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Author Topic: The Mystery of the RZ67 PRO II Viewfinder Mask  (Read 4641 times)
RyuuzakiJulio
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« on: September 25, 2012, 08:41:50 PM »
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Ok, so this is for all the GURUS out here with much more experience than I. (so basically anyone here).

I think I did it right. The mask is placed below the glass right?
It makes sense for the cutout outline that fits perfectly on the elements below the glass.

Everything was going fantastic! Until I noticed a little hole on the mask.
I wondered what was it, and when I removed the glass, I saw something like a burn mark.
I thought it might be some dust or something that got there or something. I didn't pay much attention.
Then a few days later I found out a bigger mark on a totally different part of the mask.
There is nothing loose in the camera, nothing that would seem to be hurting the mask.
Yet, there is some very unusual burn marks on the mask. Has anyone seen them before?
Whats going on? Is my camera possessed?

Here is some images:

One Side:


Other Side:


On camera position:


With glass on top:


Thank you for any help in advance,

Ryu Cool
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Aryan Aqajani
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« Reply #1 on: September 25, 2012, 08:53:49 PM »
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I am going to get an adaptor and mask to use my DM22 back on my RZ so eager to know what has caused this to your mask!
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Aryan Aqajani - Photographer in Melbourne, Australia
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RyuuzakiJulio
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« Reply #2 on: September 25, 2012, 10:00:41 PM »
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I am going to get an adaptor and mask to use my DM22 back on my RZ so eager to know what has caused this to your mask!

It is a mystery, I still don't know whats up.
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FredBGG
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« Reply #3 on: September 25, 2012, 10:29:10 PM »
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Yes that mask is designed to go under the focusing screen.
That is why the mask has those three cut aways to fit around the focusing screen calibration supports.

However this is not a good thing as any additional surfaces that the light goes through compared to the lens to sensor path will shift focus.

No much because it is plastic.

I would recommend making a mask that sits on top of the focusing screen that is only a frame.
By that I mean make a frame with a hole for the framing area.

The image on the ground glass will be clearer.

Also I would not put that mask with burnt parts under the mirror. Some material may fall off and get into the complex mechanics of the body.

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RyuuzakiJulio
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« Reply #4 on: September 25, 2012, 10:53:34 PM »
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Yes that mask is designed to go under the focusing screen.
That is why the mask has those three cut aways to fit around the focusing screen calibration supports.

However this is not a good thing as any additional surfaces that the light goes through compared to the lens to sensor path will shift focus.

No much because it is plastic.

I would recommend making a mask that sits on top of the focusing screen that is only a frame.
By that I mean make a frame with a hole for the framing area.

The image on the ground glass will be clearer.

Also I would not put that mask with burnt parts under the mirror. Some material may fall off and get into the complex mechanics of the body.

FRED!!! YOU ARE A F#$%%# GENIOUS!!!
I was shooting on location and I have a custom made viewfinder (much like the one MK has). After reading your comment, I think I know what happened.
The shoot was in a very sunny clear day in Lake Tahoe (6,225 ft altitude).
I think the sunlight passed trough my 15x viewfinder and with the light distortion focused all the power into one little spot on the mask. Since the viewfinder has a set distance to be always on focus with the base, I think it was causing the light to burn the plastic!

Just like kids burn ants or explorers light fire with magnifiers.

O M F G ( ゚д゚ )!!! Scary!!
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FredBGG
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« Reply #5 on: September 26, 2012, 01:15:33 AM »
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Yes sunlight through your loup can burn plastic marks etc.

You have to be very careful about letting sunlight into your loup or waist level finder.

The heat can also deform the focusing screen itself and throw your focus off.

This was a golden rule back in the days of film where you cannot check focus on a digital file.

I would actually check my focusing screens against a straight edge before major shoots.

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UlfKrentz
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« Reply #6 on: September 26, 2012, 02:58:14 AM »
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I would recommend to get the Leaf Mamiya focus screen instead of fiddling around with masks. It has the proper lines in the glass that won´t slip around, get burned or whatever, not the cheapest way but worth the money in the end.

Cheers, Ulf
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RyuuzakiJulio
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« Reply #7 on: September 26, 2012, 03:13:25 AM »
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I would recommend to get the Leaf Mamiya focus screen instead of fiddling around with masks. It has the proper lines in the glass that won´t slip around, get burned or whatever, not the cheapest way but worth the money in the end.

