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Author Topic: Check out Hartblei  (Read 3457 times)
ErikKaffehr
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« on: October 18, 2012, 12:39:00 AM »
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Hi,

Hartblei seems to make the impossible possible, check out their web site: http://www.hartblei.de/en/index.htm

They seem to be able to glue impossible combinations of lenses and backs in a high quality package.

I have no involvement with Hartblei, except having dreams about their products. Nice dreams!

Stefan Steib, the owner seems to be a very helpful, serious and knowledgeable person.

Best regards
Erik
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Brian Hirschfeld
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« Reply #1 on: October 20, 2012, 12:20:19 AM »
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Stefan is incredibly helpful and extreme knowledgable.

He sent me the camera, which I reviewed here:
http://brianhirschfeldphotography.com/2012/02/24/in-depth-review-of-the-hartblei-hcam-b1/

it is certainly something....

It's surprising how much resolution can be gotten out of some 35mm lenses (I tested with my IQ180) and they seemed to hold up rather well, which makes the debates about current 35mm camera lens lineups not being able to hold up to the newer 36mp+ 35mm cameras coming our way soon.
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Leica / Nikon / Hasselblad / Mamiya ~ Proud IQ180 owner
Stefan.Steib
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« Reply #2 on: October 23, 2012, 11:09:17 AM »
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 Smiley

if there are any questions about Hartblei I can answer- go ahead, Iīll try.

I can also make an announcement, we will have a new product available very soon.
This time we try to revolutionize Lighting. I only say HSS with a studio flash - 1/8000 sec at full power. 12 channel remote control/trigger.
Portable, LED daylight modelling , 700 flashes from one charge, Bowens standard mount. Set comes complete with an Alubox.
Price around 1000€.

http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.279341228844987.58918.122001131245665&type=1

The Mamiya RB/RZ-> M645 adapter is also approaching finalization now. We have enlarged the diameter of the helicoid
for better stability, I will have a  new prototype very soon and will post some sample images soon after.

And finally we are working on a new HCam too. Stay tuned !

Greetings from Germany
Stefan

Addition: The Flashes are on stock now and are tested by me. I will soon post some images with 1/8000 sec and similar stuff.
Give me some time, Iīm working on it.
« Last Edit: October 24, 2012, 01:16:55 PM by Stefan.Steib » Logged

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ErikKaffehr
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« Reply #3 on: October 23, 2012, 11:30:09 AM »
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Hi,

Sounds like a few more reasons to check out http://www.hartblei.de

;-) Erik ;-)

Smiley

if there are any questions about Hartblei I can answer- go ahead, Iīll try.

I can also make an announcement, we will have a new product available very soon.
This time we try to revolutionize Lighting. I only say HSS with a studio flash - 1/8000 sec at full power. 12 channel remote control/trigger.
Portable, LED daylight modelling , 700 flashes from one charge, Bowens standard mount. Set comes complete with an Alubox.
Price around 1000€.

http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.279341228844987.58918.122001131245665&type=1

The Mamiya RB/RZ-> M645 adapter is also approaching finalization now. We have enlarged the diameter of the helicoid
for better stability, I will have a  new prototype very soon and will post some sample images soon after.

And finally we are working on a new HCam too. Stay tuned !

Greetings from Germany
Stefan
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sam@
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« Reply #4 on: October 24, 2012, 03:31:46 AM »
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Hi

After a day shooting - some positive feedback for Hartblei.

Just wanted to add my experience:
My experience with Hartblei is limited to the proPsolution TSE Tripod Clamp Canon 17mm+24mm which I bought from Stefan in March this year.
I use it with my IDSMk3 and 5DMk3 for interiors and architectural work usually on the 17mm when I need that angle of view.

Clamp was sent OS and arrived quickly
I was really impressed with the quality / feel / weight of the thing when it arrived - it's nicely machined
Easy to use, smooth and makes stitching painless
Always enjoyed Stefan's posts and his service is personal and speedy

The build quality of this makes me consider more about an Hcam and Superrotators (along with the Cambo / Arca) for the future.
Although composing, focus and stitching continues to just be too easy and precise with the TSE lenses and live view.
An updated camera with 30-40mpx from Canon might be better again..

In short - the clamp works - therefore I love it!

Best regards
Sam
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Stefan.Steib
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« Reply #5 on: October 24, 2012, 11:23:18 AM »
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Sam

if you decide to take the way to an HCam any time later, here is my offer for all "short version" TS-E clamp (435,-€) users:
as we do a longer special version for the HCam also (595,-€) we will take back the short one and deliver you a long one (6,5 cm longer) so the HCam
can also rotate 90 degrees for Portrait and landscape shooting. Otherwise itīs identical, you can of course also use it for 35mm Canons.
This will be a bonus  of 160 € for all buyers until next year spring , alternatively all owners of a TS-E clamp can get the camera with a rebate of 160 €.

