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Author Topic: Framing and focus assist for 8x10 camera using a compact  (Read 2190 times)
FredBGG
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« on: November 28, 2012, 12:25:05 PM »
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I'm working on a compact hack to make an electronic finder and focus assist for my 8x10.
We are trying to use a compact sony as an electronic viewfinder for my 8x10 and hacking the software to extract focus distance values.

The compact will sit ontop of the 8x10 lens. The monitor will be a Samsung Note and the app will give the assistant/photographer
bellows extension values. This is for a portrait project of mine using paper negatives. The face recognition in the compact will make things work nicely.
I'm also designing the app to adjust paralax based on the focus so as to give accurate framing.

I may be handing this off to Fuji as they have shown some interest in it.

This may be something that might work with a tech camera.... waddaya think....
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jsch
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« Reply #1 on: November 28, 2012, 02:06:40 PM »
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Hi Fred,

in 2009 I started portrait project on 8x10 inch b&w film. I've photographed around 90 people so far. In the beginning I was worried so I did similar things like you describe. I used a 5D Mark II with a 50/1.2L to complement the 8x10. After 40 people I stopped to use digital in parallel. It felt wrong. I played  a bit with the 5D and a 7 inch Marshal monitor to have a "digital" 8x10 in terms of the big viewfinder during the shot. In the end I use only the 8x10, a lens, a light meter and a few film holders (available or 1-2 lights). Everything else is distracting.

Best,
Johannes
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theguywitha645d
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« Reply #2 on: November 28, 2012, 03:01:40 PM »
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What you need is an 8x10 Gowlandflex:

http://www.petergowland.com/camera/history/

I wonder if you could not make something buy stacking two wooden 8x10 view cameras. Most compacts do not have distance encoders.
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Brian Hirschfeld
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« Reply #3 on: November 28, 2012, 03:05:19 PM »
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omg I want one of those.
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FredBGG
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« Reply #4 on: November 28, 2012, 03:12:15 PM »
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What you need is an 8x10 Gowlandflex:

http://www.petergowland.com/camera/history/

I wonder if you could not make something buy stacking two wooden 8x10 view cameras. Most compacts do not have distance encoders.

The Gowandflex won't take an 600mmm and focus close enough. Not even close enough for the 480mm..... unfortunately Cry Cry
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TMARK
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« Reply #5 on: November 28, 2012, 08:58:22 PM »
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What you need is an 8x10 Gowlandflex:

http://www.petergowland.com/camera/history/

I wonder if you could not make something buy stacking two wooden 8x10 view cameras. Most compacts do not have distance encoders.

While awesome in many respects, you need a latter to use the damn thing, and on he street it was all too cumbersome, except when I had it in full production with several assistants and the street blocked off.  It was cool, and in a studio he GFlex was fantastic.  For 810 I like an F2 with the auto shutter.  Fred's compact sounds awesome.  I've used video cameras on the GG before to varying degrees of success.  For 4x5 the Technika IV - MT's rangefinder works surprisingly well, but longer lens choices are limited due to he puny front standard and lack of bellows extension.

Fred, I dig it.
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andyptak
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« Reply #6 on: November 29, 2012, 02:44:19 PM »
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Fred, I've been hashing around something similar but less sophisticated than your idea, for my Cambo Tech camera.

I think something like this is badly needed and I'm surprised some genius hasn't come up with something yet. I keep getting hung up on the fact that Phase One backs use Firewire and nothing but nothing is going to connect to it - except an Apple computer - not even my effing iPad for God's sake!

I'm interested in your choice of the Samsung for a monitor - which size and how come? Thanks.
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FredBGG
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« Reply #7 on: November 29, 2012, 06:11:45 PM »
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Fred, I've been hashing around something similar but less sophisticated than your idea, for my Cambo Tech camera.

I think something like this is badly needed and I'm surprised some genius hasn't come up with something yet. I keep getting hung up on the fact that Phase One backs use Firewire and nothing but nothing is going to connect to it - except an Apple computer - not even my effing iPad for God's sake!

I'm interested in your choice of the Samsung for a monitor - which size and how come? Thanks.

It's a 5.5 HD Super AMOLED screen. Great color and black and white performance. 1280 x 720 res. Very power efficient.
It's expensive, but sort of free if it's also your phone.
Other reasons for choosing it is the quad core processor and it has IT management layers that can be used for remote tech support.
Really helps in the development phase if you decide to get fancy....

However being that this is really just a framing tool... sort of a rangefinder for my 8x10 screen quality isn't too important, but I'll be using it
for other things too.
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Nick-T
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« Reply #8 on: November 29, 2012, 06:55:37 PM »
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@Fred

This is silly. 10X8 is a complete waste of time you can get much better results with a D800.

