysh@leaf-photography.com | m: +44(0)77 8992 8199 | www.mamiyaleaf.com | yaya's blog
Anders_HK
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1001



WWW
« Reply #165 on: October 15, 2012, 02:09:50 AM »
ReplyReply

Nice try Anders but you happen to be wrong. SLR means Single Lens Reflex.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single-lens_reflex_camera#History

Admittedly most SLRs now days use pentaprism.

Best regards
Erik


Before you shoot your mouth off you might want to do some research. Roll Eyes

You could start here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolleiflex

Rollie made many TLR and SLR cameras. Most without a prism.

You might also want to look here too:

http://www.dhw-fototechnik.de/rolleiflex-slr.html

While you claim your camera is not an SLR, the manufacturer says it is......  Roll Eyes

Not quite... better to say "tad muddy waters" Cheesy... Admittedly Hy6, Hassy H, Mamiya DF are all SLR type cameras but not quite SLRs...  by same Wikipedia "A single-lens reflex (SLR) camera is a camera that typically uses a mirror and prism system (hence "reflex", from the mirror's reflection) that permits the photographer to view through the lens and hence see exactly what will be captured". By that definition, with WLF gets muddier... but still SLR type... though not an SLR...

More common used the term refers to a mirror prism camera by the 35mm system, and a DSLR refers to such digital version. No idea what then the Sony A99 should accurate be called to confuse  Cheesy..., and water gets muddier or clearer with the Leica S and Mamiya ZD camera which are DSLR form factor but larger formats. Grin
« Last Edit: October 15, 2012, 02:13:39 AM by Anders_HK » Logged
bcooter
Guest
« Reply #166 on: October 15, 2012, 02:48:42 AM »
ReplyReply

Isnip......
I'd file that video under Fiction along with quite a few others from Phase One.
.....snip


Whoa Fred.

Your pulling on a rope and I don't think you know what it's tied to.

I don't know you and your motives may be pure, might not, but I made mine very clear.

For the record, Phase and prior to that Leaf (when I had an Aptus) never asked, insinuated, implied, made mention of me saying anything false . . . ever.

In fact they we're very clear that what they wanted was the user experience and I think that's what I said then and now.

Once again, for the record the reason I didn't like Phase's video was I wanted a day for myself and our crew to rest and feel a little better as we came off of a lot of weeks of 18 hour days and I know I couldn't think straight, I doubt if anyone else could either.  Everyone wants to make the best presentation in public.

Regardless no one asked me to use a Phase/Mamiya body and knew what camera bodies I used.



In regards to tethering c1 has been the gold standard for a long time.  V3 was so solid that we could set it up, capturing to either two drives or a raid 5 and just leave it alone.  Honestly, the only time we touched it was to change the naming.

V4 was new had some issues but were fixed, v5 bullet proof again.

I've found in our case if we want to tether without issue we use clean computers, clean drives and prepare the cameras accordingly with polishing the contacts, making sure all batteries are fresh and new, etc. etc.

People I know that routinely have issues with tethering of any brand usually have some other issues (see my sentence above) and/or don't really know the systems they use.  

Actually, if you want to know anything about Mamiya, Phase or Leaf,  just ask Yair.  I've known him for 8 years, sometimes we've agreed, sometimes we've both strongly disagreed, but Yair is well respected in the industry on both sides of the Atlantic and  will not tell you anything but the truth as he knows it and he knows a lot.

IMO

BC
« Last Edit: October 15, 2012, 12:25:22 PM by bcooter » Logged
KLaban
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1671



WWW
« Reply #167 on: October 15, 2012, 04:00:40 AM »
ReplyReply

As a side note, I actually don't think that equipment matters that much. My view is simply that most equipment is good enough.

Yes, virtually all of the equipment we discuss here is more than good enough, dependent on purpose. However I do believe equipment choice is crucial to the individual. Most photographers using MFD do so out of choice rather than necessity.

My own choices are naturally based on my own preferences, namely the form factor, the format - 4:3, I hate shooting one format and cropping to another - the viewfinders, the simplicity - an almost analogue experience - and of course the quality of the files. I've no doubt the D800 is an accomplished camera and I make no claims of superiority for my own equipment. This isn't a competition, although at times one could be forgiven for thinking otherwise.