Promised.

Regards
Stefan
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simonstucki
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« Reply #6 on: October 24, 2012, 03:34:31 PM »
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Smiley

if there are any questions about Hartblei I can answer- go ahead, Iīll try.

I can also make an announcement, we will have a new product available very soon.
This time we try to revolutionize Lighting. I only say HSS with a studio flash - 1/8000 sec at full power.

what? if that came from someone else, I'd call b*** s*** but since it comes from you I'll wait and see Smiley
nice to hear that you are or have been working on interesting revolutionary products. it is just the time no to do exactly that I think there are so many interesting possibilities...
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Stefan.Steib
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« Reply #7 on: October 27, 2012, 06:04:26 PM »
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OK - after some days of testing here is the news - HSS works with 1/8000 sec out of the box (tested with my Canon5D MK2).

Simon I know, this is hard to believe, but IT DOES WORK !!!!

I need to get a Nikon D800 now and check the Nikon compatibility (there are 2 different trigger modules).
I have to admit the first time I fired the 1/8000 and it was an evenly lighted image I was dropping my jar to the floor and then dancing around like a derwisch........
I think this is a revolution and it will wipe away all other flash systems which donīt do this. Right now it only has 400 ws. but there will be more.

Iīll post images and hopefully some moving stuff and outdoors, but right now we have pretty ugly weather here with snowfalls today
or rain yesterday. So I could not try outside , not to speak of sunlight counterflashing.
It also has to be tested as how much the rolling shutter effect will be seen in Images with moving and flashed stuff.

Many things to test. Stay tuned !

Stefan

« Last Edit: October 27, 2012, 06:06:11 PM by Stefan.Steib » Logged

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gerald.d
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« Reply #8 on: October 28, 2012, 11:33:48 PM »
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Now that the pricing is out on the Alpa FPS, it's interesting to compare the two.

I have an HCam-B1 in Canon mount, and one advantage the HCam has over the FPS is its sliding back. For a fairer comparison, it probably makes sense to look at the HCam-B1i, which has a fixed back.

The B1i including the digital back adapter is $6839 at current exchange rates.

FPS is $8335, but, that just gets you the camera. You'll be adding quite a few things to that in order to get it working.

Price for a Phase One adapter is $1217, and the Canon mount adapter is $2061. Handgrip, which you'll probably want, is another $382.

I have to be honest and say that I felt the HCam was a little expensive for what it is, but obviously there's significant R&D costs in developing something like this, and volumes must be pretty low, so it is understandable.

However, looking at the price of the Alpa - $12,000 - $6839 for a B1i, or $8130 for the B1, actually seems pretty good value. Note that if you wanted to do a comparison between the FPS and the B1, then you'd have to add in another $1600 for the ground glass and focusing loupe.

At the end of the day, from my experience at Photokina, I have to say that if money was no option, I'd go with the FPS. This is a bit like a Lexus/Toyota comparison. Both cameras get the job done, though the Alpa is in a different class. But you do have to pay for it!

I'm fairly sure that the buzz around the FPS will get a lot more people interested in the capabilities of these cameras, and hopefully the market is big enough to support both solutions - Stefan really does deserve a lot of credit and success for what he's done with the HCam Smiley

Regards,

Gerald.
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Stefan.Steib
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« Reply #9 on: October 29, 2012, 04:44:24 PM »
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Hi Gerald

The good thing with this concept of HCam is the combinations of lenses are endless.
e.g. I am currently exploring the usable enlarger lenses, which are darn cheap, to be had anywhere and most of all
of splendid quality. There are worlds best Apoīs for those who really want to spend (Nikon EL Apo), the midrange classics like Apo rodagon or Apo Componon
or the longer standard largeformat Rodagon, S-Componon and El Nikkors. Helicoids are 100 € on Ebay, the results are stunning.

Of course I understand that manufacturers want to make as much profit as possible, but I made the concept of the HCam to break this attempt.
To use a Nikon lens you can adapt it with a Novoflex or Metabones or Kipon adapter to the Canon Mount. Maybe that is not as elegant as to switch a whole plate,
but itīs factor 10x cheaper and works perfectly.

This camera is a tool not a toy. It looks like a box and it is, we will never spend additional money to refine this to look "nice".

What I love is that Schneider copied our lenses (but I think they did not fully understand what we do......)
and now Alpa also confirms the HCam concept I think we have already planted our viruses.
I will watch this grow with a smile and I am glad if this is for the advantage of all photographers.