Cheers, Ulf

That sounds nice. Do you have one? Is it brighter also? Could you post samples?
Thank you for your comment.

Cheers!

Ryu Cool
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UlfKrentz
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« Reply #8 on: September 26, 2012, 03:25:11 AM »
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Ryu, that mask came in original mamiya packaging which was marked "Focucing Screen RZ Type A" and an additional sticker W/36X48 frame. Not shure if there are brighter screens out there, but we felt comfortable with it. May be you can ask your local MamiyaLeaf dealer what kind of screens might be available, or perhaps Yaya will chime in.
Enjoy your kit!

Cheers

Ulf
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Anders_HK
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« Reply #9 on: September 26, 2012, 05:11:53 AM »
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@ Ryo,

You can also draw your frame lines using a fine sharpie pen. This is what I used on larger Bill Maxwell focus screens. Do be careful to draw only on the smooth side and not at very edges. It can however be cleaned off using alcohol or sensor cleaner. Amazing even can clean off so along with some abrasion as swiping using a soft tissue or sensor swab, even from uneven surface on Mamiya 645 focus screen (!), yet do avoid trying it on the uneven surface or at very edges of focus screen!!!

Whether attaching clear one on under side effects focus or not is a mystery, but why take the risk?

Best regards,
Anders

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RyuuzakiJulio
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« Reply #10 on: September 26, 2012, 07:15:17 AM »
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@ Ryo,

You can also draw your frame lines using a fine sharpie pen. This is what I used on larger Bill Maxwell focus screens. Do be careful to draw only on the smooth side and not at very edges. It can however be cleaned off using alcohol or sensor cleaner. Amazing even can clean off so along with some abrasion as swiping using a soft tissue or sensor swab, even from uneven surface on Mamiya 645 focus screen (!), yet do avoid trying it on the uneven surface or at very edges of focus screen!!!

Whether attaching clear one on under side effects focus or not is a mystery, but why take the risk?

Best regards,
Anders

Thank you for the MSG Andors,

So you have the maxwell bright screen? Is it really that much better? It's so hard to find actual reviews on it. Or even good comparation photos of it. Do you still have the original one? Wonder how much was it.

Thanks again!
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Anders_HK
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« Reply #11 on: September 26, 2012, 09:08:49 AM »
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@ Ryu,

I have Bill Maxwell Hi-Lux on my 4x5 Shen-Hao, and also had it on a custom made sliding adapter for MFDB to 4x5. How good is it? The Hi-Lux is bright enough for me to focus an image on even a bright sunny day as long as I kept the sun rays shining direct onto the groundglass (no darkcloth), though keep it shaded is even better. Very good product. How good is it compared to competitors? I do not know. All I can say it is very good indeed. Do a search and give him a telephone call. I believe it is very worthwhile and he can inform which of his version is best suited for RZ. The important is to see the best we can when capturing a photography.

For Hy6 I have the original focus screen which is already very bright.

Best regards,
Anders
« Last Edit: September 26, 2012, 09:11:12 AM by Anders_HK » Logged
Mr. Rib
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« Reply #12 on: September 26, 2012, 12:46:28 PM »
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From my experience, RZ screens are not that good for low light situations- I would buy a brightscreen (http://brightscreenstore.com/estore/?page_id=15#ecwid:category=1731964&mode=product&product=7379221)
I would recommend getting #5 (Large Horizontal Split Image Microprism) and of course, crop lines for your digital back.
-edit-
The brightscreens from brighscreenstore.com are better than bill maxwell ones- I don't know that from my own experience, but that was the general opinion from LuLa members when I investigated this subject.
« Last Edit: September 26, 2012, 01:00:36 PM by Mr. Rib » Logged
Anders_HK
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« Reply #13 on: September 26, 2012, 01:09:54 PM »
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As should be obvious my own search led me to that Maxwell was the best and brightest screens on market... Split image microprism sounds like a winner. Suggest you contact on what is available and price to compare them. Maxwell can provide any framlines you wish.
« Last Edit: September 26, 2012, 01:12:55 PM by Anders_HK » Logged
FredBGG
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« Reply #14 on: September 26, 2012, 10:35:22 PM »
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I wonder why Mamiya hasn't updated both viewfinders and screens for the RZ for working with digital backs.

