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Author Topic: v7 - Catalogs and image adjustments - big problem  (Read 4574 times)
jeanvalentin
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« Reply #20 on: November 23, 2012, 08:23:39 PM »
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How about asking the proper question? Would a "professional" prefer a backup that backs up everything (the catalogue) or a backup that doesn't back up everything (the xmp files)? ...


Well, I don't view this as backup (in the sense of long term storage). To me, this is "insurance". Just like backup gear. It's there in case of emergency. I guess you can make the argument that IDEALLY, everything will be backed up. But the minimum I NEED is something that will not make me loose hours of work. That means the image adjustments. EVERYBODY that uses C1 makes adjustments. Not everybody uses virtual copies (I never did).

The argument that "once catalogs improve" is laughable. Currently, even using sessions crashes ALL the time. I'm fed up with v7 so I will uninstall it and put back v6. This is the first time I've heard somebody claiming that their app will NEVER fail (or at least imply it) so you don't need that safety net.
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Valentin
lkuhlmann
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« Reply #21 on: November 24, 2012, 02:46:50 AM »
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I would like to ask a question Doug.  I've been trying to follow these discussions, which can get a little confusing.  The question: Can I create a Catalog, import a few thousand images, adjust and crop them, and then export the Catalog (images and all) to another medium?  Part two: Can I send that medium to another person, who can import and view my Catalog images with all their adjustments, metadata, and copyright info?
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When you export you create a copy of the raw file and the Capture One settings (subfolder). The export anyone can browse to (using a session), or re-import into a Catalog (including existing settings).

In short - yes.

-Lionel
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john beardsworth
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« Reply #22 on: November 24, 2012, 02:51:10 AM »
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Just because you never used a feature such as virtual copies isn't much of an argument. Do you never use LR's History steps? Not in xmp. Flags? Not in xmp. Collections, stacking, etc. You know what I'm going to say.... they're not in xmp either.

So, should C1 really implement sidecars as a similar placebo backup or go the full way and store all its equivalent features in xmp too, just in case you lose the hours you've put into variants, for example? So you're committing more development time to go into features for restoring that information? And what if you mistakenly restore from xmp? Or do humans NEVER fail? Well, LR has the history steps and you can step back to before the restore. Is C1 going to need a similar feature to be written? How many real features are we sacrificing now?

As with iView MediaPro, Aperture, Lightroom and other database-driven systems, the real backup is the backup of the catalog. If your machine is unstable, your safety net is making catalogue backups more often and sorting out the underlying problem.
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jeanvalentin
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« Reply #23 on: November 24, 2012, 08:51:10 AM »
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Just because you never used a feature such as virtual copies isn't much of an argument. Do you never use LR's History steps? Not in xmp. Flags? Not in xmp. Collections, stacking, etc. You know what I'm going to say.... they're not in xmp either. ...

As I mentioned in my previous post, ideally, everything would be written to XMP.

The fact remains that a RAW converter is just that: convert the RAW files, based on your adjustments, to JPEG. The bare minimum, all these adjustments should have the option to be written to the XMP. This option CURRENTLY exists when working with sessions so it's not some crazy expectation. Not only that, you can export your adjustments to XMP via the file menu which is not practical to do after each individual image. So, the capability is there, just make it automatic via the preferences like in sessions (well, the preference is there but it doesn't do it when using catalogs).
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Valentin
john beardsworth
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« Reply #24 on: November 24, 2012, 12:19:43 PM »
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We'll just have to agree to differ.
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jeanvalentin
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« Reply #25 on: November 24, 2012, 12:26:57 PM »
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We'll just have to agree to differ.

David said that as well, but here is my thinking. Disagree with what? Make it easier? The option is ALREADY there via the File -> Export.

That's the part I don't understand: why disagree to making it easier?
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Valentin
FredBGG
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« Reply #26 on: November 26, 2012, 03:41:50 AM »
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--
I would like to ask a question Doug.  I've been trying to follow these discussions, which can get a little confusing.  The question: Can I create a Catalog, import a few thousand images, adjust and crop them, and then export the Catalog (images and all) to another medium?  Part two: Can I send that medium to another person, who can import and view my Catalog images with all their adjustments, metadata, and copyright info?
--

When you export you create a copy of the raw file and the Capture One settings (subfolder). The export anyone can browse to (using a session), or re-import into a Catalog (including existing settings).

In short - yes.

-Lionel

Forget using a catalog for several thousand images. It is not solid enough to handle very large projects.
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john beardsworth
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« Reply #27 on: November 26, 2012, 07:39:17 AM »
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I put 20000 pictures into it without a problem. They were in their original location, not inside the catalog itself. Maybe you should review your hardware?
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Phil Indeblanc
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« Reply #28 on: November 27, 2012, 04:22:50 PM »
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I wonder if this relates to a question I just posted....

Quote
If I do a shoot in a Catalog and finish doing some processing/edits at one time....And then at a later time, if I access the files without the catalog, as in a Session view.....Will I see the little icons on the thumbnails/"Browser" showing which files I worked on?
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If you buy a camera, you're a photographer...
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