And - I have plenty more Ideas.......... the HSS thing is next, and it renders several more things useless (leaf shutters !). Still testing.

Greetings from Germany
Stefan
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ErikKaffehr
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« Reply #10 on: October 29, 2012, 04:57:24 PM »
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Hi Stefan,

Great work!

Would I be able to buy an MFDB, I would buy HCam. But I guess an MFDB is a bit out of reach, but dreams can be nice to have;-)

Best regards
Erik

Hi Gerald

The good thing with this concept of HCam is the combinations of lenses are endless.
e.g. I am currently exploring the usable enlarger lenses, which are darn cheap, to be had anywhere and most of all
of splendid quality. There are worlds best Apoīs for those who really want to spend (Nikon EL Apo), the midrange classics like Apo rodagon or Apo Componon
or the longer standard largeformat Rodagon, S-Componon and El Nikkors. Helicoids are 100 € on Ebay, the results are stunning.

Of course I understand that manufacturers want to make as much profit as possible, but I made the concept of the HCam to break this attempt.
To use a Nikon lens you can adapt it with a Novoflex or Metabones or Kipon adapter to the Canon Mount. Maybe that is not as elegant as to switch a whole plate,
but itīs factor 10x cheaper and works perfectly.

This camera is a tool not a toy. It looks like a box and it is, we will never spend additional money to refine this to look "nice".

What I love is that Schneider copied our lenses (but I think they did not fully understand what we do......)
and now Alpa also confirms the HCam concept I think we have already planted our viruses.
I will watch this grow with a smile and I am glad if this is for the advantage of all photographers.

And - I have plenty more Ideas.......... the HSS thing is next, and it renders several more things useless (leaf shutters !). Still testing.

Greetings from Germany
Stefan
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bohngy
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« Reply #11 on: October 30, 2012, 04:03:18 AM »
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I nearly fainted with excitement when I saw the Mamiya RZ - 645 adapter... Then I nearly fainted when I saw the price of it Sad

1200 euros! I know it's more complicated than yer average adapter with helicoid focussing etc, but yowsers!

does it have an electronic coupling to automatic diaphragm? that would help justify the price I suppose. 
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S@W
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« Reply #12 on: October 30, 2012, 07:09:15 AM »
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Hi Gerald

The good thing with this concept of HCam is the combinations of lenses are endless.
e.g. I am currently exploring the usable enlarger lenses, which are darn cheap, to be had anywhere and most of all
of splendid quality. There are worlds best Apoīs for those who really want to spend (Nikon EL Apo), the midrange classics like Apo rodagon or Apo Componon
or the longer standard largeformat Rodagon, S-Componon and El Nikkors. Helicoids are 100 € on Ebay, the results are stunning.

Stefan

I'm trying hard to find real benefits in the HCam. This cam maybe is a nice tool for a small sensor medium format user that also uses Canon gear.
Those guys can use their very nice T/S Canon lenses and get very nice results. But even then they should first manage to get the best 17 or 24mm T/S lens they could find. Following an Alpa resp.: Canon lenses are mass production lenses. They will never reach the QC of Rodie/Schneider lenses optimized by Alpa for their bodies. On 10 produced Canon lenses, this rep. thinks only 2 are top lenses, 3 will be 'good' only and 5 should be recalibrated...

FWIW using 'an endless combination of lenses' on my 40*54mm digital back is pointless. I just want a kit of 3 top glasses with T/S available. As I'm Nikon, buying an HCam + Canon T/S lenses is not economically viable. Using Nikon lenses with a image circle too short for my sensor is nonsense. Using Nikon T/S lenses may be a solution, but what about the quality? I really need to see a well made side by side comparison with Rodie/Schneider digitar lenses to check which level of quality is reached by thoses nikon lenses. Unfortunatelly those kind of tests are not available on the Hartblei web site. Why ?
« Last Edit: October 30, 2012, 07:10:47 AM by S@W » Logged
george2787
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« Reply #13 on: October 30, 2012, 07:52:41 AM »
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The flash system looks great! Shocked

Is there any chance of getting it with profoto mount?? maybe some workaround Undecided
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Stefan.Steib
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« Reply #14 on: October 30, 2012, 12:02:01 PM »
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Hi George

No Problem, the other alternative base mount is Comet (very common in Asia) and for this there are adapters for about any reflector system on the planet- also Profoto !