These large format camera companies are basically trying into con people into believing that their cameras are better, some of them are not even made in Germany!

Nick-T
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jsch
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« Reply #9 on: December 01, 2012, 06:04:57 AM »
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@Fred

This is silly. 10X8 is a complete waste of time you can get much better results with a D800.

These large format camera companies are basically trying into con people into believing that their cameras are better, some of them are not even made in Germany!

Nick-T

Hi Nick-T,

it is the question how you define "better results". I would say images from especially 8x10 and smaller formats are different in many regards. There are things you can't get with the sensor size of MF and 35 mm. And there are things you can't do with 8x10. If you do a search in this forum you find longer explanations.

Best,
Johannes
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ctz
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« Reply #10 on: December 01, 2012, 10:00:01 AM »
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@Fred

This is silly. 10X8 is a complete waste of time you can get much better results with a D800.

These large format camera companies are basically trying into con people into believing that their cameras are better, some of them are not even made in Germany!

Nick-T

 Grin
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EricWHiss
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« Reply #11 on: December 02, 2012, 12:01:42 AM »
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@Fred

This is silly. 10X8 is a complete waste of time you can get much better results with a D800.

These large format camera companies are basically trying into con people into believing that their cameras are better, some of them are not even made in Germany!

Nick-T
Yes it's a conspiracy by the 8x10 makers.  Fred, Don't let those younger photographers be fooled by this!    Cheesy
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FredBGG
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« Reply #12 on: December 02, 2012, 12:16:02 PM »
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Wow 4 in a row!
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FredBGG
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« Reply #13 on: December 02, 2012, 12:24:30 PM »
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Jokes aside...



 Grin

$4000 D800+Lens VS $24,000 Hasselblad

http://www.luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=69391.0;attach=64261;image

 Grin

My second 8x10 camera cost me a grand total of $ 1,775
Toyo 8x10  $ 380
Schneider 480mm F 8.4 Symmar $ 1100
10 Dark slides $ 275

(Paper negatives cost me about $ 0.75 a shot including chems.)

And these are a few examples of what I have done with that lens and the 200x250mm "capture area" all straight out of camera.

These are Polaroids:











 Grin

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

These are new paper negatives.... I'm still figuring a lot of things out.... Huh

Crop to about 4x5 paper size no preflashing the paper:



8x10 no crop no pre flashing the paper, but processed with a water bath technique.



« Last Edit: December 02, 2012, 05:29:26 PM by FredBGG » Logged
haefnerphoto
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« Reply #14 on: December 02, 2012, 04:33:01 PM »
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Fred, those are awesome!!!!
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EricWHiss
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« Reply #15 on: December 02, 2012, 04:44:14 PM »
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Fred,
Nice to see a few different images from you.
Question: are you pre flashing your paper or using it straight?
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ctz
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« Reply #16 on: December 02, 2012, 04:44:54 PM »
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Jokes aside, very good work.
Congrats!
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FredBGG
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« Reply #17 on: December 02, 2012, 05:14:16 PM »
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Edited the post... some are Polaroid....

Only these are paper negative:

Crop to about 4x5 paper size no preflashing the paper and peacock blue lee filter:



8x10 no crop no pre flashing the paper, but processed with a water bath technique.



I thought I'd try water bath technique first to control contrast.
It works quite well as you can see from the second shot.

However it takes a bit to long to be practical for many shots.
What I do is repeated water baths so that the shadows develop faster than the highlights.
I develop for about 20 seconds and then do a no agitation water bath.
During the water bath only the developer infused in the paper is present.
The high light areas eat the available developer very quickly and stop developing
while the shadow areas are not as greedy and they continue developing.
After the water bath I put the paper into a diluted second developer bath
so as to sloooowly bring the midtones up. It's fun to see this all fade up on the paper.
I only wish I had negative vision Wink

Oh ... and these two were scanned at home with an all in one cheap ass scanner/printer....

I'll have to scan them again at the studio
« Last Edit: December 02, 2012, 05:27:03 PM by FredBGG » Logged
FredBGG
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« Reply #18 on: December 02, 2012, 05:23:01 PM »
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Next experiment will be pre flashing paper.
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Nick-T
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« Reply #19 on: December 02, 2012, 05:33:34 PM »
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Preflash to lower contrast right? (It's been 25 years since I did this)

I remember doing this  for my boss we printed dodging with a piece of card every few seconds and when devved used the time next to the last 9(just) visible strip for the preflash duration.

Nick-T
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