I wish you good shooting.
Logged

FredBGG
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1651


« Reply #168 on: October 15, 2012, 11:09:24 AM »
ReplyReply

Not quite... better to say "tad muddy waters" Cheesy... Admittedly Hy6, Hassy H, Mamiya DF are all SLR type cameras but not quite SLRs...  by same Wikipedia "A single-lens reflex (SLR) camera is a camera that typically uses a mirror and prism system (hence "reflex", from the mirror's reflection) that permits the photographer to view through the lens and hence see exactly what will be captured". By that definition, with WLF gets muddier... but still SLR type... though not an SLR...

More common used the term refers to a mirror prism camera by the 35mm system, and a DSLR refers to such digital version. No idea what then the Sony A99 should accurate be called to confuse  Cheesy..., and water gets muddier or clearer with the Leica S and Mamiya ZD camera which are DSLR form factor but larger formats. Grin

This is really getting funny.....
The manufacturer calls the Hy6 an SLR, but you think you
 know better.
It doesn't get more childish than that.
Logged
FredBGG
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1651


« Reply #169 on: October 15, 2012, 11:28:36 AM »
ReplyReply


What exactly do you mean by "If you live in a glass house".

« Last Edit: October 15, 2012, 11:32:08 AM by FredBGG » Logged
KLaban
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1671



WWW
« Reply #170 on: October 15, 2012, 11:37:30 AM »
ReplyReply

Logged

FredBGG
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1651


« Reply #171 on: October 15, 2012, 11:56:24 AM »
ReplyReply

Hi,

I looked at the video.

It's an obvious advantage of leaf shutters that you can use flash to balance daylight.

Regarding focusing, stopping down doesn't help focus, it just masks defocus.

A you tube video will not demonstrate sharpness, anyway.

Best regards
Erik




TITLE OF THE VIDEO: "Shooting with auto focus"

From the video "I will be showing off the speed of focus" "f2.8 to keep our focus shallow"
"and we are trying to get a complete series of images all in focus of the processes coming off this boat"

but I repeat: the manual says:

From page 99 of the pdf manual.

Quote
C-19 AF Priority [AF_2]
Accuracy of auto-focusing priority (default setting) or speed priority can be
decided.
0: Speed
(Aperture to f/ 8 is recommended when using this function.)[/quore]

This is a clear case of marketing bullshit. It is clearly put together to miss lead a potential DF
user to believe that it can accurately focus a situation like this at f2.8.

I have owned both the Phase One DF and AF and I can confirm that neither are up to the task
shown in this video.

« Last Edit: October 15, 2012, 12:06:36 PM by FredBGG » Logged
ErikKaffehr
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 7332


WWW
« Reply #172 on: October 15, 2012, 11:56:47 AM »
ReplyReply

Hi,

What I intended to say is more that what is in front, beneath and behind the camera matters more than the camera itself.

Another observation is that it seems that smaller format cameras are considered OK for serious work. The micro 4/3 system gets a lot of respect those day, respect the original 4/3 system never got. I guess that respect comes from the micro 4/3 being smaller but also from sensor improvements.

A couple of years ago, Michael Reichmann compared a Canon G10 with a P45+ back on Hasselblad. He presented the picture in Super A3 size to seasoned experts in imaging and they could by and large not tell the images apart. To me that indicates that the G10 was good enough. Sometimes I shoot with my Sony RX100, sometimes with my Alpha 77 SLT and sometimes with Alpha 900. Whatever I shoot I'm pretty confident the images will be OK.

What I have found is that for street shooting I use the Alpha 77 SLT. It's pretty small and so is the 16-80/3.5-4.5 lens. The Alpha 900 with the 24-70/2.8 zoom is much more intimidating. For telephoto work a small sensor pitch camera may be preferable and I more often than not use live view at 1:1 for focusing.

Obviously, I would not use the RX100 for long range tele photo work, nor does it have an ultra wide angle, but when the other cameras are not at hand it does a decent job.