Just tell me at order and I will get this for you on special order.

regards
Stefan
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« Reply #15 on: October 30, 2012, 12:15:11 PM »
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for S@W

Quite simple - there are no 17mm lenses from Rodenstock or Schneider - so compare with what ?
The 24mm TS-E offers movements even on 80 MPix - the 23mm Rodenstock barely covers !
We do not need LCC nor a centerfilter nor chromaremovement - there is none needed.
Proof: here is a link to a full resolution 80 Mpix shot with an Aptus II 12R on the HCam with 17mm
Take a look and then tell me - compare with what ?

http://www.hcam.de/downloads/Leaf80Mpix_Canon17mmTSE.jpg

Wideangle is right now not really working on Viewcameras, Schneiderīs 24mm barely works with 40 Mpix, even their 28 or 35mm have ugly colorshifts.
Rodenstock is a bit better, but for the price of the 23mm you nearly get an HCam-B1 + a TS-E24mm.

I dare to say, actually the hightech Canon TS-E lenses with pressed aspherical glass are representing the top of technological devellopment in wideangle
neither Schneider nor Rodenstock have anything that only comes close,they are simply unable to build this kind of stuff, not to speak of their pricing.

It is fairly snobby to ignore the technological advances that have been made the last few years, especially when you even have not used these.
I agree the nikon PC-Eīs are not up to the task. Bad for Nikon users. Thatīs also the reason why we do not offer a Nikon mount.
The Bajonett is simply too small for the task and will vignette with movements on MF.

Regards
Stefan
« Last Edit: October 30, 2012, 12:22:03 PM by Stefan.Steib » Logged

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ErikKaffehr
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« Reply #16 on: October 30, 2012, 12:47:51 PM »
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;-) Not bad for a Japanese toy lens! ;-)

Best regards
Erik


for S@W

Quite simple - there are no 17mm lenses from Rodenstock or Schneider - so compare with what ?
The 24mm TS-E offers movements even on 80 MPix - the 23mm Rodenstock barely covers !
We do not need LCC nor a centerfilter nor chromaremovement - there is none needed.
Proof: here is a link to a full resolution 80 Mpix shot with an Aptus II 12R on the HCam with 17mm
Take a look and then tell me - compare with what ?

http://www.hcam.de/downloads/Leaf80Mpix_Canon17mmTSE.jpg

Wideangle is right now not really working on Viewcameras, Schneiderīs 24mm barely works with 40 Mpix, even their 28 or 35mm have ugly colorshifts.
Rodenstock is a bit better, but for the price of the 23mm you nearly get an HCam-B1 + a TS-E24mm.

I dare to say, actually the hightech Canon TS-E lenses with pressed aspherical glass are representing the top of technological devellopment in wideangle
neither Schneider nor Rodenstock have anything that only comes close,they are simply unable to build this kind of stuff, not to speak of their pricing.

It is fairly snobby to ignore the technological advances that have been made the last few years, especially when you even have not used these.
I agree the nikon PC-Eīs are not up to the task. Bad for Nikon users. Thatīs also the reason why we do not offer a Nikon mount.
The Bajonett is simply too small for the task and will vignette with movements on MF.

Regards
Stefan
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Stefan.Steib
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« Reply #17 on: October 30, 2012, 01:29:08 PM »
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@ bohngy

well for example we use the original Mamiya Bajonett mount we buy in Japan. Ask a mamiya service technician
how much these cost as spare parts, but we wanted the best possible fit, so the decision was easy. The helicoid will be
done on special CNC machinery with 5 (actually6) movements where 1 hour of production already costs a fortune.
The parts will be anodized at Zeiss Oberkochen to give the same semi matt finish we use on our lenses (BTW identical to the Hasselblad V
surfaces or very similar to what Leica uses for anodized black)
The number is 100 Pieces for the first production lot. You are invited to do it for less. But I am not Chinese, I live in Europe/Germany and
have to pay taxes, obey environment laws and need to eat. So thatīs the calculation we did.

And no there is no electrical connector, we donīt need this. The purpose is to use the RB-RZ Lenses with a 645 Pentax or Mamiya MF SLR or 35mm dslrs.

Regards
Stefan
« Last Edit: October 30, 2012, 01:32:14 PM by Stefan.Steib » Logged

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ErikKaffehr
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« Reply #18 on: October 30, 2012, 01:38:17 PM »
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Hi,

The same applies to the Chinese, too, I guess. It just that the conditions, laws and prices are a bit different.

Best regards
Erik



The number is 100 Pieces for the first production lot. You are invited to do it for less. But I am not Chinese, I live in Europe/Germany and
have to pay taxes, obey environment laws and need to eat. So thatīs the calculation we did.
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Stefan.Steib
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« Reply #19 on: October 30, 2012, 02:01:53 PM »
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Yes........  a bit Erik. 

 Roll Eyes
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