They should also make a stitch back for it... hell it is a 6x7
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Aryan Aqajani
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« Reply #15 on: September 27, 2012, 12:00:19 AM »
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Check out my blog to see the review of Bill Maxwell Hi-Lux Brilliant Matte screen I have for my RZ67 Pro IID http://aryanaqajani.com/2012/05/bill-maxwell-hi-lux-brilliant-matte-screen-review/

I have no more issue whatsoever to get the focus right in every situation ( I have not used my digi back on it yet however, I'd ask him to make another one specifically for my back when I get an adapter plate).
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Aryan Aqajani - Photographer in Melbourne, Australia
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RyuuzakiJulio
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« Reply #16 on: September 27, 2012, 04:13:06 PM »
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Check out my blog to see the review of Bill Maxwell Hi-Lux Brilliant Matte screen I have for my RZ67 Pro IID http://aryanaqajani.com/2012/05/bill-maxwell-hi-lux-brilliant-matte-screen-review/

I have no more issue whatsoever to get the focus right in every situation ( I have not used my digi back on it yet however, I'd ask him to make another one specifically for my back when I get an adapter plate).

Wow, that's the only original / Maxwell comparison online that exists!
I couldn't find any other than this blog post, and then someone on earlier messages, posted a link to it.
And now the author shared it too.
Crazy.

What I was looking for some other samples, with more color and sharpness, this black and white photos with big grain don't feel any different, it might be just a camera angle against the glass.

Some photos with a point and shoot in manual even, or someone with a DSLR that could set it on manual as well with normal color and no photoshoping.

What back you have? I have the Leaf Aptus 22 and I love it.

BTW its a M mount (made for any Mamiya 645) and I could use the RZ67ProIID adapter plate to mount it on the RZ67ProII.
That plate is 800-900, and the other ones for V and H mount I think they go up to 1500.

Anyway if you could update that blog post with some fresh photos would be awesome!

=D
I'll call Bill and see how much he wants for one.
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Steve Hendrix
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« Reply #17 on: September 27, 2012, 05:01:22 PM »
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I wonder why Mamiya hasn't updated both viewfinders and screens for the RZ for working with digital backs.

They should also make a stitch back for it... hell it is a 6x7


There has been etched ground glass that displays digital capture imaging area for RZ for many years now.


Steve Hendrix
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Steve Hendrix
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Aryan Aqajani
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« Reply #18 on: September 27, 2012, 08:16:22 PM »
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Wow, that's the only original / Maxwell comparison online that exists!
I couldn't find any other than this blog post, and then someone on earlier messages, posted a link to it.
And now the author shared it too.
Crazy.

What I was looking for some other samples, with more color and sharpness, this black and white photos with big grain don't feel any different, it might be just a camera angle against the glass.

Some photos with a point and shoot in manual even, or someone with a DSLR that could set it on manual as well with normal color and no photoshoping.

What back you have? I have the Leaf Aptus 22 and I love it.

BTW its a M mount (made for any Mamiya 645) and I could use the RZ67ProIID adapter plate to mount it on the RZ67ProII.
That plate is 800-900, and the other ones for V and H mount I think they go up to 1500.

Anyway if you could update that blog post with some fresh photos would be awesome!

=D
I'll call Bill and see how much he wants for one.

That person who also shared that link earlier was me too! Just see my name and you'll notice that they are from the same person who happens to be me!

Anyway, as I said before, there is a huge improvement with Bill Maxwell Hi-Lux screen, at least two stops brighter than the original one! Those black and white photos were done with my Fuji X100 at ISO 3200 @f2 1/60s because the room was dark!!! Now, you can see what difference this screen can make regardless of these image be black and white or color! If the image showing Bill Maxwell screen is brighter than the other one, it does not mean that the camera angle has been changed or the room got brighter for whatever reason! I try to see if I can take more photos in colors for you!

I have Mamiya DM22 (Leaf Aptus-II 5) back however, never used it on my RZ yet!
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Aryan Aqajani - Photographer in Melbourne, Australia
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« Reply #19 on: September 28, 2012, 01:09:38 AM »
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Here you go my friend http://aryanaqajani.com/2012/05/bill-maxwell-hi-lux-brilliant-matte-screen-review/ updated with new color photos  Grin
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Aryan Aqajani - Photographer in Melbourne, Australia
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