Best regards
Erik

Yes, virtually all of the equipment we discuss here is more than good enough, dependent on purpose. However I do believe equipment choice is crucial to the individual. Most photographers using MFD do so out of choice rather than necessity.

My own choices are naturally based on my own preferences, namely the form factor, the format - 4:3, I hate shooting one format and cropping to another - the viewfinders, the simplicity - an almost analogue experience - and of course the quality of the files. I've no doubt the D800 is an accomplished camera and I make no claims of superiority for my own equipment. This isn't a competition, although at times one could be forgiven for thinking otherwise.

I wish you good shooting.

« Last Edit: October 15, 2012, 12:37:10 PM by ErikKaffehr » Logged

KLaban
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1671



WWW
« Reply #173 on: October 15, 2012, 12:08:10 PM »
ReplyReply

What I intended to say is more that what is in front beneath and behind the camera matters mostly than the camera itself.

Couldn't have said it better myself ;-)
Logged

ErikKaffehr
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 7332


WWW
« Reply #174 on: October 15, 2012, 12:43:04 PM »
ReplyReply

Another version of "Let him who is without sin cast the first stone".

Best regards
Erik


What exactly do you mean by "If you live in a glass house".


Logged

yaya
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1124



WWW
« Reply #175 on: October 15, 2012, 12:44:49 PM »
ReplyReply

What exactly do you mean by "If you live in a glass house".

http://youtu.be/jW3j_KXufPE
Logged

Yair Shahar | Product Manager | Mamiya Leaf |
e: ysh@leaf-photography.com | m: +44(0)77 8992 8199 | www.mamiyaleaf.com | yaya's blog
tho_mas
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1696


« Reply #176 on: October 15, 2012, 12:54:05 PM »
ReplyReply

A couple of years ago, Michael Reichmann compared a Canon G10 with a P45+ back on Hasselblad. He presented the picture in Super A3 size to seasoned experts in imaging and they could by and large not tell the images apart.
at print size none of the "experts" could see that the H2/P45 capture was pretty badly focussed and therefore the most dominant features of the H2/P45 photo were quite soft.
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/kidding.shtml
JPGs at 100%: http://files.luminous-landscape.com/downloads/
Logged
FredBGG
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1651


« Reply #177 on: October 15, 2012, 01:00:16 PM »
ReplyReply

Another version of "Let him who is without sin cast the first stone".

Best regards
Erik



Oh so now I am sinning in that little Tamrac video........ do you mind pointing out what sin I am committing?

Logged
ErikKaffehr
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 7332


WWW
« Reply #178 on: October 15, 2012, 01:04:56 PM »
ReplyReply

Hi,

Thanks for pointing that out. It really shows that humans are prone to mistakes.

What I'd suggest it also shows that it is easy to miss critical focus and some errors pass unnoticed in reasonable sized prints.

Best regards
Erik


at print size none of the "experts" could see that the H2/P45 capture was pretty badly focussed and therefore the most dominant features of the H2/P45 photo were quite soft.
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/kidding.shtml
JPGs at 100%: http://files.luminous-landscape.com/downloads/

Logged

FredBGG
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1651


« Reply #179 on: October 15, 2012, 01:08:33 PM »
ReplyReply

Quote
A couple of years ago, Michael Reichmann compared a Canon G10 with a P45+ back on Hasselblad. He presented the picture in Super A3 size to seasoned experts in imaging and they could by and large not tell the images apart.

at print size none of the "experts" could see that the H2/P45 capture was pretty badly focussed and therefore the most dominant features of the H2/P45 photo were quite soft.
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/kidding.shtml
JPGs at 100%: http://files.luminous-landscape.com/downloads/


Slight focusing shift in this shot does not really make any difference... the subject has a lot of depth.

However it is also a scene that does not requite much dynamic range. I'm sure that a shot with more extreme lighting differences
would have shown an advantage for the Hasselblad.

But we have gone a long way since.

Logged
Pages: « 1 ... 7 8 [9] 10 11 12 »   Top of Page
Print
Jump to:  

Ad
Ad
Ad